Middle East Conflict

Prestwich_Blue said:
How do you "make peace" with people whose proclaimed and unashamed aim is to wipe you out?
Click to expand...
You can not..but come on.. The Palestinians in Gaza have no control on borders, water, power etc, live in one of the mostly densely populated areas on earth in atrocious conditions. Did the Jews commit acts of terrorism, yes they did as at the St Davids Hotel massacre.You will likely argue that they were not Israeli as the state did not then exist.Perhaps precursors though.Indeed Palestinians also made it difficcult for the Brits and of course that is why they left. After the Oslo accords, the idea was that after 5 years the West bank was supposed to be under Palestinian control. If you look at Area C in the West Bank,which is the area now under Israeli control, it is very clear that they were allowed the most fertile areas for themselves.Where is the fairness in that? No wonder people get aggrieved. No wonder they perhaps voted for Hamas in 2007 as they saw no way out. Hamas clearly are terrorists and I do not condone their wishes and I believe any sensible person can see that,but Israel too has played a big part in this mess. But I do expect more from you as a well respected poster calling people morons, too many cliches..etc. call people out and debate, but perhaps debate with a modicum of decency.
 
dublinblue12 said:
I think and hope no one on here will argue that hamas are diabolical - I have not seen a single post on here argue they are anything but that. Just in case you are misinterpreting anybodys condemnation of the barbaric war crimes - such as cutting off the populations water supply - that the Israel regime are committing in Gaza, with that
Click to expand...
Maybe you will tell us about another way to get them to release the 200 abductees? By the way, civilians also participated in the kidnapping, full of hatred who looted, raped and kidnapped
 
What is needed now is a real push by the influential Western and Asian nations to a new solution.


my thoughs on it

the two state idea is dead in the water and the 3 state solution involving Egypt and Jordan something they don't want the hassle of.

But 3 states is what we effectively have at the minute
Israel
Gaza
The West Bank

So maybe it is time to officially regonise all as 3 soverign nations

The country of Israel which exists and should continue to.
The West Bank officially recognised as the country of Palestine, full nation status and given real aid to create a properous functioning nation free on it's reliance on others.
Gaza temperarlly mandated under UN supervision recognised as the country of Gaza-palestina(or something else), the sea and land blockades banned their mediteranian coastline free from blockade to trade and tap into the gaza marine oil reserves, creation of salination plants to get water from the med and end reliance on or fear of their neighbours.
I would sugest leading arab league nations like UAE, Qatar who have ok relations with Israel etc lead the rebuild and structural formation of an elected government with western aid supporting but no percieved US/European medling.

All israeli military would be required to leave and recognise the soviegnty of both new countries, incursions and settlements stopped and unoccupy the golan heights and and the 2 palestinain nations would in turn do the same and recognise the teritories and borders as is and Israel officially as a neighbourimg country and not invade or attack.

It isn' that simple unfortunately but as long as the world is ambiguous on what this area of the levant is globally and now take sides to suit themselves then this will never end.
only a United Global effort of cooperation on both sides will solve this, not a pick a side and let them at each other as has been going on
 
Last edited:
Over 1'700 Children killed in Gaza and that's without the Ones buried under the rubble. Truly staggering number which is only going too rise.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Just seen this story on the BBC website about crocodile attacks in Indonesia.

www.bbc.co.uk

Why Indonesia can’t stop crocodile attacks

The country sees the most crocodile attacks in the world - and the problem could get even worse.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

Perhaps if the Indonesian people were nice to the crocodiles, invited them into their villages for feasts and gave them the vote, instead of killing them when they attack, they'd all be great friends and live alongside each other in peace and harmony.
Click to expand...
This isn’t a great post.

Palestinians aren’t reptiles that need to kill their prey for food.

Even if you believe it’s a great analogy, it’s not going to help the discourse in here at all, is it, so it’s pretty much baiting the people you don’t agree with.
 
MouldensChippy said:
Now you're just being purposely obtuse.

You really reckon that people sworn to wipe Israel out would suddenly become good natured, and productive members of Israeli society ?
Your delusion goes seems to know no bounds, or sense.
Click to expand...

If we can get Martin McGuinness from fighting the British Army in Northern Ireland to having tea with the Queen, who knows what we can achieve?

And much as we rake over the past, the future is taking shape to be more of the bloody same unless someone breaks the pattern.

Israel has no viable policy towards Gaza and the Palestinians. All Israel guarantees is more Israeli and Palestinian deaths. Hamas is equally committed to the same senseless path.

