US Presidential Election, Nov 5th 2024

[Blue Maverick]

The biggest thing I take from all this is that it doesn’t matter who you are what you do as long as the price of eggs come down they’ll vote for you. They don’t give a fuck about anyone but themselves and that seems the way of the world at the moment sadly I’d give the human race 100 years at most unless that changes

 

[I'm With Stupid]

Maybe he talking about his succesfull partnership with, doesn't mean it translate to actual election results.

Anyway seeing this snippet of interview.



I can't understand why Trump is able to reach this many minority and articulate people to vote for him.

I mean are you really posting shit like that as if it's anything other than a highly edited sample designed to support one particular narrative? You might as well 'prove' that all Americans are stupid by posting that guy who asks people simple maths and geography questions in the street and then only uploads the people who can't answer them.

 

[bugsyblue]

The biggest thing I take from all this is that it doesn’t matter who you are what you do as long as the price of eggs come down they’ll vote for you. They don’t give a fuck about anyone but themselves and that seems the way of the world at the moment sadly I’d give the human race 100 years at most unless that changes

Does that really surprise you? It’s the most capitalist, materialistic, individualistic country in the world. They will become much more nationalist and isolationist under trump. It will be to the detriment of the world. I just hope it doesn’t embolden and empower the Russia, china, Iran axis to do what the fuck they want because it will become very dangerous for Europe. But I would love for us to move away from the US and back closer to Europe. There’s still a sense of community and togetherness in Europe that the US simply doesn’t have beyond nationalist pride and the whole “team America” shit.

I’ve never understood this desire to have more money in your pocket and pay less taxes if it makes where you live, your community, your services and social institutions around you worse off. I remember spending time in Cape Town and being like wow this is beautiful but then you realise it’s beauty behind an electric fence. I don’t want live somewhere that has that type of inequality and that’s the road we are going down. That’s the American dream.

 

[franksinatra]

An interesting listen if anyone can be arsed. Good impartial analysis of both sides of US politics this week.
Congrats to all on this thread since the election result for actually maintaining a level of debate / discussion btw - particularly @FogBlueInSanFran for who I know this is all very personal. A few others have disappeared who have stalked this thread calling for bans, accusing anyone who doesn't agree with them of being trumpers, nazi enablers etc and generally presenting abuse as an argument. I don't think the discussion has suffered from their sudden absence.

Been following this podcast for a while and it’s very entertaining as well as very informative and provides snippets of information from pretty much every corner of the globe.

Great listen also is the Rest is Politics USA which I have also followed leading up to the election.

 

[inbetween]

Does that really surprise you? It’s the most capitalist, materialistic, individualistic country in the world. They will become much more nationalist and isolationist under trump. It will be to the detriment of the world. I just hope it doesn’t embolden and empower the Russia, china, Iran axis to do what the fuck they want because it will become very dangerous for Europe. But I would love for us to move away from the US and back closer to Europe. There’s still a sense of community and togetherness in Europe that the US simply doesn’t have beyond nationalist pride and the whole “team America” shit.

I’ve never understood this desire to have more money in your pocket and pay less taxes if it makes where you live, your community, your services and social institutions around you worse off. I remember spending time in Cape Town and being like wow this is beautiful but then you realise it’s beauty behind an electric fence. I don’t want live somewhere that has that type of inequality and that’s the road we are going down. That’s the American dream.

But when you vote do you not vote to better your own situation? The reason we're heading down this road is because of the views of the electorate and not capitalism or anything else. Labour literally had to promise not to raise taxes on the general population to get elected so whose fault is it really?

I don't know why politicians can't just be honest, do the maths and say we'll raise taxes moderately on everyone because that's how it works in Europe. Just say what we need to pay, prove what it'll be spent on and then deliver it. If people then vote for the Tories and everything breaks then as a politician I'd say well we told you so. Labour here are now working in an impossible financial climate because of their lies and stupid promises, it doesn't have to be this way.

The biggest thing lacking in our politics is honesty. It'll be the same in the US because it didn't actually matter who they voted for. Neither was honest and neither has the appetite to solve the problems that face Americans. So of course they're going to vote for the crazy orange man who was the only option to give the political elite a kicking.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

The biggest thing I take from all this is that it doesn’t matter who you are what you do as long as the price of eggs come down they’ll vote for you. They don’t give a fuck about anyone but themselves and that seems the way of the world at the moment sadly I’d give the human race 100 years at most unless that changes

How has wealth distribution in the US changed over time? | USAFacts

The highest-earning Americans have increased their share of wealth over the past three decades, while the middle class has been losing its share.

usafacts.org

My working hypothesis is that income distribution has a lot to do with it.

