metalblue
Well-Known Member
Sunak is far better. She is devoid of her own ideas and because of that she changes her mind on an alarmingly regular basis. She is nothing but hot air from what I’ve seen - I can’t stand her.
Liz Truss
- Thread starter mr t
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Sunak is far better. She is devoid of her own ideas and because of that she changes her mind on an alarmingly regular basis. She is nothing but hot air from what I’ve seen - I can’t stand her.
The perfect fumble
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Knowledge is not wisdom and it ain't competence either.
Doing PPE doesn't make you intelligent unfortunately, the world would be a much better place if it did.
This will be offset by the amount who are not voting for her because she's a woman.
Saddleworth2
Well-Known Member
She is not competent but neither is she stupid.
stonerblue
Well-Known Member
Er, PPE at university isn't really a stellar educational background and i'm not sure what level of degree she got.
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ganganvince
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No Thatcher had a presence and didn't u turn all the time
stockportblue
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Trying to get my head round the fact we live in a country that someone like this or Johnson can become the Head of our nation.
Surely we can find people intellectually and morally superior to the likes of these.
What qualifications does Truss have to make decisions on Economic policy. Is she the top economist in Britain?
Surely we can find people intellectually and morally superior to the likes of these.
What qualifications does Truss have to make decisions on Economic policy. Is she the top economist in Britain?
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mat
Guest
Why are people comparing her to Thatcher?
Maggie was slightly left of this despot and had a brain.
Maggie was slightly left of this despot and had a brain.
bluethrunthru
Well-Known Member
I am pretty certain that sometimes that refusal to deviate from a plan or an idea was not always in her favour - see the Poll Tax.
However what Thatcher had was an ability to articulate her thinking and explain why she might have changed a view on something whereas Truss is simply the glove puppet of the last person who spoke to her. eg
"Liz we need to be seen to do something - cut taxes its Thatcherite and Conservative "
Truss - " I will cut taxes because its the right Conservative thing to do"
someone else - " Liz cutting taxes is bad as its inflationary and we Conservatives need to keep inflation down to show we are good with the economy and for business "
Truss - " we cannot put taxes up its inflationary. What I didn't say before was taken out of context and has been deliberately mis-represented in the press"
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ganganvince
Guest
Can't argue with that at all only thing Truss has in common with Thatcher is that they are women. Thatcher and Blair love or hate them were leaders Truss and Sunak aren't.
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MillionMilesAway
Well-Known Member
I agree - Sunak may have had a chance, but only where he started from before being dragged into the loonfest of this leadership campaign.
I think he'd have at least had a plan for the economy, whether palatable to all or not, and doesn't come over as an ideologue above all things.
bluethrunthru
Well-Known Member
If he is handed a humiliating defeat and demoted from cabinet I expect that - unless he has some sort of base of support within the PCP - he will announce he will step down at the next GE. TBH his last year has been a disaster and he is now not well liked in his constituency. Many there vote blue regardless of the candidate but now the bill for furlough and eat out to help out has landed, bills are going up as is inflation the shine has worn off. What has rocked the boat the most is that - like most in the UK - they vote for the party regardless but what has been coming out about Sunak - billionaire - green card holder - wife a non-dom - lavish homes around the world - building and annexe to house a swimming pool on his constituency home - has badly damaged his standing in Richmondshire
MillionMilesAway
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't be surprised at all by that.
I think he'll be Johnson's scapegoat, and also the scapegoat for anyone not brave enough to blame Johnson.
What isn't known at the moment is how much was his plan, and how much he wasn't allowed to do.
Churchlawtonblue
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I can't stand either. Sunak has no idea how everyday people are struggling. Raising taxes across the board for hard hit middle earners while reducing it for the better off isn't the way forward. He's an an out of touch billionare and not suitable for the job.
metalblue
Well-Known Member
Good post and an perfect illustration of Truss. At least Thatcher had the rationale of needing to be strong of mind as the first female prime minister. If memory serves me well I believe I’ve previously read that she was perceived as being a bit washy at the outset by the party, probably unfairly, but still doubled down on that hard woman image.
I cringed at the “right conservative thing to do”… put me in mind of that Family Guy episode when Lois is running for mayor and has to end up answering everything with “911” just to win voters over. Our politics is all about the optics these days, fuck actual policy if it those hollow words land with the voters. Vote for air and you get air.
metalblue
Well-Known Member
Whilst Sunak may not relate (I dispute that to an extent as he grew up in a “normal” middle class world not some silver spoon existence) what can’t be said of his wealth is he is doing this for anything other than genuine reasons. He has more money than Davy Crockett so can’t be corrupted and he won’t be looking at being PM as some sort of stepping stone towards making a couple of million from a book deal or some cushy ambassador job. For that I quite warm to the bloke and I do see him as a one nation tory, however my preference was always a Ben Wallace type character - no nonsense and tells it like it is. That Truss looks to be getting in off the back of a right wing “manifesto” of sound bites which tells me one nation tory is an expression we won’t be hearing for a while.
