The Labour Party

[urban genie]

The means of production being the collective work of humanity, the product should be the collective property of the race. Individual appropriation is neither just nor serviceable. All belongs to all. All things are for all , since all have need of them, since all have worked in the measure of their strength to produce them, and since it is not possible to evaluate every one's part in the production of the world's wealth.
All things are for all. Here is an immense stock of tools and implements; here are all those iron slaves which we call machines, which saw and plane, spin and weave for us, unmaking and remaking, working up raw matter to produce the marvels of our time. But nobody has the right to seize a single one of these machines and say, "This is mine; if you want to use it you must pay me a tax on each of your products," any more than the feudal lord of medieval times had the right to say to the peasant, "This hill, this meadow belong to me, and you must pay me a tax on every sheaf of corn you reap, on every rick you build."
All is for all! If the man and the woman bear their fair share of work, they have a right to their fair share of all that is produced by all, and that share is enough to secure them well-being. No more of such vague formulas as "The Right to work," or "To each the whole result of his labour." What we proclaim is The Right to Well-Being: Well-Being for All!



Should be the mantra of the labour party, amongst other quotes I could post.



Btw the above isn't a socialist belief before the usual politically uneducated on here classify it as typical far left nonsnece.

 

[Rascal]

The means of production being the collective work of humanity, the product should be the collective property of the race. Individual appropriation is neither just nor serviceable. All belongs to all. All things are for all , since all have need of them, since all have worked in the measure of their strength to produce them, and since it is not possible to evaluate every one's part in the production of the world's wealth.
All things are for all. Here is an immense stock of tools and implements; here are all those iron slaves which we call machines, which saw and plane, spin and weave for us, unmaking and remaking, working up raw matter to produce the marvels of our time. But nobody has the right to seize a single one of these machines and say, "This is mine; if you want to use it you must pay me a tax on each of your products," any more than the feudal lord of medieval times had the right to say to the peasant, "This hill, this meadow belong to me, and you must pay me a tax on every sheaf of corn you reap, on every rick you build."
All is for all! If the man and the woman bear their fair share of work, they have a right to their fair share of all that is produced by all, and that share is enough to secure them well-being. No more of such vague formulas as "The Right to work," or "To each the whole result of his labour." What we proclaim is The Right to Well-Being: Well-Being for All!



Should be the mantra of the labour party, amongst other quotes I could post.



Btw the above isn't a socialist belief before the usual politically uneducated on here classify it as typical far left nonsnece.

It is a nice bit of Anarcho-Syndicalism.

Count me in ;)

 

[urban genie]

It is a nice bit of Anarcho-Syndicalism.

Count me in ;)

Kropotkin from conquest of bread, think Arnacho-communism is my prefered slant of ideals ultimately

As for Anarcho-sydicalism pfft the splitters.;-)

 

[Rascal]

Kropotkin from conquest of bread, think Arnacho-communism is my prefered slant of ideals ultimately

As for Anarcho-sydicalism pfft the splitters.;-)

Shush, dont say the C word, you will have some on here having kittens.

I have not read any Kropotkin, perhaps i should.

 

[urban genie]

Shush, dont say the C word, you will have some on here having kittens.

I have not read any Kropotkin, perhaps i should.

I hadn't until a few years ago, when I was reading an article about marxism and anarchism and the split in ideals of Marx and Bakunin whose methods for a socialist state took different paths.

Kropotkin was mentioned so I read up on him and his merging of both mens thinking along with his belief that a shared co-operative of the workforce way to run a socialist society over a one party state controled by only those at the top of the party as would lead to dictactorship and betray the aims of the ideology (as we saw play out in soviet union tbf).

Kropotkin was a proponent of a decentralised socialist society free from central government and based on voluntary associations of self-governing communities and worker-run enterprises, an ex Russian prince he renounced his title aged 13 after reading up on republicanism turned disitdent got jailed and for a while eventually settled in Brighton while in exile.

He was no fan of lenin who equally considered him with distain at times and his stance on WW1 where he belived ultimate victory over germany was necessary and so ooenly backed the allies, which was seen as betraying his anarchist beliefs.

Not all of his writings I agree with, but the emphasis of the people not a select committee or group having the power appeals to me, also his stance on money and distribution of wealth.

 

[Rascal]

I hadn't until a few years ago, when I was reading an article about marxism and anarchism and the split in ideals of Marx and Bakunin whose methods for a socialist state took different paths.

Kropotkin was mentioned so I read up on him and his merging of both mens thinking along with his belief that a shared co-operative of the workforce way to run a socialist society over a one party state controled by only those at the top of the party as would lead to dictactorship and betray the aims of the ideology (as we saw play out in soviet union tbf).

Kropotkin was a proponent of a decentralised socialist society free from central government and based on voluntary associations of self-governing communities and worker-run enterprises, an ex Russian prince he renounced his title aged 13 after reading up on republicanism turned disitdent got jailed and for a while eventually settled in Brighton while in exile.

