PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

Ducado said:
You are of course correct and that is in my opinion the aim of it all to tarnish the club, however consider it a battle in a war, they have scored a hit on us, however the war is not over, looking in the long term Citys commercial success and attracting a worldwide fanbase moves on apace, apart from some bitter enders this will fade from the memory
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Oh yeah I fully agree

I just disagree with the notion that all the lies and smears will disappear overnight.
 
Scaring Europe to Death said:
Oh yeah I fully agree

I just disagree with the notion that all the lies and smears will disappear overnight.
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Ranting halfwit "Cheating City ****"

Me "Cheating winning it all **** thank you very much"

Only way to deal with them.
 
Ric said:
Thanks for explaining that clearly. It's reassuring to hear that they couldn't just impose some arbitrary penalty (say relegation to League Two) and that we'd just have to accept it with no legal recourse whatsoever.
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I have never believed we'd have no recourse in dealing with any arbitrary decision that might come our way no matter how many so called experts came on here and said otherwise. No disrespect, but a lot of what's been said on here appears to me to be fear mongering or abject pessimism or simply bad information. Maybe some or all of the above. There is no way on God's green earth that a multi billion dollar entity like City could have virtually their entire long term viability left to the whims of some potential kangaroo court representing parties in conflict with their own. That would be impossible to believe considering the circumstances and the stakes involved...JMO
 
Exeter Blue I am here said:
ProjectRiver has made it pretty clear that, except for in very exceptional circumstances, there is no recourse to the Courts, and those exceptional circumstances wouldn’t embrace the kind of re-run of proceedings what we’d likely be after.
I have the same reservations as KSSS. We can get super-excited on here by news that City (perhaps correctly) believe the PL’s case is piss weak, but they’re picking the man who picks the tribunal, so the chances of a bent charade, with the ‘high bar’ lowered to the point that Tyrion Lannister could limbo under it, cannot be dismissed out of hand. Be upbeat at what we’ve heard today, but don’t bet everything you’ve got on it just yet.
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Heard what today?
 
JewelZee said:
I have never believed we'd have no recourse in dealing with any arbitrary decision that might come our way no matter how many so called experts came on here and said otherwise. No disrespect, but a lot of what's been said on here appears to me to be fear mongering or abject pessimism or simply bad information. Maybe some or all of the above.
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I think that's extremely unfair and disrespectful tbh.
 
Ric said:
No, it's unprecedented.
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A better analogy would be the imposition of a penalty following alleged rule breaches which was challenged following an arbitration process on the basis @petrusha set out in his previous posts. Doesn't have to be PL and a football club. Can be any tribunal process.

I suspect there have been a few. Not many successful ones probably. But I don't know, of course.
 
Ric said:
I think that's extremely unfair and disrespectful tbh.
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Sorry you feel that way. Not intended as an insult to you specifically or anyone else for that matter. But it is my opinion and I stand by it. I am not an attorney, but as a CPA working as a Director of Finance for many years I've been involved in my fair share of litigation over matters of financial discrepancies and irregularities and I can't imagine any business entity of this magnitude being in a position of such vulnerability regarding its manner to recourse. Hopefully it will not come down to that, but if it does and I'm proven wrong I'll be more than happy to apologize for that as well...
 
Don Karleone said:



Probably already mentioned but this gave me a chuckle.
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Anyone with half a brain could see they were asking a set of leading questions knowing full-well how people would respond and if they didn't respond in that way they would just throw the data away. I won't read the article but did they say what the sample size of the idiots who responded was? If they are trying to measure people's perceptions of MCFC we could have told them and quoted any number of social media and 'journalistic' articles. You don't need to measure it - it's already out there. This is nothing more than yet another mud slinging exercise. What they should be doing is asking why people have those perceptions - how were they developed and do they have any substance. But that would require some basic analytical and investigative work and even the so-called 'quality' press is not up for that. It's symptomatic of the current malaise in the media that anyone who really wants to discover what's going on with this issue comes to this forum. I would like to thank all our legal and financial members who have laid the facts before us. My only comfort in all this is that while the redtop clubs (and others) try unsuccessfully to bring us down we are becoming a global force and winning the trophies they covet. I hope they suffer more and more and continue on their flawed strategies. Surely at some point they have to be accountable to their fan base. They can't forever blame City. They won't bring us down and their shady corruption and inefficiencies will be questioned by their acolytes at some point.
 
JewelZee said:
Sorry you feel that way. Not intended as an insult to you specifically or anyone else for that matter. But it is my opinion and I stand by it. I am not an attorney, but as a CPA working as a Director of Finance for many years I've been involved in my fair share of litigation over matters of financial discrepancies and irregularities and I can't imagine any business entity of this magnitude being in a position of such vulnerability regarding its manner to recourse. Hopefully it will not come down to that, but if it does and I'm proven wrong I'll be more than happy to apologize for that as well...
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No worries, I didn't take it personally as I'm far from an expert in this field. But there are others who are, and the notion that they are guilty of fear mongering or abject pessimism is a bit out of order. They are calling it as they see it, based on their knowledge and experience. I, for one, appreciate their honesty and forthright views.
 
