The Labour Government

[Postman Pep]

All together now!

Things can only get better...

League tables .... very on brand

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

You thought they were going to snap their fingers and hey presto 14 years of shit disappears? There are clearly some structural faults in the economy that need to be rebuilt. I'd rather it is done properly than quickly. The GDP figures are very disappointing but not wholly surprising bearing in mind it is the "summer" quarter, which is not usually a period that produces significant growth. It's good to see more acknowledgement that Brexit is having a pretty major negative impact on the economy though. It'll be interesting to see how this develops as even the most ardent leavers are no longer claiming it to be a success.

So you are saying this dip is down to long term structural faults in the economy and us leaving the EU 4 years ago. Umm I'm not so sure personally.

We all agree that Reeves has to grow the economy to improve things. I am just concerned she has leveraged too much heavy tax on the very machine that grows the economy, SMEs. While big buiness that contributes disproportionately much less to the economy has got off scot free yet again. I would have liked to seen the economy growing significantly and tax rises brought in gradually, so less shocks.

Those rises that will arrive in the spring will be very steep and combined with Trumps threatened tarriffs have already brought considerable uncertainty to buiness investment and markets.

Confidence is also very important to business, and this hasn't been helped by Andrew Bailey the past few years. He has been a very poor BofE Governor, he has consistently talked the UK economy down and got many of his economic predictions significantly wrong. Reeves would do well to remove him from his post and replace him with a competant individual.

But the proof of the pudding will be in the eating and it is very early days. My post was just an observation on today's announcements and the difficult challenges the new governement faces.

 

[hampshireblue]

So you are saying this dip is down to long term structural faults in the economy and us leaving the EU 4 years ago. Umm I'm not so sure personally.

We all agree that Reeves has to grow the economy to improve things. I am just concerned she has leveraged too much heavy tax on the very machine that grows the economy, SMEs. While big buiness that contributes disproportionately much less to the economy has got off scot free yet again. I would have liked to seen the economy growing significantly and tax rises brought in gradually, so less shocks.

Those rises that will arrive in the spring will be very steep and combined with Trumps threatened tarriffs have already brought considerable uncertainty to buiness investment and markets.

Confidence is also very important to business, and this hasn't been helped by Andrew Bailey the past few years. He has been a very poor BofE Governor, he has consistently talked the UK economy down and got many of his economic predictions significantly wrong. Reeves would do well to remove him from his post and replace him with a competant individual.

But the proof of the pudding will be in the eating and it is very early days. My post was just an observation today's announcements and the difficult challenges the new governement faces.

The "dip" you refer to are 3 indicators, YOU have chosen over YOUR timescales. I don't know whether you voted to leave or remain, but the fact is the economy is damaged by around 4% per year. If that was not the case, the HMG coffers would be better than they are now, and the difficult decisions that are being taken( and I don't agree with all of them, and I will be affected by one in particular) may not have been necessary.

I'm 50/50 on Bailey, but I still find it amazing that he still won't come out and say that Brexit has damaged us and sits on the fence. His job is to set conditions for the economy to grow and being totally honest about why we are where we are is just cowardly, especially since Labour got in.

As you say, let's see what happens in the medium term, but if we are still not seeing improvements a year from now, then a re-think may be required. That timescale is probably sensible considering what's happening in Trumpsville.

 

[west didsblue]

So you are saying this dip is down to long term structural faults in the economy and us leaving the EU 4 years ago. Umm I'm not so sure personally.

We all agree that Reeves has to grow the economy to improve things. I am just concerned she has leveraged too much heavy tax on the very machine that grows the economy, SMEs. While big buiness that contributes disproportionately much less to the economy has got off scot free yet again. I would have liked to seen the economy growing significantly and tax rises brought in gradually, so less shocks.

Those rises that will arrive in the spring will be very steep and combined with Trumps threatened tarriffs have already brought considerable uncertainty to buiness investment and markets.

Confidence is also very important to business, and this hasn't been helped by Andrew Bailey the past few years. He has been a very poor BofE Governor, he has consistently talked the UK economy down and got many of his economic predictions significantly wrong. Reeves would do well to remove him from his post and replace him with a competant individual.

But the proof of the pudding will be in the eating and it is very early days. My post was just an observation on today's announcements and the difficult challenges the new governement faces.