From the quoted article:
"The 60% of income earners between the top and bottom quintiles — commonly referred to as America’s middle class — have seen their share of wealth diminish since 1990. Over the past three decades, this group’s share of total wealth fell to 26% from 37%."

Without having studied this issue in any detail whatsoever, my perception is that populism is on the rise globally because the distribution of wealth has become so imbalanced that the majority of voters are rightly upset and demand change. Populist governments won't address the imbalance - but their leaders promise to do so and feed on the unrest that income inequality generates.

I'm a big believer in free-market capitalism and that government should avoid mucking with companies insofar as possible. Income inequality, IMO, should be addressed through a system of taxation, raising the minimum wage, etc.

Should my hypothesis prove correct, then we're in a quandary here in the States. Dems that want to increase taxes and redistribute wealth that way, or even to increase the minimum wage... whatever - are demonized by Republicans and so even if such policy changes might work, the populists won't put them into place.

 

[west didsblue]

Young american boys and girls who are living in Europe are incredibly educated.

All of them. Democrats or republicans or apolitical. From Texas or from New York.

Calm, interested in local culture, respectful, mature...

Being interested in politics is a sign of intelligence.

I have a theory that they are youngs guys whose parents are economically middle class or upper class and that is why they have the opportunity to live a year or two in Europe. It is impossible for ALL young Americans to be like this.

20 years ago when I was young, I saw the difference between an American girl and a Spanish girl.

American girls very educated, fascinated by the European world and for the local culture where they were living, capable of feeling INTELLECTUAL ATTRACTION FOR A MAN...

Spanish girls don't give a shit cultures or policy, just giving drama and being attracted for "garrulos" (garrulo = Sergio Ramos, Wayne Rooney, Eminem... you understand the concept).


The stereotype that Americans are uneducated is ABSOLUTELY FALSE.

The ones that are educated are more likely to travel and see the world. That applies whether they are American, Spanish or any other nationality.

 

[bugsyblue]

But when you vote do you not vote to better your own situation? The reason we're heading down this road is because of the views of the electorate and not capitalism or anything else. Labour literally had to promise not to raise taxes on the general population to get elected so whose fault is it really?

I don't know why politicians can't just be honest, do the maths and say we'll raise taxes moderately on everyone because that's how it works in Europe. Just say what we need to pay, prove what it'll be spent on and then deliver it. If people then vote for the Tories and everything breaks then as a politician I'd say well we told you so. Labour here are now working in an impossible financial climate because of their lies and stupid promises, it doesn't have to be this way.

The biggest thing lacking in our politics is honesty. It'll be the same in the US because it didn't actually matter who they voted for. Neither was honest and neither has the appetite to solve the problems that face Americans. So of course they're going to vote for the crazy orange man who was the only option to give the political elite a kicking.

Well depends what you mean by "better my situation". I am lucky in that my job pays me a much higher than average salary but I voted labour and believe in higher taxes. That absolutely hinders me financially. BUT I do it because I want my wife and children to live in a more equal world. I want better public services. I want less crime. Better NHS and education etc. And they need funding. So yes in a way I guess we are all selfish but with the key difference I want to live in a world where my friends and neighbours all have a quality of life, a base level, and if that makes me financially poorer I would rather that. I don't think everyone has that view though.

 

[BlueHammer85]

Yet why Democrat with them having the biggest donations and almost traditional big media sides with them can't destroy this trump narrative?

Why the Democrat suck to prevent Trump rise to become President again?

Elon Musk and Twitter.


There was also an "explosion" in trends that have existed before, "but not to this extent", Prof Lichtman said.

"Disinformation - you know, Elon Musk... has been the director of misinformation, two billion views of his spreading of disinformation, not just about the economy but about immigrants, about minorities. We've never seen disinformation at this scale," he said.

 

[ashleycaulcott1]

People can have any opinion they want on Trump I get it. However the guy survived an assassination attempt and still carried on fighting for what he believes in.

Stupidity or not you cant fault that.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

People can have any opinion they want on Trump I get it. However the guy survived an assassination attempt and still carried on fighting for what he believes in.

Stupidity or not you cant fault that.

Huh?

How does survival of (actually two that we know about) assassination attempts make Trump either more or less qualified for President.

No. It's entirely orthogonal.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Laughable...



The Guardian has completely lost the plot, it lost it a long time ago.

 

[west didsblue]

Elon Musk and Twitter.


There was also an "explosion" in trends that have existed before, "but not to this extent", Prof Lichtman said.

