HS2 - Birmingham to Manchester scrapped.

Kompany Car said:
You're not wrong, they should have rolled out ERTMS which allows trains to run much closer together. If they had implemented that on the West Coast Mainline and East Coast they could have increased capacity by a good 30% at much lower cost.
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ERTMS does not work.
 
I used to live in Hollingbourne in Kent, next to the Channel Tunnel Rail Link. The work was disruptive. Vibration from the trains affected many properties. The noise is intense from the trains, but short lived due to the speed. Most people using the high speed trains were just business people or holiday makers. The prices were prohibtive for the vast majority who continued to use the usual rail links due to cost. In fact they eventually had two trains running on the line. The high speed train to France and a slightly slower train for commuters etc. Personally am not sure how this project will help as it benefits wealthy business travellers the most.Many people work from home now and the use of Skype type services for meetings is now widely used. I used to travel to Crewe from London and pre-pandemic could get a ticket for £9 on London NorthWestern, The Virgin service was usually about £80..Sure you saved 45 minutes or so..worth it ?? Not for me.
 
Just he honest and tell us HS2 is only being built to Birmingham. Londoners can move there and commute as their own city will become too expensive to live in whilst the oligarchs party; Using their empty properties as tax avoidance zones. Confirming the UK as the Butler of the economic world.
 
Grassland Blue said:
ERTMS does not work.
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It does, they just dont have the balls to roll out Level 3 because of the impact on the workforce. No track circuits to maintain, no lineside signals and deskilling the driver. Yes there is a cost to modifying existing trains, and it will take time but you can operate level 3 in a hybrid way with existing track circuits (as overlay) until all vehicles are retrofitted.

There are loads of metro systems that operate full radio based moving block including the Victoria line, Piccadilly line, Dubai Metro, Metro de Madrid, Guangzhou and Shenzhen Metros.

Its not the technology, its the will to bite the bullet and get on with it.
 
What does delaying actually achieve ? It saves money in year but the longer it goes on increases the overall spend because of inflation not to mention the marching army of designers who will need to be retained. And thats before, if you believe the figures, the lost opportunity cost for businesses and communities along the route.
 
Does this mean they can use the HS2 trains that are now being mothballed on the Ashton Metrolink line on match days? From Piccadilly to the Etihad in 2 seconds.
 
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If anyone is interested in a deeper dive into the status of the government led large infrastructure projects, particularly the number that have moved into amber or red status in the last few years - and the cost estimates - take a gander at this.

The overall topic doesn’t seem to garner much headline attention in Parliament. If I were a party, potentially going to take office in 18 or so months I would be asking questions and raising the profile. The next incumbent is going to inherit a barrow load of shit.

Rees Smug seems to carry this in his Victorian suitcase of responsibilities. What could go wrong!

 
Kompany Car said:
What does delaying actually achieve ? It saves money in year but the longer it goes on increases the overall spend because of inflation not to mention the marching army of designers who will need to be retained. And thats before, if you believe the figures, the lost opportunity cost for businesses and communities along the route.
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Delaying passes the poison chalice of a badly thought out and costed failing project to the next government.
 
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A good few posters predicted this outcome. Another stupendous waste of taxpayers cash.

“Rishi Sunak and Jeremy Hunt are in discussions about scrapping the second stage of the HS2 rail project as costs spiral amid severe delays.

A cost estimate, seen by The Independent, reveals that the government has already spent £2.3bn on stage two of the high-speed railway from Birmingham to Manchester but shelving the northern phase would save up to £34bn.”

‘Cost saving‘ is interesting turn of phrase. In my consulting days this would not be classified as saving but ‘cost avoidance.’

I suppose half of the ‘saving‘ can be directed to refurbishing the Houses of Parliament! I read a decision is due on this shortly. Wonder if we will hear anything on this before the next Election?
 
Whole thing a daft idea to start with. What was the potential saving in time? Was it about 15 minutes off a 1 hour journey to Birmingham and 30 minutes of 2 hour one to Manchester?
 
BeerIsTheBest said:
A good few posters predicted this outcome. Another stupendous waste of taxpayers cash.

“Rishi Sunak and Jeremy Hunt are in discussions about scrapping the second stage of the HS2 rail project as costs spiral amid severe delays.

A cost estimate, seen by The Independent, reveals that the government has already spent £2.3bn on stage two of the high-speed railway from Birmingham to Manchester but shelving the northern phase would save up to £34bn.”

‘Cost saving‘ is interesting turn of phrase. In my consulting days this would not be classified as saving but ‘cost avoidance.’

I suppose half of the ‘saving‘ can be directed to refurbishing the Houses of Parliament! I read a decision is due on this shortly. Wonder if we will hear anything on this before the next Election?
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They need the money for a tax give away before the next election. They've got to keep themselves in power.
 
Hes the left back remember said:
Always thought it wasn't as beneficial as made out to be.
They kept talking about this as part of the Northern levelling up project.
The first and most simple thing they can do is give over 60s free travel on bus and tram as they do in London.
They get free travel on bus and tube!
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Could you imagine what the price of a open peak return would have been?

You could probably fly first class to Sydney for less.
 
Kompany Car said:
They need the money for a tax give away before the next election. They've got to keep themselves in power.
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You are probably depressingly right.

HS2 was always headlined as reduction in travel times. In reality it was more about increasing freight capacity up and down the country.

Dont suppose that it such an imperative now seeing as the nasties have destroyed so much.

Not so much to move too and from that smelly area above Watford you see
 
In 10 years people will be looking back at this like Nick Clegg's genius idea to not build nuclear power plants in 2010 because they were expensive and wouldn't come online until 2022.

We need high speed rail infrastructure in this country, and it will never be cheaper to build in the future.
 
domalino said:
In 10 years people will be looking back at this like Nick Clegg's genius idea to not build nuclear power plants in 2010 because they were expensive and wouldn't come online until 2022.

We need high speed rail infrastructure in this country, and it will never be cheaper to build in the future.
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It wouldnt have been affordable to most anyway.

Zoom has lessened the need for HS2.
 
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