Not sure where you’re getting this idea about big business getting off scot free. The increase in employer’s NI will predominantly be picked up by big business. Small enterprises have various reliefs that offset the increase. There will be some in the middle just above the threshold where the reliefs don’t offset the increases that will be hit but it’s not true to say they're carrying most of the burden.

 

[TinFoilHat]

Robot Reeves freeing the bankers to fuck us harder. I wonder how many contribute to her donations pool.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Not sure where you’re getting this idea about big business getting off scot free. The increase in employer’s NI will predominantly be picked up by big business. Small enterprises have various reliefs that offset the increase. There will be some in the middle just above the threshold where the reliefs don’t offset the increases that will be hit but it’s not true to say they're carrying most of the burden.

The reliefs you speak of wont make up any real difference on the significant tax hike on most SMEs. It was effectively a token gesture for most.

Regarding big business, I mean as a proportion of their income they pay less than SMEs. I run an SME and pay all the required tax. Of course they pay employers NI but there are other taxes and big business use legal loopholes to avoid these. The FTSE100 pay next to zero corporation tax in the UK. Then throw in the likes of the international Internet business's that don't pay any VAT on trade done in the UK on top of not paying any corporation tax. It's pretty clear the advantages they have.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

The "dip" you refer to are 3 indicators, YOU have chosen over YOUR timescales. I don't know whether you voted to leave or remain, but the fact is the economy is damaged by around 4% per year. If that was not the case, the HMG coffers would be better than they are now, and the difficult decisions that are being taken( and I don't agree with all of them, and I will be affected by one in particular) may not have been necessary.

I'm 50/50 on Bailey, but I still find it amazing that he still won't come out and say that Brexit has damaged us and sits on the fence. His job is to set conditions for the economy to grow and being totally honest about why we are where we are is just cowardly, especially since Labour got in.

As you say, let's see what happens in the medium term, but if we are still not seeing improvements a year from now, then a re-think may be required. That timescale is probably sensible considering what's happening in Trumpsville.

"My timescales" were clearly set, so to speak by the ONS who published growth figures today. It's a snapshot of the first three months of the new government, nothing more nothing less.

 

[hilts]

The reliefs you speak of wont make up any real difference on the significant tax hike on most SMEs. It was effectively a token gesture for most.

Regarding big business, I mean as a proportion of their income they pay less than SMEs. I run an SME and pay all the required tax. Of course they pay employers NI but there are other taxes and big business use legal loopholes to avoid these. The FTSE100 pay next to zero corporation tax in the UK. Then throw in the likes of the international Internet business's that don't pay any VAT on trade done in the UK on top of not paying any corporation tax. It's pretty clear the advantages they have.

The fake reds always liked to have a pop at big business and how little they contributed compared to what would be fair.

I just can't put my finger on why the sudden change of attitude and colour happened. It seemed to be literally over night. I'm sure a purple will clear it up for us though.

What was that date? Could have been Thursday? Anyone?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

The "dip" you refer to are 3 indicators, YOU have chosen over YOUR timescales. I don't know whether you voted to leave or remain, but the fact is the economy is damaged by around 4% per year. If that was not the case, the HMG coffers would be better than they are now, and the difficult decisions that are being taken( and I don't agree with all of them, and I will be affected by one in particular) may not have been necessary.

I'm 50/50 on Bailey, but I still find it amazing that he still won't come out and say that Brexit has damaged us and sits on the fence. His job is to set conditions for the economy to grow and being totally honest about why we are where we are is just cowardly, especially since Labour got in.

As you say, let's see what happens in the medium term, but if we are still not seeing improvements a year from now, then a re-think may be required. That timescale is probably sensible considering what's happening in Trumpsville.

I might add that you might not be concerned by these latest figures ? but it gives me some comfort that our Chancellor Reeves has stated this morning that she is concerned, as they are clearly important.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

The fake reds always liked to have a pop at big business and how little they contributed compared to what would be fair.

I just can't put my finger on why the sudden change of attitude and colour happened. It seemed to be literally over night. I'm sure a purple will clear it up for us though.

What was that date? Could have been Thursday? Anyone?

Fake reds?? Sorry I don't follow.

 

[hampshireblue]

"My timescales" were clearly set, so to speak by the ONS who published growth figures today. It's a snapshot of the first three months of the new government, nothing more nothing less.

So one of the timescales you quoted was set. The other 2, you chose. I could choose the FTSE over a year-up 7.81% (still not good) or GBP to USD up 2% over a year. As it is, GBP to USD is exactly the same as it was on July 5th and the FTSE very slightly down over the same period.

