Is our military…

[bluenova]

Can you give direct examples that you have witnessed? As an ex serviceman I can tell you that whilst there are some (Very few) incidents of fuckwittery in the main the lads I served with were exceptional brave people.

As for "Questioning" your superiors, it's the army it wouldn't be effective if the ranks questioned everything they didn't agree with, indecisiveness would cost lives. Again where have you seen this behaviour?

I need to be a little careful as I don't want to break any confidences, and I certainly wouldn't suggest anything that contradicts them being brave. While a lot of the sexist stuff was clearly intended, the racism, homophobia, disablist comments were more casual. Ironically it appears that a lot of the disablist stuff comes out when people are aware that they maybe shouldn't use race/sexuality as a slur.

My comment about questioning was also meant to acknowledge the fact that it's not a culture where you can challenge. Many of the issues I saw were used when people were being told off, or "encouraged", and I totally understand that it makes sense to do what you're told without second guessing everything - hence why the responsibility rests with the people giving out the orders.

I wouldn't suggest these are bad people at all, I was just amazed that the culture is still so dated - and from discussions with more senior officers, I appreciate that the will is there from the top, and it's a work in progress, in a culture that's clearly a lot more difficult to change than most.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

Isn't a little bit of racism a necessary element of a military sent half-way round the world to fight "backwards people of different races"?

 

[Blue Maverick]

They have Sencos in the military?

No idea what your on about!

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

No idea what your on about!

A SENCo, or Special Educational Needs Co-ordinator, is the school teacher who is responsible for assessing, planning and monitoring the progress of children with special educational needs and disabilities (SEND).

 

[Blue Maverick]

A SENCo, or Special Educational Needs Co-ordinator, is the school teacher who is responsible for assessing, planning and monitoring the progress of children with special educational needs and disabilities (SEND).

I didn’t type that I put SNCO

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

I need to be a little careful as I don't want to break any confidences, and I certainly wouldn't suggest anything that contradicts them being brave. While a lot of the sexist stuff was clearly intended, the racism, homophobia, disablist comments were more casual. Ironically it appears that a lot of the disablist stuff comes out when people are aware that they maybe shouldn't use race/sexuality as a slur.

My comment about questioning was also meant to acknowledge the fact that it's not a culture where you can challenge. Many of the issues I saw were used when people were being told off, or "encouraged", and I totally understand that it makes sense to do what you're told without second guessing everything - hence why the responsibility rests with the people giving out the orders.

I wouldn't suggest these are bad people at all, I was just amazed that the culture is still so dated - and from discussions with more senior officers, I appreciate that the will is there from the top, and it's a work in progress, in a culture that's clearly a lot more difficult to change than most.

I’m still very shocked that you seen such open behaviour. I asked if you had reported this but you must’ve missed my question?

 

[johnnytapia]

A SENCo, or Special Educational Needs Co-ordinator, is the school teacher who is responsible for assessing, planning and monitoring the progress of children with special educational needs and disabilities (SEND).

The SENCO has day-to-day responsibility for the operation of SEN policy and co- ordination of specific provision made to support individual pupils with SEN.

It’s Class Teacher, as defined by the Teacher Standards, who is responsible for the planning, assessment and progress of the SEN children under their aegis.

As Senco it’s my job to ensure the teachers are effectively planning and assessing- and in turn, ensuring SEND pupils make appropriate progress. It’s also my job to advise on suitable strategies and, where appropriate, to seek other professional support (EP SALT OT etc).

It’s fuck all to do with the Army by the way, but think we’ve established that!

 

[blueinsa]

British forces are in my humble opinion the best in the world.

We should be rightly proud of them.

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

I suspect our military has been diluted down like everything else in this country. We used to have the best police, healthcare fire service, society.

Its all gone to shit because we have too many people who like to fix things that aren't broken.... brexiteers, politicians, hate media etc etc, even like Southgate haters...

....they all tell us everything is shit and that it all needs to be changed to what they want. And then they replace it with shit.

So I am guessing some smart politician with his Smart objectives will come up with a way of "improving the armed forces" by cutting funding.

Just my impression over the last 40 odd years

 

[Zabbasbeard]

That’s really sad to hear, but being racist doesn’t necessarily render someone to be irredeemably bad. Racism is illogical, unwarranted and wrong. But so are lots of things. Doesn’t necessarily mean that a racist person is poisonous or malign. Life is far more complicated than that. Four legs good, two legs bad?

That maybe but when you've been physically attacked, racially abused, harassed and been on the end of other criminal activity from racists, you might be forgiven for thinking those people are poisonous and malicious.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

The SENCO has day-to-day responsibility for the operation of SEN policy and co- ordination of specific provision made to support individual pupils with SEN.

It’s Class Teacher, as defined by the Teacher Standards, who is responsible for the planning, assessment and progress of the SEN children under their aegis.

As Senco it’s my job to ensure the teachers are effectively planning and assessing- and in turn, ensuring SEND pupils make appropriate progress. It’s also my job to advise on suitable strategies and, where appropriate, to seek other professional support (EP SALT OT etc).

It’s fuck all to do with the Army by the way, but think we’ve established that!

Yes I did know this it was just a crass joke.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Historically the British have never really thought of the armed forces as central to our sense of national identity, the navy perhaps, when we had the largest in the world, but unlike other European countries we have a detached relationship with our military. You have to go back to Cromwell if you're looking for military rule, so we don't hold that against them, As for the two world wars they were fought mostly by conscript forces and if you think of the songs they produced they weren't about glorious victories more "when this bloody war is over, no more soldiering for me"....