"Disinformation - you know, Elon Musk... has been the director of misinformation, two billion views of his spreading of disinformation, not just about the economy but about immigrants, about minorities. We've never seen disinformation at this scale," he said.

Seems clear to me that Musk is the Goebbels of MAGA. And he’s been very successful in his role.
What looks likely is that he will be the puppet master of the incoming administration. Trump is in awe of him because of his vast wealth and we all know that Trump can be bought by anyone willing to flash the cash.
Worrying times if Musk becomes the de facto president behind the scenes.

 

[ashleycaulcott1]

Huh?

How does survival of (actually two that we know about) assassination attempts make Trump either more or less qualified for President.

No. It's entirely orthogonal.

Where in my message does it state having an attempted assassination put on him makes him more qualified for presidency?

I simply stated regardless of people’s opinion on him, no one can simply fault his desire and commitment to his cause after what had happened with the will to carry on fighting for what he believes.

An awful lot of people in the world will be happy with his presidency.

Since his presidency ended, the middle east agreed which he worked hard to get to have been shattered, Russia has invaded Ukraine, N Korea is now fighting along side. Most of these issues , Trump had under control.

 

[Uncle Wally One Ball]

Where in my message does it state having an attempted assassination put on him makes him more qualified for presidency?

I simply stated regardless of people’s opinion on him, no one can simply fault his desire and commitment to his cause after what had happened with the will to carry on fighting for what he believes.

An awful lot of people in the world will be happy with his presidency.

Since his presidency ended, the middle east agreed which he worked hard to get to have been shattered, Russia has invaded Ukraine, N Korea is now fighting along side. Most of these issues , Trump had under control.

Mate, he had to carry on, otherwise he could well have ended up in jail

 

[Scottyboi]

Where in my message does it state having an attempted assassination put on him makes him more qualified for presidency?

I simply stated regardless of people’s opinion on him, no one can simply fault his desire and commitment to his cause after what had happened with the will to carry on fighting for what he believes.

An awful lot of people in the world will be happy with his presidency.

Since his presidency ended, the middle east agreed which he worked hard to get to have been shattered, Russia has invaded Ukraine, N Korea is now fighting along side. Most of these issues , Trump had under control.

He assassinated an Iranian General and torpedoed the diplomatic efforts Obama had made with Iran and drove them into the arms of Russia. He put the US embassy in Jerusalem which emboldened Israel and pissed off hamas. Putin had planned to invade Ukraine earlier but covid stopped him, Trump would have given him all of Ukraine no questions asked. Living in fantasy land, had them under control, he helped lay the groundwork for what has happened since.

 

[ashleycaulcott1]

Heres a question,
Biden got 81 million votes in 2020, Trump 74.

Harris - 69 million votes 2024, Trump 74 again pretty much.

So Trump has performed pretty much the same, but for a democrat point of view where have 12 million votes gone? Thin air?

 

[halfcenturyup]

Elon Musk and Twitter.


There was also an "explosion" in trends that have existed before, "but not to this extent", Prof Lichtman said.

"Disinformation - you know, Elon Musk... has been the director of misinformation, two billion views of his spreading of disinformation, not just about the economy but about immigrants, about minorities. We've never seen disinformation at this scale," he said.

Amazing how all these academics can tell us now why what happened happened. But nobody could interpret the signs and see it before it happened.

I had asked for some introspection on here these last few weeks and there was none. Even now, there isn't much. If this is typical of democrat thinking, they will be out of power for a long while unless Trump tanks everything or the democrats find themselves a new Obama. A heterosexual one, obviously.

What a country.

 

[bugsyblue]

Laughable...



The Guardian has completely lost the plot, it lost it a long time ago.

Fuck me, I like a lot about the guardian and the level of journalism and research that goes into articles (non-opinion articles that is, some of the gonzo journalism stuff is cringe) is a level above most publications but this can't be true. I mean come on.

 

[BlueMoonAcrossThePond]

Amazing how all these academics can tell us now why what happened happened. But nobody could interpret the signs and see it before it happened.

I had asked for some introspection on here these last few weeks and there was none. Even now, there isn't much. If this is typical of democrat thinking, they will be out of power for a long while unless Trump tanks everything or the democrats find themselves a new Obama. A heterosexual one, obviously.

What a country.

It's difficult to diagnose with any certainty what's going on in any country and what to expect. It's not a lab where you can change variables, observe outcomes, and then repeat the original experiment with new parameters. It's a guessing game.

I've maintained that income inequality explains most happenings, not only in the USA, but globally. It's an untestable hypothesis though - of course - and moves from the realm of science to that of (hopefully) informed speculation.