 

[hampshireblue]

I might add that you might not be concerned by these latest figures ? but it gives me some comfort that our Chancellor Reeves has stated this morning that she is concerned, as they are clearly important.

She is right to be concerned about the low growth figure. I didn't hear her conflate it with the other 2 parameters you chose to throw into the mix. Anyway, let's hope we start to see some improvements over the next few months.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

So one of the timescales you quoted was set. The other 2, you chose. I could choose the FTSE over a year-up 7.81% (still not good) or GBP to USD up 2% over a year. As it is, GBP to USD is exactly the same as it was on July 5th and the FTSE very slightly down over the same period.

Oh let it go for goodness sake, its surely a minor point. So what if it's my timescales it's my post! Do you really want to point score on trivia rather than discuss the issues at hand in a mature way ? Happy for you to offer an alternative timescale for the new government but I suspect you may struggle?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

She is right to be concerned about the low growth figure. I didn't hear her conflate it with the other 2 parameters you chose to throw into the mix. Anyway, let's hope we start to see some improvements over the next few months.

But you're not concerned? Or have you changed your tune since Reeves statement?

 

[west didsblue]

The reliefs you speak of wont make up any real difference on the significant tax hike on most SMEs. It was effectively a token gesture for most.

Regarding big business, I mean as a proportion of their income they pay less than SMEs. I run an SME and pay all the required tax. Of course they pay employers NI but there are other taxes and big business use legal loopholes to avoid these. The FTSE100 pay next to zero corporation tax in the UK. Then throw in the likes of the international Internet business's that don't pay any VAT on trade done in the UK on top of not paying any corporation tax. It's pretty clear the advantages they have.

Your first paragraph just isn’t true. There are 1.6 million employers in the UK of which 1 million will end up paying less or the same. There are just 8000 large employers that employ 40% of the workforce.

The businesses under the most pressure are those medium size companies that are just about keeping afloat now. If your business is one of those you have my sympathies but it’s not true to say it’s the same problem for nearly all SMEs because it clearly isn’t.

 

[hampshireblue]

Oh let it go for goodness sake, its surely a minor point. So what if it's my timescales it's my post! Do you really want to point score on trivia rather than discuss the issues at hand in a mature way ? Happy for you to offer an alternative timescale for the new government but I suspect you may struggle?

Yes. It is a minor point and your post, but, you choose to put it on a public forum giving the impression low growth, currency down and stock market down are all the fault of Labour without any supporting evidence for at least 2 of the indicators. Don't get arsey if someone chooses not to accept and challenge your assertions on said public forum. And in reply to your question, yes, I am concerned about low growth.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Your first paragraph just isn’t true. There are 1.6 million employers in the UK of which 1 million will end up paying less or the same. There are just 8000 large employers that employ 40% of the workforce.

The businesses under the most pressure are those medium size companies that are just about keeping afloat now. If your business is one of those you have my sympathies but it’s not true to say it’s the same problem for nearly all SMEs because it clearly isn’t.

We shall have to agree to dissagree on the above.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Yes. It is a minor point and your post, but, you choose to put it on a public forum giving the impression low growth, currency down and stock market down are all the fault of Labour without any supporting evidence for at least 2 of the indicators. Don't get arsey if someone chooses not to accept and challenge your assertions on said public forum. And in reply to your question, yes, I am concerned about low growth.

They weren't assumptions they were facts. Economic facts over a timescale chosen by me, which strangely as it seems, references the current government on their thread. I also clearly stated that it was early days and there were other factors at large. I also stated it was an observation, despite you trying to twist things.

As stated im happy for you to contribute to the debate by offering up other economic indicators for the last three months or another timescale for the new government ?

 

[hilts]

Fake reds?? Sorry I don't follow.

We had a fair few centrists' of a Labour persuasion who for years followed a certain socialist mantra things like

Look after the elderly our pensions ate too low
Austerity is a ideological choice not a necessity
Politicians should be truthful, honest and not lining their pockets

Then their party got in and they discarded it all, hence false reds.

The purples.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

We had a fair few centrists' of a Labour persuasion who for years followed a certain socialist mantra things like

Look after the elderly our pensions ate too low
Austerity is a ideological choice not a necessity
Politicians should be truthful, honest and not lining their pockets

Then their party got in and they discarded it all, hence false reds.

The purples.

None of which are socialist traits.