Gordon Brown when he was Chancellor of the Exchequer dreamt up Armed Forces Day, but it's never caught on. Unlike on the continent you don't see men and women on the street in uniform, our military discourages it.

Unless you live in a garrison town, or have family in the services, most folk never think of the armed forces at all.

 

[1961_vintage]

I've had quite a lot of unfiltered access of the army recently and I'd suggest you don't have to be a sexist, racist, generally offensive, right wing c*nt to get on, but it sure does help.

So, unfortunately it's a no from me.

Salvation Army doesn't count.

 

[johnnytapia]

Historically the British have never really thought of the armed forces as central to our sense of national identity, the navy perhaps, when we had the largest in the world, but unlike other European countries we have a detached relationship with our military. You have to go back to Cromwell if you're looking for military rule, so we don't hold that against them, As for the two world wars they were fought mostly by conscript forces and if you think of the songs they produced they weren't about glorious victories more "when this bloody war is over, no more soldiering for me"....

Gordon Brown when he was Chancellor of the Exchequer dreamt up Armed Forces Day, but it's never caught on. Unlike on the continent you don't see men and women on the street in uniform, our military discourages it.

Unless you live in a garrison town, or have family in the services, most folk never think of the armed forces at all.

It used to be a relatively common sight seeing armed personnel on trains going home. Sadly, they’re probably told / ordered to do otherwise now. Think we know why.

 

[johnnytapia]

Historically the British have never really thought of the armed forces as central to our sense of national identity, the navy perhaps, when we had the largest in the world, but unlike other European countries we have a detached relationship with our military. You have to go back to Cromwell if you're looking for military rule, so we don't hold that against them, As for the two world wars they were fought mostly by conscript forces and if you think of the songs they produced they weren't about glorious victories more "when this bloody war is over, no more soldiering for me"....

Gordon Brown when he was Chancellor of the Exchequer dreamt up Armed Forces Day, but it's never caught on. Unlike on the continent you don't see men and women on the street in uniform, our military discourages it.

Unless you live in a garrison town, or have family in the services, most folk never think of the armed forces at all.

Can you imagine? A day where we celebrate our history/ our culture/ the forces that defend that history/ that culture? God forbid we ever do that.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

It used to be a relatively common sight seeing armed personnel on trains going home. Sadly, they’re probably told / ordered to do otherwise now. Think we know why.

Probably became not the done thing when the IRA were at their peak

 

[The perfect fumble]

Can you imagine? A day where we celebrate our history/ our culture/ the forces that defend that history/ that culture? God forbid we ever do that.

It's not so cut and dried as that.

We don't march our troops or parade our military hardware through the streets of London to celebrate a national day or some such, as they do in Russia, France, Turkey and many other countries. Generally speaking the English speaking world, at least the old Dominions, don't indulge in such things.

The British military tradition is that parades are only held before the Monarch or his/her representative, such as Trooping the Colour.

From Wellingtons "scum" at Waterloo to press ganging our navy, we've never loved the forces, not now and not in the good old days when youth were forced to "get some in".

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

Historically the British have never really thought of the armed forces as central to our sense of national identity, the navy perhaps, when we had the largest in the world, but unlike other European countries we have a detached relationship with our military. You have to go back to Cromwell if you're looking for military rule, so we don't hold that against them, As for the two world wars they were fought mostly by conscript forces and if you think of the songs they produced they weren't about glorious victories more "when this bloody war is over, no more soldiering for me"....

Gordon Brown when he was Chancellor of the Exchequer dreamt up Armed Forces Day, but it's never caught on. Unlike on the continent you don't see men and women on the street in uniform, our military discourages it.

Unless you live in a garrison town, or have family in the services, most folk never think of the armed forces at all.

As recently as the Afghan and Iraq campaigns, the British Army has been at the heart of our country.

I suppose it’s all about individual perspective but whenever we are involved in major conflict, the country rallies behind.

As for your comments on the World Wars, I’m left wondering where you have been because if you think that they weren’t at the heart of an institution during those times then I just cannot understand that standpoint.

Do you not think those that are serving overseas at the moment, in the Baltic states, many in other countries that cannot be spoken about, don’t have relations that care for their kin? This island has been built on conflict, home and abroad, fighting battles for political will, which has brought us to the people we are.

For me, what the current crop bring makes me absolutely proud of what they bring.

 

[The perfect fumble]

As recently as the Afghan and Iraq campaigns, the British Army has been at the heart of our country.

I suppose it’s all about individual perspective but whenever we are involved in major conflict, the country rallies behind.

You think so? As you say it might be individual perspective, but the country rallied round the Iraq and Afghan campaigns? Really?

If you say so.

As for your comments on the World Wars, I’m left wondering where you have been because if you think that they weren’t at the heart of an institution during those times then I just cannot understand that standpoint.

The two world wars were fought primarily by millions of volunteers and conscripts and so our attitudes toward them is divorced from our general attitude toward the military, hence a separate armed forces day from Remembrance Day.

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

You think so? As you say it might be individual perspective, but the country rallied round the Iraq and Afghan campaigns? Really? I must have missed that.



The two world wars were fought primarily by millions of volunteers and conscripts and so our attitudes toward them is divorced from our general attitude toward the military, hence a separate armed forces day from Remembrance Day.

It’s late, but why would the primarily volunteers step-up if they didn’t feel pride? And what about all the support for those who have served recently? Seems completely divorced from reality but willing to understand.