The Conservative Party

[bluethrunthru]

The Govt already stops people speaking via the Prevent Program as part of its anti-terrorism strategy, it’s aim is to ‘counter terrorist ideology and challenging those who promote it’. This inevitably has been used to stop or deter Muslim speakers in some cases. Is the Govt going to fine itself for stopping these people from speaking at Universities, or is it simply the Govts way of determining which radicalism is okay in the name of ‘free speech’ and which isn’t? Is radical Christianity okay, but radical Islam not okay? Is the Govt going to insist, on penalty of a fine, that Holocaust denial is okay in the interests of ‘free speech’, but acceptable to deny ‘free speech’ to a speaker arguing the case for the Palestinian people on the grounds it may ‘radicalise’ people?

seems that rather than tackling the issues around universities and students paying for but not getting /using proper lectures and accommodation Williamson thinks its the job of his department to protect the rights of Holocaust deniers to deny the Holocaust.......anyone any ideas as to what Govt disasters he is trying to deflect attention from or is he really launching a Tommy Robinson charter?

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

The Govt already stops people speaking via the Prevent Program as part of its anti-terrorism strategy, it’s aim is to ‘counter terrorist ideology and challenging those who promote it’. This inevitably has been used to stop or deter Muslim speakers in some cases. Is the Govt going to fine itself for stopping these people from speaking at Universities, or is it simply the Govts way of determining which radicalism is okay in the name of ‘free speech’ and which isn’t? Is radical Christianity okay, but radical Islam not okay? Is the Govt going to insist, on penalty of a fine, that Holocaust denial is okay in the interests of ‘free speech’, but acceptable to deny ‘free speech’ to a speaker arguing the case for the Palestinian people on the grounds it may ‘radicalise’ people?

Depends if you want young people to grow up respecting British culture, values and historical achievements or whether you want to create another Salman Abedi. Up to you which you want on your conscience.

 

[aguero93:20]

Universities and their students in widespread left of centre political outlook shocker.

Quick, act horrified and kick around a point scoring political football so that we can return to the nineties, er, no, er, eighties, er, no, er, seventies, er, no, sixties, er, no, ...... hang on, when was this golden age of university campus' and students not being generally skewed towards what would be considered left of centre?

(That's not to say that there aren't examples of stupidity or shouting down of views that have been incorrect/wrong, in my view. But if you think that there was a golden age where students wouldn't shout down people from certain parts of the political spectrum, you are uninformed. Some of the students doing the shouting down often go on to become relatively right wing politicians, so I wouldn't worry too much that it's heralding a queer, communist, godless revolution - unless you are swallowing the culture war koolaid)

I for one am looking forward to geography undergrads getting to listen equally to both the round and flat earth schools of thought.

 

[BobKowalski]

Depends if you want young people to grow up respecting British culture, values and historical achievements or whether you want to create another Salman Abedi. Up to you which you want on your conscience.

Which historical achievements? The use of concentration camps in South Africa? The partition of India? The Bengal famine? The Irish famine?

How about we just teach history, the good, the bad and the ugly? Or is that too ‘radical’ and possibly risking a Govt fine?

 

[BobKowalski]

seems that rather than tackling the issues around universities and students paying for but not getting /using proper lectures and accommodation Williamson thinks its the job of his department to protect the rights of Holocaust deniers to deny the Holocaust.......anyone any ideas as to what Govt disasters he is trying to deflect attention from or is he really launching a Tommy Robinson charter?

Personally, I think it’s more deflection than real policy. It’s clickbait ‘culture war’ politics for the Mail and Telegraph readers.

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

Which historical achievements? The use of concentration camps in South Africa? The partition of India? The Bengal famine? The Irish famine?

How about we just teach history, the good, the bad and the ugly? Or is that too ‘radical’ and possibly risking a Govt fine?

Only seems to be about the bad and the ugly these days, no wonder things like this result. The reduction of colonialism to a cherry picked selection of dark events is no less radical or regressive in the education of youngsters than what a minority are spewing their bile against now, because they have the privilege to do so far beyond what they would be allowed to do in pretty much any other country.

When the system can't be trusted to provide a balanced and objective education then checks and balances need to be implemented. No different to people who complain about this but want tougher action on social media companies who don't clamp down on racism or trump.

Anyway, your first line was so disrespectfully disingenuous so I've done myself a disservice dignifying the rest.

 

[jma]

If, as reported on this thread, a university exists where there are no Conservative supporting students, no young Tories association and anyone who doesn't hold left wing views is purged from the campus, then yes, I've changed my mind and there is obviously cause for the government to step in.

