Running thread

[Stuuuuuu]

Plenty of people break down in tears at the end, it’s emotional mate truly. I cried running through the bronx on my NYC run, girlfriend rang me to see how I was doing, she couldn’t fly out to it, and I admit I was a wreck. I’d just seen my son who was out supporting me at 16 miles so was teary as it was then she rang to encourage and I just went for a bit. It’s the best and worst of feelings at the same time.

This is what I'm like at the end of a marathon too mate. Since being a kid, the only times I've ever cried were at my grandma's funeral and every time I completed the London Marathon!

 

[Stuuuuuu]

Question , how many times a week do I need to run and how far if I want to move up to a full marathon ?, sore today so I’m going to ride a marathon on my bike .

In the name of laziness, I'm going to paste something that I wrote elsewhere:

MARATHON TRAINING BASICS
Of course, everyone has different goals, aims, time available etc. so not everything in here will apply equally for everyone. I will aim my advice on a typical runner who wants to run the whole way at a fairly comfortable pace.
Here are the basics for completing a marathon…

Warming up: It’s good practice to treat the first mile or two of any run as a warm-up. It takes me about 2 miles to settle in but it’s different for different people. You could do a few drills such as high knees, kicking yourself in the bum with your heels and lunges. I like to do some leg swings and stuff like that (dynamic stretches) before going out. I won’t go into too much detail – you’ll easily find some pre-run warm-ups and dynamic stretches online. It’s important that you DO NOT do static stretches before a run. Static stretches are when you hold a stretch for x number of seconds. These have been found to be detrimental to performance and could even lead to injury.

Weekly mileage: key to preparing for a marathon is to establish a high weekly running mileage. This will, of course, build up gradually but for the few weeks leading up to the race, I would aim to run at least 30 miles per week where possible. Those aiming for a faster time would want to aim higher.

The long slow run (LSR): this is probably the single most important run. You should aim to do one LSR (with the emphasis on the S) every week. Gradually build up the distance by 5-10% (no more) most weeks. Don’t push too much or you risk injury/burnout. Received wisdom is that every 3rd or 4th week should be a ‘cutback week’ where you lower the distance to a comfortable one so your body can adapt to, and recover from, the long miles that you’ve been putting in. When doing your LSR, you should be in the ‘easy’ or ‘aerobic’ zones on your Garmin and you should be able to maintain a conversation in full sentences. If not, then you’re going too fast. Building up aerobic fitness is essential for a marathon and it can be hard to keep to a slow pace but it’s vitally important that you do.

Easy and ‘recovery’ runs: the idea of ‘active recovery’ has only very sketchy evidence to support it but it’s still worth doing easy runs throughout the week to build up your cumulative mileage. Coaches often recommend easy runs on the days after harder workouts ‘to get used to running on tired legs.’ Run at a similar pace to LSR but for a much shorter and easier distance.
Harder workouts: for those looking for a PB or to improve their times, it’s worth doing some speed work. I will discuss types of speed work now.

Intervals: these are basically periods of fast running broken up by periods of easy jogging or walking to recover. Here are two popular approaches (but there are loads of other ways of doing it as well).
1) 10 x 400 metres (400 metres are roughly equivalent to ¼ of a mile). Following a warm-up of a mile or two, run fast for 400 metres then slow right down to recover. Repeat so that you have completed this cycle up to 10 times.
2) The second approach (which has some good science to support it) is to run 4 lots of 4 minutes at pace. For newer runners, it will take time to get to this stage so you might want to do shorter sprints at first and gradually build it up.

Threshold runs: known as ‘the marathon runner’s best friend,’ the technical info behind these is quite sciency but basically it means running in a high gear for a bit. Typically, you would run for 20-40 minutes at ‘threshold’ pace on your Garmin. If you don’t have a Garmin, a commonly-used guide is to run at the pace that you could maintain for one hour. But only do it for 20-40 minutes. It’s believed that threshold runs increase the distance that you can run at pace – perfect preparation for a marathon.

Target pace running: some coaches and runners like to spend some time running at their target pace. The thing is, this doesn’t really have much aerobic benefit and it’s not at threshold so I can’t see a lot of value in it. People say that it helps them to get used to their target pace, so fair enough if it suits them.

The taper: for 1-3 weeks before a race (depending on your running background), it’s important to taper your training. This allows you to get over any niggles and – more importantly – it allows your liver and muscles to build up their glycogen stores which you have depleted from doing so much running. A three-week taper is usually recommended for new runners. You would maintain your quantity and intensity of runs; just reduce the distance by about 15-30% week by week.

