Russian invasion of Ukraine

Elbow beards said:
These journalists are really pissing me off now, keep asking mps about a no fly zone. Surely they are not that thick. Fucking anything for sensationalism.
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It's a desperate situation and, if a no flyzone is not an option, then a plan is needed urgently as to how food and medical equipment can get to those millions of innocent Ukranians once the major cities are surrounded.
 
It's such a mess.

Who knows what's going on in the background, but from my perspective, none of the western leaders seem to be giving any thought to what is Putin's exit option, other than "Win the war at all costs and be seen (domestically) as a great liberator and nationalist hero" or "Go home with your tail between your legs, face domestic upheaval, revolt and your probably overthrow and likely death". And yet somehow we seem to think he will just decide to choose the latter??? Mind boggling stupidity on our part.

Unless we (the west and Ukraine) change course, then I think the fall of Ukraine to the Russians is absolutely inevitable (barring some shock assassination of Putin in the next week or so, which we must assume is a long shot (no pun intended)).
 
BigJoe#1 said:
Not the time for a full on moan I know.... far from it but.....

I wish the UK politicians would NOT continually, put in the first sentence of nearly every response... "blah blah of which the UK is in the lead" when it comes to helping the Ukrainians.

It really pisses me off.

NOW IS NOT THE TIME FOR POLITICAL GRANDSTANDING
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It’s insecurity because we aren’t in the lead in anything any more.
Chippy_boy said:
It's such a mess.

Who knows what's going on in the background, but from my perspective, none of the western leaders seem to be giving any thought to what is Putin's exit option, other than "Win the war at all costs and be seen (domestically) as a great liberator and nationalist hero" or "Go home with your tail between your legs, face domestic upheaval, revolt and your probably overthrow and likely death". And yet somehow we seem to think he will just decide to choose the latter??? Mind boggling stupidity on our part.

Unless we (the west and Ukraine) change course, then I think the fall of Ukraine to the Russians is absolutely inevitable (barring some shock assassination of Putin in the next week or so, which we must assume is a long shot (no pun intended)).
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The fall of Ukraine to the Russians has always been inevitable and is how this will play out, followed by a bloody and endless insurgency war.
 
Chippy_boy said:
It's such a mess.

Who knows what's going on in the background, but from my perspective, none of the western leaders seem to be giving any thought to what is Putin's exit option, other than "Win the war at all costs and be seen (domestically) as a great liberator and nationalist hero" or "Go home with your tail between your legs, face domestic upheaval, revolt and your probably overthrow and likely death". And yet somehow we seem to think he will just decide to choose the latter??? Mind boggling stupidity on our part.

Unless we (the west and Ukraine) change course, then I think the fall of Ukraine to the Russians is absolutely inevitable (barring some shock assassination of Putin in the next week or so, which we must assume is a long shot (no pun intended)).
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He was given 100 “off ramps” over the last month and sped past every single one of them.

He has set out his stall very publicly, his objective is uniting Russia, Ukraine and Belarus, anything else failure.

So unless you want to give him the whole country, he is publicly losing.
 
The off ramp is Putin ending this before it gets so big and so bad for him that he can’t control the narrative back home.

The off ramp is leaving with 5,000 casualties and not 50,000.

The off ramp is lifting the sanctions before Russians are starving and rioting in the streets and the Oligarchs are plotting against him.
 
Chippy_boy said:
It's such a mess.

Who knows what's going on in the background, but from my perspective, none of the western leaders seem to be giving any thought to what is Putin's exit option, other than "Win the war at all costs and be seen (domestically) as a great liberator and nationalist hero" or "Go home with your tail between your legs, face domestic upheaval, revolt and your probably overthrow and likely death". And yet somehow we seem to think he will just decide to choose the latter??? Mind boggling stupidity on our part.