As @bluethrunthru said above I think Sunak stands down next GE - he doesn’t need the ball ache for a starters.
Churchlawtonblue
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Winchester School isn't middle class as I understand it, I don't necessarily think he corrupt per se , i just think that someone who raises taxes on middle earners while helping out big business and high paid earners isnt up to the job and as they are out of touch. Bringing in such polices ( announced over a year ago) are bad enough but then refusing to backtrack when faced with a recession and significant inflation a year later shows he isnt up to the job. Truss is all sound bites. As i said in the my first post on these two weeks ago, Tory MPs who thought these two are the answer are clueless.
ZenHalfTimeCrock
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This is something that I struggle with, as Truss does come across as being deeply stupid to me too, for the simple reason that she makes assertions which are self-evidently false or that can be subjected to a swift process of empirical trituration.
Having taught quite a number of sixth-formers who went on to study at Oxford, one thing that I can state quite unequivocally is that none of them, not one, would have come out with the kind of nonsense that she does. They were invariably of much higher calibre. They were also pretty well-rounded, could engage in highly sophisticated critical thinking, and were capable of empathy, of seeing the world from someone else's point of view.
So I find it hard to explain her lack of competence and ineptitude.
Could be because the Oxford PPE course ends up being too superficial because three subjects are studied rather than one? Or is it sometimes the case that those who graduate with this degree are so in thrall to a particular ideology that they cannot see the wood for the trees? Or could it be the case - as Ian Hughes has persuasively argued - that politics these days attracts more than its fair share of characters who are pathologically narcissistic, or even exhibit psychopathic traits?
I only wish I knew. But anyway, the following links may provide some clues:
How an Oxford degree – PPE – created a robotic governing class
If graduates from an architecture school designed buildings that were unfit for human habitation or doctors from a university’s medical faculty left death in their wake, their teachers would worry. The graduates of Oxford’s Politics, Philosophy and Economics course form the largest single...
www.spectator.co.uk
PPE: the Oxford degree that runs Britain
The Long Read: An extraordinary number of Britain’s elite studied philosophy, politics and economics at Oxford. But does it produce an out-of-touch ruling class?
www.theguardian.com
The Light Was Yellow Sir
Well-Known Member
This is something that I struggle with, as Truss does come across as being deeply stupid to me too, for the simple reason that she makes assertions which are self-evidently false or that can be subjected to a swift process of empirical trituration.
Having taught quite a number of sixth-formers who went on to study at Oxford, one thing that I can state quite unequivocally is that none of them, not one, would have come out with the kind of nonsense that she does. They were invariably of much higher calibre. They were also pretty well-rounded, could engage in highly sophisticated critical thinking, and were capable of empathy, of seeing the world from someone else's point of view.
So I find it hard to explain her lack of competence and ineptitude.
Could be because the Oxford PPE course ends up being too superficial because three subjects are studied rather than one? Or is it sometimes the case that those who graduate with this degree are so in thrall to a particular ideology that they cannot see the wood for the trees? Or could it be the case - as Ian Hughes has persuasively argued - that politics these days attracts more than its fair share of characters who are pathologically narcissistic, or even exhibit psychopathic traits?
I only wish I knew. But anyway, the following links may provide some clues:
How an Oxford degree – PPE – created a robotic governing class
If graduates from an architecture school designed buildings that were unfit for human habitation or doctors from a university’s medical faculty left death in their wake, their teachers would worry. The graduates of Oxford’s Politics, Philosophy and Economics course form the largest single...
PPE: the Oxford degree that runs Britain
The Long Read: An extraordinary number of Britain’s elite studied philosophy, politics and economics at Oxford. But does it produce an out-of-touch ruling class?
It’s simpler than that in that she doesn’t actually believe in anything, save for some convoluted idea about the ‘free market’. It is something that affects more and more of our politicians and not in a good way.
They flip flop about, not actually believing in anything, just being slaves to the latest focus group. I suspect she seems a bit thick because she’s always trying to say what she thinks people want to hear. She’s gone from card carrying Liberal Democrat, through to member of Reform, co-written that dreadful book, fervent supporter of Remain to an unequivocal supporter of Brexit. She’s one of the very few of the latter to get a job under Johnson, which suggests that particular Damascene conversion is her final position and, although you’d hope that practicality will outweigh ideology, it rarely does, sadly.