Religion

[MaineDAWG2008]

It’s the same with religion adherents, let alone scholars.

the list of rules laid down in the bible for instance that are not adhered to, off the top of my head:
no tattoos
No mixed material clothes
Women should not speak till told they can
No shellfish

There’s endless

But then it boils down to the objective morality or subjective morality. Who sets this? U mention about clothing and women... well history will tell us, women weren't allowed to wear skirts before. Same with homosexuality, it was banned even here in UK. And then u have incest relationships. Some states have banned this in USA. The list is endless.

In Belgium i think the age of consent to have sex is 14 still - last time I checked. There are other countries also where the age is 15. But in UK that law was 12 before.

So question is who sets the morality? Humans? What can be OK for u, is not OK for some.

I hope u understand what im trying to argue on here...

 

[Marklr]

cant blame god mate for murderers, kiddie fiddlers etc. Its humans. We have been given that freewill. But knowing all that, any sin u commit u gotta pay for the sin. And in atheist view its u pay for it now (jail sentence) which is BS. U seen the conditions of some jails. Fed 3 times a day, its almost considered a summer camp in some camps.

Most faiths believe ur gnna feel the wrath of gods punishment in the afterlife.

So, do you believe murders should NOT pay for it now? That we should leave it to this god to punish them in some "afterlife"?
Didn't your god create all? If so, then he created evil too. He created the concepts. And he knew exactly which of us would carry out such "sins".
Face it, mate...none of the bible makes any sense. You might as well give up now.

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

So, do you believe murders should NOT pay for it now? That we should leave it to this god to punish them in some "afterlife"?
Didn't your god create all? If so, then he created evil too. He created the concepts. And he knew exactly which of us would carry out such "sins".
Face it, mate...none of the bible makes any sense. You might as well give up now.

The King James Bible makes 'perfect' sense if you consider it was essentially written in a way to allow the control of the great illiterate unwashed by the clergy who were essentially controlled by/part of the ruling classes.

 

[Marklr]

But then it boils down to the objective morality or subjective morality. Who sets this? U mention about clothing and women... well history will tell us, women weren't allowed to wear skirts before. Same with homosexuality, it was banned even here in UK. And then u have incest relationships. Some states have banned this in USA. The list is endless.

In Belgium i think the age of consent to have sex is 14 still - last time I checked. There are other countries also where the age is 15. But in UK that law was 12 before.

So question is who sets the morality? Humans? What can be OK for u, is not OK for some.

I hope u understand what im trying to argue on here...

Like you say, morality changes with the times. It's forever evolving as society evolves too. The bible's morals are set in stone. Stuck in an age that is irrelevant to us now.

 

[Marklr]

The King James Bible makes 'perfect' sense if you consider it was essentially written in a way to allow the control of the great illiterate unwashed by the clergy who were essentially controlled by/part of the ruling classes.

In that way, yeah. As a word of any god though, it can't be easily dismissed as even the first few paragraphs are scientifically inaccurate. I mean...the Earth was made before the Sun? This god didn't even know which order they came?

 

[Trevor Morley's Tache]

In that way, yeah. As a word of any god though, it can't be easily dismissed as even the first few paragraphs are scientifically inaccurate. I mean...the Earth was made before the Sun? This god didn't even know which order they came?

Also, the bible give an approximation of the Earth's age as between 6000 and 10000 years old which completely discounts the dinosaurs.

 

[MaineDAWG2008]

So, do you believe murders should NOT pay for it now? That we should leave it to this god to punish them in some "afterlife"?
Didn't your god create all? If so, then he created evil too. He created the concepts. And he knew exactly which of us would carry out such "sins".
Face it, mate...none of the bible makes any sense. You might as well give up now.

happy to continue this discussion. So u know the story about adam and eve. And how they sinned with the bad apple and so on. So as u can see, from the start, we have been given free will. How we live our life is down to us. And we get that one chance only. So what u do in this life, will have consequences in the after life.

Now your point about "should murderers NOT paying for it now?" Well the same can be said about those whom have got away with their evil crimes. Should they not pay for it in their afterlife?