Of course though, it could be a load of bollocks story where the reader is expected to believe that someone intelligent enough to study for a masters is dumb enough to believe that they go to a university with no conservatives.

 

[Rascal]

If, as reported on this thread, a university exists where there are no Conservative supporting students, no young Tories association and anyone who doesn't hold left wing views is purged from the campus, then yes, I've changed my mind and there is obviously cause for the government to step in.

Of course though, it could be a load of bollocks story where the reader is expected to believe that someone intelligent enough to study for a masters is dumb enough to believe that they go to a university with no conservatives.

Yeah all those lefty types ruining universities.

All you have to do is look at who has President of the Oxford Union on their CV

Johnson
Gove
Hague
Duncan
Gyimah
Kate Wilson ( TPA)
Green
Moynihan
Hesletine
Rees-Mogg senior
Heath

The only left winger any note i can find is Michael Foot in 1933.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

Tories this morning

''We want every nation at war (Civil or otherwise) to hold a ceasefire so that everyone can get vaccinated. After that they can get back to killing each other again.''

The madness that is Conservative policies.

 

[Rascal]

Only seems to be about the bad and the ugly these days, no wonder things like this result. The reduction of colonialism to a cherry picked selection of dark events is no less radical or regressive in the education of youngsters than what a minority are spewing their bile against now, because they have the privilege to do so far beyond what they would be allowed to do in pretty much any other country.

When the system can't be trusted to provide a balanced and objective education then checks and balances need to be implemented. No different to people who complain about this but want tougher action on social media companies who don't clamp down on racism or trump.

Anyway, your first line was so disrespectfully disingenuous so I've done myself a disservice dignifying the rest.

Why is looking at some of the disgusting things the British Empire did disrespectful?

It is a fact we raped and pillaged our way around the world, exploited nations, fought wars and subjagated peoples in the name of the Monarch but in real terms because of the greed of the capitalists.

It should be taught warts and all, so we never make the same horrible mistakes again. Surely the more you know about your country the greater the patriot you are. Or do you not want to know that the country you live in were horrible cunts who thought nothing of starving millions, killing millions and exploiting millions of people?

It wasn't you responsible, it wasn't me responsible, but our forefathers were utter cunts. Painting a rosy picture of British history serves nobody any favours, so be objective and teach the lot. Teach students Churchill was a great leader, but he was also a racist ****, teach students we spread democracy, but also exploited the countries we spread democracy too.

We should not be ashamed of admitting our history is chequered, we did great things and we did dreadful things, we had some great historical figures and we had some bastards.

Only by teaching everything can it be balanced.

 

[Ban-jani]

Well if she’s doing a masters in law, I’m not surprised she’s not met an advocate of this particular government to be fair! ;)

On communication, absolutely. That’s why I have such an issue with this government though (as plenty of centrist conservatives do too). They’re so bad at justifying their position and seeking to avoid scrutiny that their motives always have to be questioned. If they had a decent argument, they wouldn’t need to be as deliberately disingenuous as they always are.


On the third paragraph, what the university should do, and they do do, is be clear on who their lecturers are and what their teachings on the subject will cover. It’s higher education, they should not follow a set criteria, that’s not what the good universities in particular are there for. You enrol at Oxford because you want to hear Dawkins thoughts specifically for example.

It isn’t in university’s interests to take it to the extreme, people just won’t go and it goes against their own principles of independent thought and what academia is in general.

The question is ultimately who do you believe is best placed to ensure minimal political influence in further education - the academics or the political power in charge at the time. Like I said, there’s a reason even conservatives are critical of increasing political influence in this space and see it as a non issue.

Why is your font getting bigger and bigger haha?

I didn’t mean her meeting Tories, I meant someone with conservative views which is actually a criticism of the Tories as over the last two/three decades, they have shifted towards liberalism.

But they’re not introducing political influence, other than policing campuses to ensure everyone is getting to speak and being heard and I think it’s very much needed. You’ve already admitted there is legislation in place to stop extremism, so you must somewhat agree with the state intervening.

Which Tories are against it?

 

[Ban-jani]

The Govt already stops people speaking via the Prevent Program as part of its anti-terrorism strategy, it’s aim is to ‘counter terrorist ideology and challenging those who promote it’. This inevitably has been used to stop or deter Muslim speakers in some cases. Is the Govt going to fine itself for stopping these people from speaking at Universities, or is it simply the Govts way of determining which radicalism is okay in the name of ‘free speech’ and which isn’t? Is radical Christianity okay, but radical Islam not okay? Is the Govt going to insist, on penalty of a fine, that Holocaust denial is okay in the interests of ‘free speech’, but acceptable to deny ‘free speech’ to a speaker arguing the case for the Palestinian people on the grounds it may ‘radicalise’ people?