Unless we (the west and Ukraine) change course, then I think the fall of Ukraine to the Russians is absolutely inevitable (barring some shock assassination of Putin in the next week or so, which we must assume is a long shot (no pun intended)).
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Putin imo, has already lost. He has gone too far to simply withdraw now

He may gain a short term victory in taking Ukraine, but after that he is fucked.

Worldwide condemnation and continued restrictions to their existence will result in an uprising from within, against which he will either take his own life or face an international court charged with war crimes.

The rest of the world need a strategy to ensure the nullification of his nuclear capability before either happens
 
BigJoe#1 said:
Not the time for a full on moan I know.... far from it but.....

I wish the UK politicians would NOT continually, put in the first sentence of nearly every response... "blah blah of which the UK is in the lead" when it comes to helping the Ukrainians.

It really pisses me off.

NOW IS NOT THE TIME FOR POLITICAL GRANDSTANDING
Click to expand...

Unfortunately it’s the absolute state of our media. If politicians don’t say we’re doing the most blah blah blah then some journalist with the IQ of a brick will ask some stupid fucking question in an attempt to make themselves stand out from the crowd. You’ve only got to look at the repeated “no fly zone” questions to have a fraction of an idea what they have to deal with - a media that doesn’t listen or understand. It preempts them wasting time having to answer the same brain dead questions from journalists who heard another brain dead journalist ask the question before and, because they are a fucking idiot, thought it was a good question.
 
domalino said:
He was given 100 “off ramps” over the last month and sped past every single one of them.

He has set out his stall very publicly, his objective is uniting Russia, Ukraine and Belarus, anything else failure.

So unless you want to give him the whole country, he is publicly losing.
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I largely agree with this but we do need to hold out something he can grab hold of. But with the moderates not having a voice inside the Kremlin anymore I’m not sure anything that works for Ukraine will work for them. The loons have taken over the asylum
 
mosssideblue said:
Putin imo, has already lost. He has gone too far to simply withdraw now

He may gain a short term victory in taking Ukraine, but after that he is fucked.

Worldwide condemnation and continued restrictions to their existence will result in an uprising from within, against which he will either take his own life or face an international court charged with war crimes.

The rest of the world need a strategy to ensure the nullification of his nuclear capability before either happens
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You’ve got to hope that if he gave the order to launch someone in the chain would say, nah, you’re alreet lad.
 
Chippy_boy said:
It's such a mess.

Who knows what's going on in the background, but from my perspective, none of the western leaders seem to be giving any thought to what is Putin's exit option, other than "Win the war at all costs and be seen (domestically) as a great liberator and nationalist hero" or "Go home with your tail between your legs, face domestic upheaval, revolt and your probably overthrow and likely death". And yet somehow we seem to think he will just decide to choose the latter??? Mind boggling stupidity on our part.

Unless we (the west and Ukraine) change course, then I think the fall of Ukraine to the Russians is absolutely inevitable (barring some shock assassination of Putin in the next week or so, which we must assume is a long shot (no pun intended)).
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I’ve said from the start we need to give him a way out somehow. He needs something to take back to the Russian people as a success that means fewest dead Ukrainians and the maximum freedom for Ukraine.

It’s going to be tough but driving Russia into the ground to sheer desperation is a risk.
 
Octavian said:
I’ve said from the start we need to give him a way out somehow. He needs something to take back to the Russian people as a success that means fewest dead Ukrainians and the maximum freedom for Ukraine.

It’s going to be tough but driving Russia into the ground to sheer desperation is a risk.
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I'm sure some of his so called allies like China will be saying enough is enough and start putting pressure on him sooner or later.
 
Octavian said:
I’ve said from the start we need to give him a way out somehow. He needs something to take back to the Russian people as a success that means fewest dead Ukrainians and the maximum freedom for Ukraine.

It’s going to be tough but driving Russia into the ground to sheer desperation is a risk.
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He doesn't want "a way out". This narrative is bullshit. He's doing exactly what he wants int he way he wants to do it and in the full knowledge that nobody will stop him.
 
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