Refusal to try a different path is the real cowardice and the political leadership on both sides, not the ordinary Israelis or Palestinians, should be judged harshly for their respective failures.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Just seen this story on the BBC website about crocodile attacks in Indonesia.

www.bbc.co.uk

Why Indonesia can’t stop crocodile attacks

The country sees the most crocodile attacks in the world - and the problem could get even worse.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

Perhaps if the Indonesian people were nice to the crocodiles, invited them into their villages for feasts and gave them the vote, instead of killing them when they attack, they'd all be great friends and live alongside each other in peace and harmony.
Click to expand...

Did you mean to dehumanise the Palestinians?

I suppose it's better than rats or cockroaches.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Just seen this story on the BBC website about crocodile attacks in Indonesia.

www.bbc.co.uk

Why Indonesia can’t stop crocodile attacks

The country sees the most crocodile attacks in the world - and the problem could get even worse.
www.bbc.co.uk www.bbc.co.uk

Perhaps if the Indonesian people were nice to the crocodiles, invited them into their villages for feasts and gave them the vote, instead of killing them when they attack, they'd all be great friends and live alongside each other in peace and harmony.
Click to expand...
Er... the problem is that people have occupied the crocodiles' territory....
 
Alan Harper's Tash said:
This isn’t a great post.

Palestinians aren’t reptiles that need to kill their prey for food.

Even if you believe it’s a great analogy, it’s not going to help the discourse in here at all, is it, so it’s pretty much baiting the people you don’t agree with.
Click to expand...
Hamas don't want a two-state solution. They want a one-state solution that doesn't involve any Jews, or even anyone who opposes them or who otherwise doesn't meet their views of what a society ruled by them should look like. No LGBT people, women as second class citizens, only one religion and one set of political beliefs.

And that's not some Islamophobic fantasy, because we've already seen it for real with their ideological brothers in ISIS and the Taliban. I'd say that the majority of Palestinians would swap Hamas for peace at this moment but they don't get that option.

Yet it's amazing how many on here decry Israeli violations of human rights while being happy to support organisations, or the aims of organisations, like Hamas. Funny how standards and principles get turned on their heads when it's Jews/Israelis involved.
 
Last edited:
salfordbluetrue said:
I can understand your anger, but there is no justice in life it is survival of the fittest, there is only one way to win, and that is financially, America has for decades split the Muslim world, but they are weak now, they are losing the economic war with China. Stop using American financial institutions, stop using American goods, and you have a chance of bringing America and Israel to their knees. Time to unite in understanding not violence.
Click to expand...


It's best to buy Chinese after all they are friends with their own Muslims aren't they?
 
Mr Kobayashi said:
Did you mean to dehumanise the Palestinians?

I suppose it's better than rats or cockroaches.
Click to expand...

This lasted all of 5 minutes.

Mr Kobayashi said:
You are allowed free reign to insult people on here and favoured but you won't be engaged with further by myself. In my opinion you are a zealot who has played a very sly game.
Click to expand...

Why don’t you put each other on ignore as I don’t think either is likely to convince the other and it’s all rather circular at this stage.
 
goalmole said:
It will not end until the Palestinians get justice.
Click to expand...
It will not end until the people in Israel and Palestine realise the future is more important than the past.

Look at other long runnung conflicts that have reached a resolution such as Ireland, South Africa or Colombia, "justice" has not been served for individual or collective crimes in these conflicts. A willingness to let go of bitterness and anger and to focus on a future without violence, hatred and division has been the key factor.

The insistence on retribution, the regurgitating of past wrongs and opening up of old wounds will do nothing to advance peace in the middle east (or the quality of this thread!).
 
This was written over a week ago but gives a bit of context. It's silent on the Israeli retaliation in Gaza.

blogs.timesofisrael.com

Who will we be when we rise from the ashes?

Novelist David Grossman: Are we capable of understanding that what has occurred here is too immense and too terrible to be viewed through stale paradigms?
blogs.timesofisrael.com blogs.timesofisrael.com
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Hamas don't want a two-state solution. They want a one-state solution that doesn't involve any Jews, or even anyone who opposes them or who otherwise doesn't meet their views of what a society ruled by them should look like. No LGBT people, women as second class citizens, only one religion and one set of political beliefs.

And that's not some Islamophobic fantasy, because we've already seen it for real with their ideological brothers in ISIS and the Taliban. I'd say that the majority of Palestinians would swap Hamas for peace at this moment but they don't get that option.

Yet it's amazing how many on here decry Israeli violations of human rights while beimg happy to support organisations like Hamas. Funny how standards and principles get turned on their heads when it's Jews/Israelis involved.
Click to expand...
That doesn’t make them crocodiles though.

Imagine if someone called a religious people as less than human, or maybe described them as rats.

How would that make you feel and respond on here?

I‘d assume you’d be advocating permanent bans, wouldn’t you?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top