Dinas said:
Anyone with half a brain could see they were asking a set of leading questions knowing full-well how people would respond and if they didn't respond in that way they would just throw the data away. I won't read the article but did they say what the sample size of the idiots who responded was? If they are trying to measure people's perceptions of MCFC we could have told them and quoted any number of social media and 'journalistic' articles. You don't need to measure it - it's already out there. This is nothing more than yet another mud slinging exercise. What they should be doing is asking why people have those perceptions - how were they developed and do they have any substance. But that would require some basic analytical and investigative work and even the so-called 'quality' press is not up for that. It's symptomatic of the current malaise in the media that anyone who really wants to discover what's going on with this issue comes to this forum. I would like to thank all our legal and financial members who have laid the facts before us. My only comfort in all this is that while the redtop clubs (and others) try unsuccessfully to bring us down we are becoming a global force and winning the trophies they covet. I hope they suffer more and more and continue on their flawed strategies. Surely at some point they have to be accountable to their fan base. They can't forever blame City. They won't bring us down and their shady corruption and inefficiencies will be questioned by their acolytes at some point.
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No information on the number of respondents, the sourcing of the data, how many "rival" fans support which "rivals", the steps taken to validate allegiances, eliminate multiple voting etc etc.

I am guessing it's just a Twitter poll, so pretty meaningless really. Certainly no valid statistical basis to say "X% of all rival fans say .....". Or anything. Even Harris gives elementary statistical information so we can tell his polls are a farce. Which I did, btw, and for which he blocked me. I was so proud :)
 
Dinas said:
Anyone with half a brain could see they were asking a set of leading questions knowing full-well how people would respond and if they didn't respond in that way they would just throw the data away. I won't read the article but did they say what the sample size of the idiots who responded was? If they are trying to measure people's perceptions of MCFC we could have told them and quoted any number of social media and 'journalistic' articles. You don't need to measure it - it's already out there. This is nothing more than yet another mud slinging exercise. What they should be doing is asking why people have those perceptions - how were they developed and do they have any substance. But that would require some basic analytical and investigative work and even the so-called 'quality' press is not up for that. It's symptomatic of the current malaise in the media that anyone who really wants to discover what's going on with this issue comes to this forum. I would like to thank all our legal and financial members who have laid the facts before us. My only comfort in all this is that while the redtop clubs (and others) try unsuccessfully to bring us down we are becoming a global force and winning the trophies they covet. I hope they suffer more and more and continue on their flawed strategies. Surely at some point they have to be accountable to their fan base. They can't forever blame City. They won't bring us down and their shady corruption and inefficiencies will be questioned by their acolytes at some point.
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Yup - whilst they're expending all their energy attacking City, they're not doing what they should be doing, which is improving their own clubs
 
Blue_Lightsaber said:
Tribalism has plagued humanity throughout history. It is encoded into our DNA that there is an "us" and there is a "them." And that "us" deserves all the forgiveness in the world while the "them" must be punished.

The great psychological mindfuck right now has been using the media to get people to manipulate them and personally hate City. And as you noticed they keep throwing more gasoline and red meat on the fire.

Gotta go after the media for damages.

I wish City would wake up.. and stop being Happy Flowers!
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Part of football's charm is it's tribalism. Many of us start supporting a club for all sorts of irrational reasons. But this goes beyond that. As you say the media is guilty of brain-washing fans of other clubs. This is irresponsible, immoral and certainly unprofessional. I suppose Goebbels would have applauded their efforts. From a corporate perspective our competitors are wasting all their energy on trying to bring us down. They don't want their fans to see how ineffective they are when faced with superior opposition. It's contemptible at the same time as being successful in the short term. Let's carry on winning and watch them suffer and see what the narrative is in a few years time.
 
Ric said:
No worries, I didn't take it personally as I'm far from an expert in this field. But there are others who are, and the notion that they are guilty of fear mongering or abject pessimism is a bit out of order. They are calling it as they see it, based on their knowledge and experience. I, for one, appreciate their honesty and forthright views.
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Absolutely. The forum is a better place for their views.

But I do wish they would try to explain to non-legals in a less legal way, sometimes. 99% of the people on here don't have any legal training, so sometimes pick up the wrong end of the legal argument stick purely from the way it is explained. A better way to explain the right to appeal would be to say there IS a right of appeal in certain, unlikely circumstances, rather than saying there is no right of appeal except in certain, unlikely circumstances. People are looking to the experts on here for comfort as well as legal explanation. A little comfort would go a long way on a particularly stressful issue, imho.

My point is more psychological than legal maybe.

Maybe I have no point.

Maybe there is no point at all, anywhere.

Philosophical as well as psychological then :)
 
halfcenturyup said:
No information on the number of respondents, the sourcing of the data, how many "rival" fans support which "rivals", the steps taken to validate allegiances, eliminate multiple voting etc etc.

I am guessing it's just a Twitter poll, so pretty meaningless really. Certainly no valid statistical basis to say "X% of all rival fans say .....". Or anything. Even Harris gives elementary statistical information so we can tell his polls are a farce. Which I did, btw, and for which he blocked me. I was so proud :)
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All as I suspected but it won't stop people quoting the drive!. If that sort of thing was presented in a student dissertation it would be heavily criticised. It makes me so angry that they have the audacity to publish such flawed information. Thanks for the info btw.
 
halfcenturyup said:
Absolutely. The forum is a better place for their views.

But I do wish they would try to explain to non-legals in a less legal way, sometimes. 99% of the people on here don't have any legal training, so sometimes pick up the wrong end of the legal argument stick purely from the way it is explained. A better way to explain the right to appeal would be to say there IS a right of appeal in certain, unlikely circumstances, rather than saying there is no right of appeal except in certain, unlikely circumstances. People are looking to the experts on here for comfort as well as legal explanation. A little comfort would go a long way on a particularly stressful issue, imho.

My point is more psychological than legal maybe.

Maybe I have no point.

Maybe there is no point at all, anywhere.

Philosophical as well as psychological then :)
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Psychiatric as well maybe :)
 
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