Strength training: this is an optional extra, but a really good thing to do if you have the time. Deadlifts, squats, calf raises and so on can give you a significant advantage and reduce the chance of injury. There’s loads to find online. Do it 2 or 3 times per week.

Fuelling: As it gets closer to the race, I would try out my fuelling strategy on a few runs. Gels are good but they can play havoc with people’s guts so maybe test them out. I find KMC NRG (Kendal Mint Cake) to be the most stomach-friendly. I also like Nakd bars – these are extremely calorific as they are predominantly made from dates. I sometimes use Clif Bloks – the ones with caffeine. I don’t normally have caffeine in things like coffee but it is an excellent ‘cheat’ on race day because it dulls the leg pain and enables you to keep going.

Recovery: forget about wasting your time on Epsom salts, ice baths and lying with your legs against the wall and all that crap; the main thing to aid recovery is to eat a decent meal fairly soon after you finish your run. Protein for muscle repair and carbs to replace lost energy.
Top tip: there’s good scientific evidence that eating blueberries can speed up recovery. You could also now do some static stretches if you want. If you don’t, I won’t tell anyone so don’t worry.

So the quick version: warm up, do a weekly LSR, get your weekly mileage up (but not too much at once), do some interval/threshold runs if you want, eat after running. Everything else is an optional extra.

Note: I’ve referred to using Garmin zones a couple of times. This assumes that you have entered your resting and max. heart rates correctly into your Garmin.

 

[Tommy_Catons_Perm]

This is what I'm like at the end of a marathon too mate. Since being a kid, the only times I've ever cried were at my grandma's funeral and every time I completed the London Marathon!

How many times did you do London marathon. Did you always qualify with good for age time? I ran London once and qualified through good for age. The qualification marathon was probably the highlight of my running career. The London marathon though was a bit of a disaster, but that's another story......

I knew most of your marathon advice, but regretfully did not always stick to the rules. Too many junk miles by me. Discipline with the plan is important..

I didn't know about the warm ups. I will take heed.....

 

[Glenn Ponder]

In the name of laziness, I'm going to paste something that I wrote elsewhere:

MARATHON TRAINING BASICS
Of course, everyone has different goals, aims, time available etc. so not everything in here will apply equally for everyone. I will aim my advice on a typical runner who wants to run the whole way at a fairly comfortable pace.
Here are the basics for completing a marathon…

Warming up: It’s good practice to treat the first mile or two of any run as a warm-up. It takes me about 2 miles to settle in but it’s different for different people. You could do a few drills such as high knees, kicking yourself in the bum with your heels and lunges. I like to do some leg swings and stuff like that (dynamic stretches) before going out. I won’t go into too much detail – you’ll easily find some pre-run warm-ups and dynamic stretches online. It’s important that you DO NOT do static stretches before a run. Static stretches are when you hold a stretch for x number of seconds. These have been found to be detrimental to performance and could even lead to injury.

Weekly mileage: key to preparing for a marathon is to establish a high weekly running mileage. This will, of course, build up gradually but for the few weeks leading up to the race, I would aim to run at least 30 miles per week where possible. Those aiming for a faster time would want to aim higher.

The long slow run (LSR): this is probably the single most important run. You should aim to do one LSR (with the emphasis on the S) every week. Gradually build up the distance by 5-10% (no more) most weeks. Don’t push too much or you risk injury/burnout. Received wisdom is that every 3rd or 4th week should be a ‘cutback week’ where you lower the distance to a comfortable one so your body can adapt to, and recover from, the long miles that you’ve been putting in. When doing your LSR, you should be in the ‘easy’ or ‘aerobic’ zones on your Garmin and you should be able to maintain a conversation in full sentences. If not, then you’re going too fast. Building up aerobic fitness is essential for a marathon and it can be hard to keep to a slow pace but it’s vitally important that you do.

Easy and ‘recovery’ runs: the idea of ‘active recovery’ has only very sketchy evidence to support it but it’s still worth doing easy runs throughout the week to build up your cumulative mileage. Coaches often recommend easy runs on the days after harder workouts ‘to get used to running on tired legs.’ Run at a similar pace to LSR but for a much shorter and easier distance.
Harder workouts: for those looking for a PB or to improve their times, it’s worth doing some speed work. I will discuss types of speed work now.

