The Labour Party

SkyBlueFlux said:
They’re currently wallowing in the high 20s in every poll - which is always a default loss (though theoretically could win with unprecedented left wing vote splitting). The big problem they’ll have is their lack of ability to attract new voters. Now Brexit is a busted flush which attracted about 6%+ voters to their side, and they have slipped below their 36% waterline they then need to start bringing more young voters in than the opposition… which frankly they’ve not done for actual decades.
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They're not even getting the people currently approaching middle age. Historically, people go towards the right as they get older. This has largely stopped, and it's arguably because there's a whole generation of 30-somethings who are struggling economically, not owning a house, without a stable career, with excessive debt from the university course they were told would get them a stable career, huge childcare costs, etc. These people don't have any stake in conservative politics. There's no economic argument for them to vote Tory because they have nothing to conserve, so the Tories are having to resort to bullshit culture wars. But ultimately, most people vote based on their economic situation.
 
Im confused regarding Labours policy regarding taxation.

Its apparent that we need to spend money to fix the mess this country is in, however there seems to be a continual changing tone from Labour as regards taxation.

After being heavily critical of Sunak using Capital Gains Tax and previously identifying it as a potential target to raise the tax take, it seem to have been shelved. Likewise according to the Independent this morning there are no plans to change income tax or NI for any workers including those earning over 80k who were going to be targeted.

So where is the money going to come from ?

Councils are already underfunded and unable to provide the necessary public services, likewise with the healthcare system and schools so making cuts is not possible. Labour can rightly point to the complete waste from the Tories that was the PPE contract during covid and the NHS computer system and thats great for political points scoring, but that isnt going to fix the problems we have today.
 
Kompany Car said:
Im confused regarding Labours policy regarding taxation.

Its apparent that we need to spend money to fix the mess this country is in, however there seems to be a continual changing tone from Labour as regards taxation.

After being heavily critical of Sunak using Capital Gains Tax and previously identifying it as a potential target to raise the tax take, it seem to have been shelved. Likewise according to the Independent this morning there are no plans to change income tax or NI for any workers including those earning over 80k who were going to be targeted.

So where is the money going to come from ?

Councils are already underfunded and unable to provide the necessary public services, likewise with the healthcare system and schools so making cuts is not possible. Labour can rightly point to the complete waste from the Tories that was the PPE contract during covid and the NHS computer system and thats great for political points scoring, but that isnt going to fix the problems we have today.
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Unfortunately, Labour knows that the voters in this country are not grown-up enough to accept that higher taxes may well be needed. They want to believe the naive nonsense that everything can be solved if you cut down on a bit of 'waste'.

One person's 'waste' is another person's 'essential service'. And attempts to 'cut bureaucracy' invariably create more, as Brexit has demonstrated conclusively.

Labour is hoping to see improved growth and pay for everything out of that. But they have ruled out the most obvious route to growth! Selling our stuff to Narnia is a failed dream.
 
TinFoilHat said:
Today would be a good day to attack the Tories for all the building scandals.

Instead Sir Keir is picking his blairite tribute pre general election cabinet.

Maybe after that we'll get some significant policy directions that aren't just Austerity part 3.
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If a future ‘Blairite‘ Cabinet does as much as the real one, I’ll take that.
 
Kompany Car said:
Im confused regarding Labours policy regarding taxation.

Its apparent that we need to spend money to fix the mess this country is in, however there seems to be a continual changing tone from Labour as regards taxation.

After being heavily critical of Sunak using Capital Gains Tax and previously identifying it as a potential target to raise the tax take, it seem to have been shelved. Likewise according to the Independent this morning there are no plans to change income tax or NI for any workers including those earning over 80k who were going to be targeted.

So where is the money going to come from ?