What in God’s name is radical Christianity and how is in manifest in British society?

I can’t wait to hear this.

And what Muslim speakers didn’t get to speak that deserved to, with the state itself stopping them?

 

[Ban-jani]

horrible cunts who thought nothing of starving millions, killing millions and exploiting millions of people?

To be fair this describes Marxism in practice to a tee

 

[Vic]

If, as reported on this thread, a university exists where there are no Conservative supporting students, no young Tories association and anyone who doesn't hold left wing views is purged from the campus, then yes, I've changed my mind and there is obviously cause for the government to step in.

Of course though, it could be a load of bollocks story where the reader is expected to believe that someone intelligent enough to study for a masters is dumb enough to believe that they go to a university with no conservatives.

And no one from a public school, hotbeds of leftie radicals.

 

[Vic]

Why is your font getting bigger and bigger haha?

I didn’t mean her meeting Tories, I meant someone with conservative views which is actually a criticism of the Tories as over the last two/three decades, they have shifted towards liberalism.

But they’re not introducing political influence, other than policing campuses to ensure everyone is getting to speak and being heard and I think it’s very much needed. You’ve already admitted there is legislation in place to stop extremism, so you must somewhat agree with the state intervening.

Which Tories are against it?

Non-conservative Tories.

A bit of revisionism there already.

If you think Tories are now liberals you must mean she hadn't met any obvious fascists.

 

[Ban-jani]

If, as reported on this thread, a university exists where there are no Conservative supporting students, no young Tories association and anyone who doesn't hold left wing views is purged from the campus, then yes, I've changed my mind and there is obviously cause for the government to step in.

Of course though, it could be a load of bollocks story where the reader is expected to believe that someone intelligent enough to study for a masters is dumb enough to believe that they go to a university with no conservatives.

And here we go, the left wing way, get personal and start calling people dumb. I know your snide comment about our kid is to try and get an angry reaction from me but you’ve just outed yourself as the idiot.

I didn’t say she claims there are no conservatives, I said she’d a) never met one and b) never heard an opinion from one

So no, you’re the dumb one, for failing to read and process basic English.

Can we also distinguish the fact that being a conservative or having those views doesn’t automatically mean you’re a Tory? I am and I haven’t voted for them in the last two times of asking.

I know you like to play identity politics and shove everyone in to boxes but it’s not accurate.

 

[Ban-jani]

Non-conservative Tories.

A bit of revisionism there already.

If you think Tories are now liberals you must mean she hadn't met any obvious fascists.

Why is it? You can tell you don’t hear from people with conservative views very often if you think there aren’t a huge number of conservative thinkers who are fed up with the Tories.

Just look at Peter Hithens for one, of many, he doesn’t even vote and wants the Tory party broken up.

It’s not revisionism, it’s the same as socialists abandoning Labour.

You really ought to broaden your horizons Vic.

The Tories are liberal, very much so. What conservative social policies have they introduced since 2010?

 

[Ban-jani]

And no one from a public school, hotbeds of leftie radicals.

Redirect Notice

www.google.co.uk

 

[Ban-jani]

@Vic

I hate to be the one to tell you but left wing politics is now a middle class movement.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

Why are you introducing it into debate then when it's obvious that despite her not meeting one they exist? It might be the case that they're not in her class or just don't bring it up in conversation.
Law students are by a large minority female, this will be even more evident at postgrad level.

Entry trends

Demographic information about entrants to the solicitors' profession.

www.lawsociety.org.uk

Young Conservatives are more likely to be male. Perhaps that's just a factor. Most intelligent women don't have the same sense of arrogance that stereotypically young men have to bring up seemingly unsavoury views to a progressive audience. I wouldn't expect to hear someone start talking about "There's only 2 genders" , we need to bring back corporal punishment or get people picking up litter for their benefits in serious conversation amongst mere acquaintances.

General election: who will win the youth vote? | YouGov

Age will be a key dividing line in the 2019 general election

yougov.co.uk

"For both men and women under 30, Labour has a clear lead. But young women are much more likely to vote for Labour (60%) than young men (44%).

The Conservatives are in the opposite situation, with the backing of 26% of young men and only 15% of young women – a figure likely to alarm those within the party keen to shake-off the perception that Boris Johnson has a ‘woman problem’."