Neil Young demands Spotify remove his music.

i respect Neil Young greatly for this, it was never about 'winning' this situation - it was making a stand.

Joe Rogan is a fucking idiot and his 4 hour podcast with that loon Jordan Peterson this week was a disgrace. I mean they got into a discussion about whether people can be 'technically black' or not. That's a discussion I had with mates when we were stoned at about the age of fucking 14....
 
I've heard his name but have no idea who Rogan is and certainly haven't listened to him. I just googled him and certainly don't agree with some of his or his guests' reported views on covid. But if i listened to him on other subjects then there might be things he says that I do agree with.

I agree that Spotify should, as other platforms do, warn listeners against blatant misinformation that flies in the face of well-established evidence. But when you start with one party demanding total deplatforming of someone who holds the opposing view to you, then you're looking at going down a rabbit hole frankly.

And many of Young's fans may absolutely agree with his views but he's denied those with Spotify accounts the chance of listening to his music. That's plain wrong in my opinion.

He’s got the right to choose how people consume his music, he shouldn’t be forced to be on Spotify if he doesn’t want to be either.
 
Showing my age a bit (and lack of culture...) but I've honestly never heard of Neil Young.

776th most listened to artist on Spotify so I would assume there's a lot of people who haven't heard of him either.

Ive never heard of the vast majority of the top 200 on that list. Stopped scrolling at that point.

Now thats showing age
 
He’s got the right to choose how people consume his music, he shouldn’t be forced to be on Spotify if he doesn’t want to be either.
Absolutely, but trying to dictate what else people are allowed to listen to doesn't feel right. I respect his right to flounce off and take his ball home though.
I wonder how his stance has affected listening figures for the Rogan podcasts he objects to? My guess is thousands of folk who otherwise had no interest in Rogan will have now checked it out out of curiosity.
 
He’s got the right to choose how people consume his music, he shouldn’t be forced to be on Spotify if he doesn’t want to be either.
He has that right, absolutely. But it still concerns me that he thinks he has the right to dictate how and what other consume. Because it's potentially a short step from there to things like book burning. Young specifically asked Spotify to choose between him and Rogan and that's wrong in my view.

Joni Mitchell took a more measured approach, in which she avoided the 'him or me' scenario but referred to the open letter written by a large group of scientists and medical people. Open Letter

In its final paragraph, that says "We, the undersigned doctors, nurses, scientists, and educators thus call on Spotify to immediately establish a clear and public policy to moderate misinformation on its platform." That's a much more nuanced approach, requesting them to moderate any misinformation, an approach I 100% agree with. Spotify do have a moderation policy; it's not a free-for-all and I think they probably got that Malone episode wrong. That's not to say they should censor it completely but should make it clear, as Facebook and Twitter did with Trump, that's it's a very contentious view that appears to be unsupported by evidence.

Rogan himself has claimed he's not anti-vax but he believes that the young and healthy don't need the vaccine https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56948665 Note that he explicitly says this: "I'm not a doctor," he said. "I'm not a respected source of information, even for me."

I'm a great believer in critical thinking, where people review ALL the available data or opinions then come to their own view. I don't agree with the view that "He's wrong, and because he's wrong, while there's an opportunity to listen to him (whether you want to or not) you can't listen to me."
 
I've heard his name but have no idea who Rogan is and certainly haven't listened to him. I just googled him and certainly don't agree with some of his or his guests' reported views on covid. But if i listened to him on other subjects then there might be things he says that I do agree with.

I agree that Spotify should, as other platforms do, warn listeners against blatant misinformation that flies in the face of well-established evidence. But when you start with one party demanding total deplatforming of someone who holds the opposing view to you, then you're looking at going down a rabbit hole frankly.

And many of Young's fans may absolutely agree with his views but he's denied those with Spotify accounts the chance of listening to his music. That's plain wrong in my opinion.
I mean there's no-one in the world that's signed up to a 12-month contract with Spotify. I pay to subscribe, and I could cancel it tomorrow and replace it with Tidal to get access to his music if I wanted.

In fact, I think that's one of the reasons for people leaving Spotify. Yes, there's the argument about whether you want your money contributing to Joe Rogan's podcast, but there's also the massive amount of advertising this has caused for every rival they have. From what I've read, Tidal is basically the same price, better quality, and pays the artists more. The only reason I haven't switched purely based on that is because it's a minor faff.
 