Intervals: these are basically periods of fast running broken up by periods of easy jogging or walking to recover. Here are two popular approaches (but there are loads of other ways of doing it as well).
1) 10 x 400 metres (400 metres are roughly equivalent to ¼ of a mile). Following a warm-up of a mile or two, run fast for 400 metres then slow right down to recover. Repeat so that you have completed this cycle up to 10 times.
2) The second approach (which has some good science to support it) is to run 4 lots of 4 minutes at pace. For newer runners, it will take time to get to this stage so you might want to do shorter sprints at first and gradually build it up.

Threshold runs: known as ‘the marathon runner’s best friend,’ the technical info behind these is quite sciency but basically it means running in a high gear for a bit. Typically, you would run for 20-40 minutes at ‘threshold’ pace on your Garmin. If you don’t have a Garmin, a commonly-used guide is to run at the pace that you could maintain for one hour. But only do it for 20-40 minutes. It’s believed that threshold runs increase the distance that you can run at pace – perfect preparation for a marathon.

Target pace running: some coaches and runners like to spend some time running at their target pace. The thing is, this doesn’t really have much aerobic benefit and it’s not at threshold so I can’t see a lot of value in it. People say that it helps them to get used to their target pace, so fair enough if it suits them.

The taper: for 1-3 weeks before a race (depending on your running background), it’s important to taper your training. This allows you to get over any niggles and – more importantly – it allows your liver and muscles to build up their glycogen stores which you have depleted from doing so much running. A three-week taper is usually recommended for new runners. You would maintain your quantity and intensity of runs; just reduce the distance by about 15-30% week by week.

Strength training: this is an optional extra, but a really good thing to do if you have the time. Deadlifts, squats, calf raises and so on can give you a significant advantage and reduce the chance of injury. There’s loads to find online. Do it 2 or 3 times per week.

Fuelling: As it gets closer to the race, I would try out my fuelling strategy on a few runs. Gels are good but they can play havoc with people’s guts so maybe test them out. I find KMC NRG (Kendal Mint Cake) to be the most stomach-friendly. I also like Nakd bars – these are extremely calorific as they are predominantly made from dates. I sometimes use Clif Bloks – the ones with caffeine. I don’t normally have caffeine in things like coffee but it is an excellent ‘cheat’ on race day because it dulls the leg pain and enables you to keep going.

Recovery: forget about wasting your time on Epsom salts, ice baths and lying with your legs against the wall and all that crap; the main thing to aid recovery is to eat a decent meal fairly soon after you finish your run. Protein for muscle repair and carbs to replace lost energy.
Top tip: there’s good scientific evidence that eating blueberries can speed up recovery. You could also now do some static stretches if you want. If you don’t, I won’t tell anyone so don’t worry.

So the quick version: warm up, do a weekly LSR, get your weekly mileage up (but not too much at once), do some interval/threshold runs if you want, eat after running. Everything else is an optional extra.

Note: I’ve referred to using Garmin zones a couple of times. This assumes that you have entered your resting and max. heart rates correctly into your Garmin.

Great info there @Stuuuuuu. Bookmarked that for when I start my training in a few months.
Ran my one and only marathon in 2019 and really wasn't prepared for it. Started training late, had a couple of injuries and was away with work a few times right before the race. Looking back at my preparation and it was awful - couple of HMs, one 30k and really low weekly mileage.
Ran 4:14:00 so looking to take at least half an hour off that this time round.

 

[Stuuuuuu]

How many times did you do London marathon. Did you always qualify with good for age time? I ran London once and qualified through good for age. The qualification marathon was probably the highlight of my running career. The London marathon though was a bit of a disaster, but that's another story......

I knew most of your marathon advice, but regretfully did not always stick to the rules. Too many junk miles by me. Discipline with the plan is important..

I didn't know about the warm ups. I will take heed.....

Six times so far mate but I'm nowhere near GFA; I'm just a fun runner.

That's brilliant that you got a GFA.

 

[Tommy_Catons_Perm]

Six times so far mate but I'm nowhere near GFA; I'm just a fun runner.

That's brilliant that you got a GFA.

Nice one. Just thought you might be a perennial qualifier with regular sub 3 hours like my mate that I trained with for a few years. I saw trained with, more like trail in his wake gasping and suffering...:(

 

[supercity88]

I can put my name on the list as a cryer after a marathon too! Went from couch to marathon in 6-7months back in 2015/16 which was really stupid in hindsight.

Trained properly, following a plan. But did a half marathon in the Feb and pushed too hard so ended up injured and only making it up to 16miles in training before the London Marathon in the April.

