Russian invasion of Ukraine

mosssideblue said:
Woke up to news that Ukraine will not be getting the Mugs from Poland. Very disappointed to here that.

Shapps on TV now saying it's because NATO don't want to be seen for escalating things by providing these weapons. Pity the interviewer didn't ask what's the difference between what weaponry is provided to Ukraine and why doesn't what NATO has already given not escalate things.

Oh, and FFS government stop answering every question with " the UK was first".
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Polish mugs eh? I guess the offer just wasn’t the Americans cup of tea.

Seriously though, I think it’s anything that’s isn’t exclusively defensive in nature is not going to be given. The fault of this story lay with the EU, they are the ones responsible for this grandiose announcement of false hope - saying it was going to happen without actually discussing it with partners first - predominantly NATO.

Poland shouldn’t have publicly dropped the US in it either - should have been done privately. Putin has woken up this morning thinking what? my threats have worked - cue more incoming threats.
 
metalblue said:
Polish mugs eh? I guess the offer just wasn’t the Americans cup of tea.

Seriously though, I think it’s anything that’s isn’t exclusively defensive in nature is not going to be given. The fault of this story lay with the EU, they are the ones responsible for this grandiose announcement of false hope - saying it was going to happen without actually discussing it with partners first - predominantly NATO.

Poland shouldn’t have publicly dropped the US in it either - should have been done privately. Putin has woken up this morning thinking what? my threats have worked - cue more incoming threats.
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I guess Poland are seeing first hand the fallout from this war with the volume of evacuees and the pain in every one of their eyes and felt the need to do something more than is currently being done.

We are already providing lethal and defensive weapons, and yet, giving warplanes us a no no
 
mosssideblue said:
Woke up to news that Ukraine will not be getting the Migs from Poland. Very disappointed to here that.

Shapps on TV now saying it's because NATO don't want to be seen for escalating things by providing these weapons. Pity the interviewer didn't ask what's the difference between what weaponry is provided to Ukraine and why doesn't what NATO has already given not escalate things.

Oh, and FFS government stop answering every question with " the UK was first".

Edited to remove the typo :)
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It's disappointing but understandable.
Nuclear winter would be a fucker.
 
This is the statue of Wellington outside GOMA in Glasgow. Usually he has an ordinary traffic cone on his head. Its our way of saying we dont care who you are, how famous, we are putting a cone on your head. The council tried to remove it hundreds of times, then gave up. A Glasgow woman knitted this and her husband got a ladder and put it up. Small gestures of solidarity and support. Well done Glasgow.
 

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Magicpole said:
This is the statue of Wellington outside GOMA in Glasgow. Usually he has an ordinary traffic cone on his head. Its our way of saying we dont care who you are, how famous, we are putting a cone on your head. The council tried to remove it hundreds of times, then gave up. A Glasgow woman knitted this and her husband got a ladder and put it up. Small gestures of solidarity and support. Well done Glasgow.
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Brilliant, I remember reading about the battle between students and the council regarding the traffic cone.
 
Eventually both sides will have to sit down and come to some sort of agreement.
I can’t see either side ‘winning’.

Russia will struggle to occupy Ukraine and the Ukraine army will struggle to defeat Russia.

While all this is going on normal people from both sides are suffering.
 
mosssideblue said:
I guess Poland are seeing first hand the fallout from this war with the volume of evacuees and the pain in every one of their eyes and felt the need to do something more than is currently being done.

We are already providing lethal and defensive weapons, and yet, giving warplanes us a no no
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I presume it’s the defensive aspect however if that means Ukraine can’t effectively retake or attack beyond the front line - eventually they will surely lose? Or at least negotiations will be hampered from a Ukrainian perspective. At best they can hope that the price Russia pays brings them to the table with a palatable offer.

Although if Ukraine can readily buy drones from Turkey that offensive/defensive line has already been crossed surely? Maybe it’s a pre-agreed contract they are fulfilling? Or maybe Ukraine needs to ask Poland if it can buy their migs? Or just give them to Turkey who seem to give less of a fuck about the ramblings of that loon Putin and can pass them on to Ukraine.

I don’t know the nuances of it all
 
mosssideblue said:
What's the difference between war planes and say, anti aircraft missiles?
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We've already given those and can give more. Hopefully much more.
Yes it's a bugger that we can only fight Russia with our hands tied behind our backs but escalating would not be a good idea.
The Rouble is worth nothing in the rest of the world as of today. It will impact life in Russia severely. Let that start to work.
 
BlueAnorak said:
We've already given those and can give more. Hopefully much more.
Yes it's a bugger that we can only fight Russia with our hands tied behind our backs but escalating would not be a good idea.
The Rouble is worth nothing in the rest of the world as of today. It will impact life in Russia severely. Let that start to work.
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You missed my point bud. We are already supplying Ukraine with weapons that kill Russians, but providing planes ( which will also kill Russians) is seen as a step too far
 
BlueAnorak said:
We've already given those and can give more. Hopefully much more.
Yes it's a bugger that we can only fight Russia with our hands tied behind our backs but escalating would not be a good idea.
The Rouble is worth nothing in the rest of the world as of today. It will impact life in Russia severely.
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It’s a shitter not being able to help militarily when you see the destruction going on. The sanctions and tanking of the rouble will make thing’s difficult though, if this goes on for months and the Russian’s have lost planes and tanks they are expensive to replace when the war effort is costing them a billion pounds per day. Asking Syrians to go and fight for pennies is very much telling of them situation.

They have 150,000 soldiers trying to take a vast country with over 44 million people in it. Equipment keeps rolling in for Ukraine and also 60,000 people have entered the country to fight the invasion. We are potentially looking at Russia’s Vietnam, they’ve made an error invading when it’s muddy and then a cold snap on top of that, how many of them will fight when they have no food and it’s minus 20?
 
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