Most obvious, OJ Simpson, Tony Blair, G W Bush, etc etc. The latter of the two waged a war based on lies and greed. Who will pay for those who lost their lives in Iraq, Or how about under Stalins watch. Or hitler. They have to face the penalty. And thats the beauty of it.

We have all sorts in our society, killers, murderers, peados, dictators, etc. And those that commit such atrocity it clear states will feel the wrath of punishment in the hereafter. We have gods laws, and as humans we can use those to punish them ourselves, but there is punishment afterwards I assure u. God knows everything. No1 is getting away with shit lets just say

 

[metalblue]

Like you say, morality changes with the times. It's forever evolving as society evolves too. The bible's morals are set in stone. Stuck in an age that is irrelevant to us now.

Religion was a good way of keeping “law and order” before we had laws and a way of enforcing them.

If only a lot of people hadn’t also died in the “name” of religion then I’d probably say it was great at the time. But they did, so on balance it’s been a bit shit really.

 

[metalblue]

happy to continue this discussion. So u know the story about adam and eve. And how they sinned with the bad apple and so on. So as u can see, from the start, we have been given free will. How we live our life is down to us. And we get that one chance only. So what u do in this life, will have consequences in the after life.

Now your point about "should murderers NOT paying for it now?" Well the same can be said about those whom have got away with their evil crimes. Should they not pay for it in their afterlife?

Most obvious, OJ Simpson, Tony Blair, G W Bush, etc etc. The latter of the two waged a war based on lies and greed. Who will pay for those who lost their lives in Iraq, Or how about under Stalins watch. Or hitler. They have to face the penalty. And thats the beauty of it.

We have all sorts in our society, killers, murderers, peados, dictators, etc. And those that commit such atrocity it clear states will feel the wrath of punishment in the hereafter. We have gods laws, and as humans we can use those to punish them ourselves, but there is punishment afterwards I assure u. God knows everything. No1 is getting away with shit lets just say

The crusades say hi

 

[MaineDAWG2008]

Also, the bible give an approximation of the Earth's age as between 6000 and 10000 years old which completely discounts the dinosaurs.

So i read, but the torah or the quran said nothing of the sorts. Torah states from one verse that its way older than 6000 years. And Quran states 4 billion or so. But im basing that on hearsay, need to research on that myself.,

 

[MaineDAWG2008]

Religion was a good way of keeping “law and order” before we had laws and a way of enforcing them.

If only a lot of people hadn’t also died in the “name” of religion then I’d probably say it was great at the time. But they did, so on balance it’s been a bit shit really.

another example about the laws of today:

Consensual incest is fully legal in Spain, Russia, and is not strictly prohibited under Portuguese law.

Now u tell me, are the laws in this world all subjective? Ofcourse they are.

And as said in my previous post regarding age of consent for sex is 14 in Belgium.

A couple of good examples i would say. And it backs up my argument that we should resort to gods laws and not mans laws. As humans we all have different interpretations of what is good and what isn't. And there is no better one to guide us then the creator himself. :-)

Again just spilling out my knowledge and understanding on this thread. Not preaching ... if it may sound like it, i apologise in advance.

 

[Marklr]

happy to continue this discussion. So u know the story about adam and eve. And how they sinned with the bad apple and so on. So as u can see, from the start, we have been given free will. How we live our life is down to us. And we get that one chance only. So what u do in this life, will have consequences in the after life.

Now your point about "should murderers NOT paying for it now?" Well the same can be said about those whom have got away with their evil crimes. Should they not pay for it in their afterlife?

Most obvious, OJ Simpson, Tony Blair, G W Bush, etc etc. The latter of the two waged a war based on lies and greed. Who will pay for those who lost their lives in Iraq, Or how about under Stalins watch. Or hitler. They have to face the penalty. And thats the beauty of it.

We have all sorts in our society, killers, murderers, peados, dictators, etc. And those that commit such atrocity it clear states will feel the wrath of punishment in the hereafter. We have gods laws, and as humans we can use those to punish them ourselves, but there is punishment afterwards I assure u. God knows everything. No1 is getting away with shit lets just say

But this god created the apple and left it there for temptation. This god made humans that are weak to temptation. What games was this god playing? Give us "free will" then kills everybody for using it. Killed millions of innocent children too.
So you DO believe we shouldn't punish murderers and just let this god deal with them in some afterlife, of which there is no evidence of?