Got to 16 miles doing alright, around 2hrs25 but then my hip was in agony. Actually had to find my mrs and take some painkillers (which did nothing). If it wasn't for it being the London Marathon and that crowd, I would have quit.

Struggled round in 4hrs35 in pieces and just was an overwhelming emotion at the end. Happiness, sadness, pain, exhaustion... tears couldn't be held back!

This time around I am heeding to the advice of a slow and steady increase in mileage. Racing myself and no one else, and trying to do a bit of yoga and leg strength work to help all round mobility.

Still setting targets and PBs but mainly running as a way to keep the weight off and for enjoyment. Finding it a lot better as a result.

Good luck to all those training for a marathon. It truly is a fantastic experience and a real achievement regardless of time.

 

[Tommy_Catons_Perm]

I can relate to that London Marathon experience. It was 2014 and I also nearly quit after getting injured in the first two miles with a strange dead leg type cramp that I sometimes get about every two years. Just bad luck it was on marathon day. I limped round in about 4.5 hours.

When I finished there a few missed messages on the phone from my pal who finished in sub 3 hours as normal. I rang him.to exchange stories and find out Liverpool v City score. He said well, it was 2-2....but Liverpool just scored and it's 3-2 now. Great. It then took about two hours to get back to my hotel in Greenwich, when I met the family and collapsed, dehydrated, sunburned, and pissed off. !

 

[The Salford lad.]

Alright "The Salford Lad" this may be a daft question but where in Salford do you live ?

I’m in Tyldesley now next door to little hulton and Boothstown but from the Precinct

 

[SuperKevinHorlock]

I’m in Tyldesley now next door to little hulton and Boothstown but from the Precinct

Near to me are you in any local running clubs? I run for Atherton Running Club which is a great club.

 

[The Salford lad.]

Near to me are you in any local running clubs? I run for Atherton Running Club which is a great club.

I’m not in any clubs , can’t really commit as I work away a lot , do you run the Loop line at all ?

 

[Stockton Heath Blue]

Did a really nice 8m run with a little bit of everything - flat, hills, road, canals, trails.

Stunning morning for it in sunny Cheshire - Spring in the air and lots of birdsong.

Managed 8:25 pace at a HR of 139. Felt like one of my easiest runs in months despite 2 days of cycling Friday/Saturday.

Looking forward to the BMV HM next week although I’m not running for a time just want to be sub 2 hours.

 

[SuperKevinHorlock]

I’m not in any clubs , can’t really commit as I work away a lot , do you run the Loop line at all ?

Sometimes on the loop line we are spoilt around here though loads of great trails the club runs every Tuesday and Thursday night at 6.30pm you are always welcome to come for a run pal if you are home.

 

[SuperKevinHorlock]

Had a lovely trail run around Haigh Hall today well it was supposed to be but my running mates got mixed up- ended up running around Wigan as well.....sure those people with Wigan fc shirts on were only about to give me ptsd about the cup final

 

[franksinatra]

Nice easy 13k today. Intention was to go for longer but wore a pair of newish trail running shoes and sadly suffered a lot of rubbing on the arch of the foot. Couple of blisters now. Not sure why but these trainers are not agreeing with me.

Still lovely day out there and thoroughly enjoyable.

 

[GornikDaze]

Nice easy 13k today. Intention was to go for longer but wore a pair of newish trail running shoes and sadly suffered a lot of rubbing on the arch of the foot. Couple of blisters now. Not sure why but these trainers are not agreeing with me.

Still lovely day out there and thoroughly enjoyable.

Did you have them on the wrong feet? ;)

 

[franksinatra]

Did you have them on the wrong feet? ;)

It certainly felt like it. The trainers had decent reviews as well in Runners World. Lesson learned stick to the brands you trust.

 

[Glenn Ponder]

It certainly felt like it. The trainers had decent reviews as well in Runners World. Lesson learned stick to the brands you trust.

What are they Frank?

 

[franksinatra]

What are they Frank?

Decathlon MT Cushion. Usually wear either Solomons Alphacross or Nike Air Zoom Pegasus on todays route without any problems. Love Decathlon stuff so after hearing the positive reviews gave them a go.

 

[Glenn Ponder]

Decathlon MT Cushion. Usually wear either Solomons Alphacross or Nike Air Zoom Pegasus on todays route without any problems. Love Decathlon stuff so after hearing the positive reviews gave them a go.

I bought a pair of Nike Air Zoom Pegasus 36 trail last month and had pain on the arch of my right foot after the first few runs. Think it was a case of me not being used to harder lugs but they've softened up lately and I'm loving them now.