Councils are already underfunded and unable to provide the necessary public services, likewise with the healthcare system and schools so making cuts is not possible. Labour can rightly point to the complete waste from the Tories that was the PPE contract during covid and the NHS computer system and thats great for political points scoring, but that isnt going to fix the problems we have today.
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The problem that Labour have is for credibility reasons they have to appear strong on business and the economy. However the economy is fragile, there is this myth that every single company is rolling around in the casino and making record profits but that's not quite true. They therefore need to be careful when handling business taxes.

It's obviously not true about company profits when we're tinkering right on the brink of recession, if every company was doing amazing then we wouldn't be in recession. Most companies are actually struggling and increased taxation will not raise anything because companies that make little or no profit don't pay any tax at all. Poorly performing companies also don't employ people who also pay tax.

The one thing that must be tackled however is the tax that should be paid by foreign companies. The likes of Amazon are replacing UK companies, many people now for example shop on Amazon and that has destroyed the high street. However, Amazon does not pay taxes in the UK or at least it pays pathetic amounts. I still think that this negative slant on globalisation is what led to Brexit.

Because of its tax arrangements Amazon has a massive competitive advantage over your local paper shop and that must be put right. If it isn't put right then we shouldn't be surprised if many local business stop existing and instead everything is just run by American and other foreign owned companies who put very little back into the UK. Okay it's great for jobs but that's pointless when these companies are hesitant around pay rises and fall down on things like employee wellbeing, this is where the Nordic countries are so successful.

How Labour reconciles these points remains to be seen. I'm still not sure yet whether Starmer is a soft socialist or if he's another Tony Blair but we'll see! Obviously if we put the wars aside then he has my vote if it's the latter.
 
Seems that there‘s no backlash with Angela Rayners move. The brief suits her and I hope she is as feisty in the position that she can really make change.

’Scum’
 
Harry Cole being derogatory and saying that nobody knows the Labour Cabinet. Although playing the initial Starmer game, does he not realise that Labour are spanking the recognised figures from the Tory govenment?
 
The thing is here with Labour does anyone actually know what they stand for anymore? I couldn’t name five key policy’s what they want?
The days of them taking the working class vote are long gone . The nation stands in a right mess , but this lot just slag off the government
Without an answer to what they’d like or how to put things right themselves. The one bright person they had (Lisa Nandy) has been demoted . Been a union branch secretary for 12 years but glad to now say EX branch Secretary. Even the unions fight each other on membership, honestly it’s unreal. I’m no Corbinite far from it
. The infighting is unreal, they think there’ll walk into government I beg to differ.
 
A57 the snake said:
The thing is here with Labour does anyone actually know what they stand for anymore? I couldn’t name five key policy’s what they want?
The days of them taking the working class vote are long gone . The nation stands in a right mess , but this lot just slag off the government
Without an answer to what they’d like or how to put things right themselves. The one bright person they had (Lisa Nandy) has been demoted . Been a union branch secretary for 12 years but glad to now say EX branch Secretary. Even the unions fight each other on membership, honestly it’s unreal. I’m no Corbinite far from it
. The infighting is unreal, they think there’ll walk into government I beg to differ.
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They will get in
It will make things slightly less worse than if the current lot got in again who are astoundingly stupid and corrupt.
In two or three terms they will be out .
Money will be earnt and the trough of the Lords will be waiting.

And bluemooners will be arguing about their record along with all the usual stuff that never changes.
 
hilts said:
They will get in
It will make things slightly less worse than if the current lot got in again who are astoundingly stupid and corrupt.
In two or three terms they will be out .
Money will be earnt and the trough of the Lords will be waiting.

And bluemooners will be arguing about their record along with all the usual stuff that never changes.
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That remains to be seen.

Austerity Reeves preparing us for another fucking without lube says to me were gonna get Cameron style government.
 
TinFoilHat said:
That remains to be seen.

Austerity Reeves preparing us for another fucking without lube says to me were gonna get Cameron style government.
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To what extent we don't know because his supporters, this is hilarious btw, are hoping he has been lying to grab some votes.

How great is that :-) anyhow there is one thing even the most ardent tory would struggle to sell. Labour would be more incompetent. I'm really not sure that's possible.
 
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