He was no fan of lenin who equally considered him with distain at times and his stance on WW1 where he belived ultimate victory over germany was necessary and so ooenly backed the allies, which was seen as betraying his anarchist beliefs.

Not all of his writings I agree with, but the enthasis of the people not a select committee or group having the power appeals to me, also his stance on money and distribution of wealth.

I have ordered the Conquest of Bread.

Cheers pal.

 

[trumpton]

Kropotkin from conquest of bread, think Arnacho-communism is my prefered slant of ideals ultimately

As for Anarcho-sydicalism pfft the splitters.;-)

Nice post, but I haven't got a clue what any of that means. Think I need to do some more reading ;-)

 

[Vic]

Kropotkin from conquest of bread, think Arnacho-communism is my prefered slant of ideals ultimately

As for Anarcho-sydicalism pfft the splitters.;-)

I thought it was Adam Smith.

Oh, no. I got it mixed up with:

"As soon as the land of any country has all become private property, the landlords, like all other men, love to reap where they never sowed, and demand a rent even for its natural produce. The wood of the forest, the grass of the field, and all the natural fruits of the earth, which, when land was in common, cost the labourer only the trouble of gathering them, come, even to him, to have an additional price fixed upon them. He must then pay for the licence to gather them; and must give up to the landlord a portion of what his labour either collects or produces."

 

[urban genie]

Nice post, but I haven't got a clue what any of that means. Think I need to do some more reading ;-)

Anarchist communism stresses egalitarianism and the abolition of social hierarchy and class distinctions that arise from unequal wealth distribution, the abolition of capitalism and money, and the collective production and distribution of wealth by means of voluntary associations. In anarchist communism, the state and property no longer exist. Each individual and group is free to contribute to production and to satisfy their needs based on their own choice. Systems of production and distribution are managed by their participants


Way ahead of where we are as a society unfortunately

 

[stonerblue]

Even when he (temporarily), got the Henrietta's and Rupert's from Glasto to
sing his name, when he came up against probably the most ineffective PM ever, he was still shy of 50 plus seats in the subsequent election.
He was poison for Labour, particularly amongst traditional Labour supporters,
his main followers were the middle class, southern urbanites who love to champion the cause of a 'Working Class' they understand nothing about.

Not like you to use derogatory stereotypes

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Not like you to use derogatory stereotypes

No, it's much more like you lot.

 

[stonerblue]

No, it's much more like you lot.

What fucking 'lot' would that be then?

 

[ganganvince]

Strong leadership or suppression of free speach?

Nottingham East Labour CLP chair suspended after Corbyn motion row - BBC News

A Jewish Labour member said he felt the atmosphere in the meeting was so "hostile" he had to leave.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Fame Monster]

Strong leadership or suppression of free speach?

Nottingham East Labour CLP chair suspended after Corbyn motion row - BBC News

A Jewish Labour member said he felt the atmosphere in the meeting was so "hostile" he had to leave.

www.bbc.co.uk

If the hostility on this forum is anything to go by, you can't help but feel sympathy for many Jewish members at these CLP meetings when the topic of Corbyn's antisemitism comes up. It must be like turning up in Waco with an arrest warrant for David Koresh.

 

[blueinsa]

If the hostility on this forum is anything to go by, you can't help but feel sympathy for many Jewish members at these CLP meetings when the topic of Corbyn's antisemitism comes up. It must be like turning up in Waco with an arrest warrant for David Koresh.

To be fair they are all really really nice right up to the point you don't fully agree with them.

It's only then they turn a bit sour.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Strong leadership or suppression of free speach?

Nottingham East Labour CLP chair suspended after Corbyn motion row - BBC News

A Jewish Labour member said he felt the atmosphere in the meeting was so "hostile" he had to leave.

www.bbc.co.uk

Both?

 

[urban genie]

If the hostility on this forum is anything to go by, you can't help but feel sympathy for many Jewish members at these CLP meetings when the topic of Corbyn's antisemitism comes up. It must be like turning up in Waco with an arrest warrant for David Koresh.

My experience of CLP meetings is about the same 5 people turning up talking a bit on local party issues, having some tea n biscuits and going home. About an hr or two long and very dull.

Hence why the hundreds of them that go on are never reported, only the ones that seem to be contraversal.

 

[Hart of the Matter]

My god, these hard left types are wordy bastards.
Perhaps that's the problem.

 

[Rascal]

My god, these hard left types are wordy bastards.
Perhaps that's the problem.

You mean eloquent.

 

[Hart of the Matter]

You mean eloquent.

Eloquent, certainly, concise, not.
Really enjoy your missives and always gives me food for thought. Shame you feel outside the party. I have differing views to you but you speak to the heart but my head says otherwise.