Absolutely, but trying to dictate what else people are allowed to listen to doesn't feel right. I respect his right to flounce off and take his ball home though.
I wonder how his stance has affected listening figures for the Rogan podcasts he objects to? My guess is thousands of folk who otherwise had no interest in Rogan will have now checked it out out of curiosity.

It does if it’s deliberate misinformation. Bear in mind he withdrew his initial letter and instead just asked his record company to get his music removed.

On your second point, they may well have done. Thousands have also cancelled their Spotify accounts, as they all still have the choice to listen to what they want to. Just like Young has the choice of which platforms his music is available on.
 
Absolutely, but trying to dictate what else people are allowed to listen to doesn't feel right. I respect his right to flounce off and take his ball home though.
I wonder how his stance has affected listening figures for the Rogan podcasts he objects to? My guess is thousands of folk who otherwise had no interest in Rogan will have now checked it out out of curiosity.

I can't watch Alex Jones Infowars or David Icke for comedy value on YouTube anymore.


Why is Rogan a special case?

Because he makes a shit tonne of money and generates lots of traffic?

Rogan can continue to exist, but in the fringes with the other confirmed lunatics.
 
Spotify do have a moderation policy; it's not a free-for-all and I think they probably got that Malone episode wrong. That's not to say they should censor it completely but should make it clear, as Facebook and Twitter did with Trump, that's it's a very contentious view that appears to be unsupported by evidence.
This is part of the issue with online platforms though more generally. Time and time again we see them platforming and promoting things that would get any traditional media outlet into deep shit, because they're actually regulated. Publishing dangerous lies gets people killed. That's why even the worst newspapers have to be careful. It doesn't matter if he's open about his ignorance on a topic. That's just a get out of jail free card which he uses to then spend 3 or 4 hours talking ignorantly about it for an audience for vast amounts of money.
 
I can't watch Alex Jones Infowars or David Icke for comedy value on YouTube anymore.


Why is Rogan a special case?

Because he makes a shit tonne of money and generates lots of traffic?

Rogan can continue to exist, but in the fringes with the other confirmed lunatics.




I hardly say fringes
 
He has that right, absolutely. But it still concerns me that he thinks he has the right to dictate how and what other consume. Because it's potentially a short step from there to things like book burning. Young specifically asked Spotify to choose between him and Rogan and that's wrong in my view.

Joni Mitchell took a more measured approach, in which she avoided the 'him or me' scenario but referred to the open letter written by a large group of scientists and medical people. Open Letter

In its final paragraph, that says "We, the undersigned doctors, nurses, scientists, and educators thus call on Spotify to immediately establish a clear and public policy to moderate misinformation on its platform." That's a much more nuanced approach, requesting them to moderate any misinformation, an approach I 100% agree with. Spotify do have a moderation policy; it's not a free-for-all and I think they probably got that Malone episode wrong. That's not to say they should censor it completely but should make it clear, as Facebook and Twitter did with Trump, that's it's a very contentious view that appears to be unsupported by evidence.

Rogan himself has claimed he's not anti-vax but he believes that the young and healthy don't need the vaccine https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56948665 Note that he explicitly says this: "I'm not a doctor," he said. "I'm not a respected source of information, even for me."

I'm a great believer in critical thinking, where people review ALL the available data or opinions then come to their own view. I don't agree with the view that "He's wrong, and because he's wrong, while there's an opportunity to listen to him (whether you want to or not) you can't listen to me."

This is what Young has said.

I support free speech. I have never been in favor of censorship. Private companies have the right to choose what they profit from, just as I can choose not to have my music support a platform that disseminates harmful information. I am happy and proud to stand in solidarity with the front line health care workers who risk their lives every day to help others

On Rogan, Im not going to link to it but he has promoted incorrect facts to support his argument too. I’d agree with the sentiment if it was about an opinion. It’s not that that he’s argued against though, at least not primarily, it’s the misinformation being used to promote it.
 



I hardly say fringes

Antivaxxers usually have poor reading comprehension don't they...

Stop being such a cliche.

Fringe as in fringe platforms.

Trump wasn't on the fringes either, but how is his alternative platform going?

Without a megaplatform like Youtube or spotify the meathead has no hope of getting even a quarter of the views/listens.
 

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