 

[Marklr]

I might just study law so when I get to this afterlife, I can sue this god for crimes against humanity.

 

[Phil1]

Aww bless, people still talking about God as though he's a real thing.

 

[Marklr]

Aww bless, people still talking about God as though he's a real thing.

It's a real subject, and religion is still an issue today.

 

[Phil1]

It's a real subject, and religion is still an issue today.

Only for deluded lunatics.

 

[JASR]

But then it boils down to the objective morality or subjective morality. Who sets this? U mention about clothing and women... well history will tell us, women weren't allowed to wear skirts before. Same with homosexuality, it was banned even here in UK. And then u have incest relationships. Some states have banned this in USA. The list is endless.

In Belgium i think the age of consent to have sex is 14 still - last time I checked. There are other countries also where the age is 15. But in UK that law was 12 before.

So question is who sets the morality? Humans? What can be OK for u, is not OK for some.

I hope u understand what im trying to argue on here...

I'm not sure what you are arguing.

All I was arguing/saying is that , for example, Christians have a book called the Bible, which is meant to be how they live there lives, either via direct statements or parables.

If it's not about how Christians are to lead their lives, then what is it? And why aren't they all adhering to it completely?

If it's meant to be 'God's' word to human's, then why has it been re-written, cut, pasted innumerable times by multiple human's over 1.5 millenia, and contains more inconsistencies and downright simulataneous black=white and black#white statements than Maguire's explanation of what happened on his holidays?

It's a complete farce, which is hidden in plain sight, and falls down at the 1st sign of probing.

It is however, among many other 'things', a great placebo and/or excuse to get away with stuff.

 

[Elbow beards]

happy to continue this discussion. So u know the story about adam and eve. And how they sinned with the bad apple and so on. So as u can see, from the start, we have been given free will. How we live our life is down to us. And we get that one chance only. So what u do in this life, will have consequences in the after life.

Now your point about "should murderers NOT paying for it now?" Well the same can be said about those whom have got away with their evil crimes. Should they not pay for it in their afterlife?

Most obvious, OJ Simpson, Tony Blair, G W Bush, etc etc. The latter of the two waged a war based on lies and greed. Who will pay for those who lost their lives in Iraq, Or how about under Stalins watch. Or hitler. They have to face the penalty. And thats the beauty of it.

We have all sorts in our society, killers, murderers, peados, dictators, etc. And those that commit such atrocity it clear states will feel the wrath of punishment in the hereafter. We have gods laws, and as humans we can use those to punish them ourselves, but there is punishment afterwards I assure u. God knows everything. No1 is getting away with shit lets just say

If god is omniscient, than there can be no free will for man, because he knows beforehand who will do what, when and where. Therefore it was already preordained that Hitler would do what he did, thus condemning him to hell from the start. He basically didn't have a leg to stand on. Should we therefore be lenient on murders? No because this concept of an all powerful God is just bollocks.

 

[denislawsbackheel]

Aww bless, people still talking about God as though he's a real thing.

another example about the laws of today:

Consensual incest is fully legal in Spain, Russia, and is not strictly prohibited under Portuguese law.

Now u tell me, are the laws in this world all subjective? Ofcourse they are.

And as said in my previous post regarding age of consent for sex is 14 in Belgium.

A couple of good examples i would say. And it backs up my argument that we should resort to gods laws and not mans laws. As humans we all have different interpretations of what is good and what isn't. And there is no better one to guide us then the creator himself. :-)

Again just spilling out my knowledge and understanding on this thread. Not preaching ... if it may sound like it, i apologise in advance.

What you are spilling out is anything but knowledge and understanding.
It is utter nonsense.

 

[snorky]

If god is omniscient, than there can be no free will for man, because he knows beforehand who will do what, when and where. Therefore it was already preordained that Hitler would do what he did, thus condemning him to hell from the start. He basically didn't have a leg to stand on. Should we therefore be lenient on murders? No because this concept of an all powerful God is just bollocks.

I knew you were going to say that :)