President Trump

blueparrot said:
Just had an American couple in my shop, and obviously didn't bring politics up with them Got me wondering though whether Americans living and working in Europe have experienced any detrimental effects on how they are treated due to Trumps actions.
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If not yet, I’d say it is inevitably coming.
 
blueparrot said:
Just had an American couple in my shop, and obviously didn't bring politics up with them Got me wondering though whether Americans living and working in Europe have experienced any detrimental effects on how they are treated due to Trumps actions.
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I would hope not.

Nearly half of those that voted, didn't vote for Trump and I suspect the majority that actually do travel the world are likely to be those that don't support him.

I hope we are a bit more civilised than to blame all Americans for the actions of a few. Of course if they are vocally pro-Trump, then it is a lot more likely.
 
PragueBlue said:
I would hope not.

Nearly half of those that voted, didn't vote for Trump and I suspect the majority that actually do travel the world are likely to be those that don't support him.

I hope we are a bit more civilised than to blame all Americans for the actions of a few. Of course if they are vocally pro-Trump, then it is a lot more likely.
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Yep, I've known a lot of Americans living outside the US and I can't say I've ever met a single one that wasn't obviously liberal (or what they like to call liberal anyway).
 
PragueBlue said:
I would hope not.

Nearly half of those that voted, didn't vote for Trump and I suspect the majority that actually do travel the world are likely to be those that don't support him.

I hope we are a bit more civilised than to blame all Americans for the actions of a few. Of course if they are vocally pro-Trump, then it is a lot more likely.
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They should be OK unless wearing a maga cap
 
ChicagoBlue said:
If anyone is wondering what’s great about America, come and see for yourself!

But, like an American going to “England” and only seeing London, please don’t ONLY go to New York and Orlando, ffs!

See the REAL AMERICA, in all her glory, and not, and meet REAL AMERICANS in the smaller towns that hold the vast majority of our citizens, and you’ll love America for what it is, what it can be, and for all she has been for generations of immigrants who have made good lives here.

Yes, we have our high profile negatives, but they literally have no effect on most people, most of the time. None.

Lastly, ignore politics. Don’t talk about it. Just be human, and smile, and America will smile right back at ya!

Oh, and in case you didn’t know, America is at least 6 or 7 different “countries” rolled into one, so if you do a teeny amount of research, you’ll understand that the NE is nothing like the SW, either in climate, geography, or personality, in ways that Italy isn’t Germany and Spain isn’t Norway.

We are living in a strange time and while 1/5 of Americans elected this idiot, I’d venture 1/3 of them are beginning to realize their big mistakes and another 1/3 have yet to realize it. Don’t paint America with Trump’s brush. He is just passing through.
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I've been to CA, NV, AZ. OH, FL, AL and GA. Never done anything on the East coast. The only major tourist destinations I've been to are LA, Malibu and Santa Monica, but only really passing through on the way to some other destination. I think a lot of UK folk and Europeans in general get a verry narrow view of the states, mainly from Hollywood or TV in general. The US, from what I've seen is very diverse both in terms of eco structure and people. It really is like a collection of smaller countries under one single flag. I'd urge anyone who wants to see a different side of America to seek out Dave Gorman's book/film 'Americ Unchained'.

To understand what is really happening politically over here you have to have an active interest in it and take your information from multiple sources outside of Elmo's Twitter bubble. From experience the majority of US folk I have interacted with usually have a very narrow-minded view of life and rarely seem to understand the wider ramifications of politics. They struggle to understand what's really going on in their own state, let alone world politics. I think in the UK more people have at least a grasp of wider politics. That said, a lot more people over here are starting to sit up and take note.
 
threespires said:
CB as someone who has previously worked in multiple states and with colleagues from across the US who by and large were great people, I can attest to much of the above. That said I think there are some specific things driving the visceral response over here in Europe. I know as an expat and an airline pilot you know this stuff but it's worth contextualising the response over here.

Even if Trump is just passing through he's already causing material damage. Our economies aren't in great shape and his actions are going to directly affect people across Europe.

To your point about relative geographies, his approach to Russia is not a theoretical problem for Europe. To put it into context the difference in distance between Moscow and Berlin isn't much more than say Boston and Chicago. We've been fighting a hybrid war against Russia for years and at the same time as that just getting a whole lot harder the spectre of the expansion of the physical war on our doorstep has become much greater.

Unlike the US, Europe has recent history of some of it's major cities being reduced to rubble. We still have people in our populations who remember it happening at large scale. We were the crucible of the most deadly conflict in human history and a prior conflict that is also in the top 10. Though Americans went home in body bags from both those wars, Europe had a collective experience and institutional memory that is completely alien to most Americans. Here we are again with cities being reduced to rubble on our continent and the US president is seeing this as a business opportunity to partner with our enemy.

Then we get to what I think is the crux of it. Part of our institutional memory is that we let a monster ruin our world because he wasn't stopped in time. He was first ignored, then ridiculed and mocked, then appeased (all with good intent) and then it was too late. You are right that Trump's supporters are a minority but it only took a small percentage of the population to impose it's will on Germany.

So though your hope is that Trump is just passing through, I think the great concern here is, what if he isn't? Even if he is how much chaos does he cause along the way?

Being harsh I could argue your final comments show a degree of complacency from a far away place that doesn't feel the same immediate pain and risk. Except I know that isn't true because you have family here and a prolonged Trump administration will cause all of America much pain too. But what is unclear I think is how you and the many millions of decent Americans should respond to the current situation? I understand the temptation to assume it'll blow through or that soon enough the markets and the economy will kill him but is that enough? I don't know the answer to that and it's not for Europeans to tell Americans what they should do but I suspect it's something that every decent American will have to face into sooner rather than later.
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My point was not to minimize the effects of Trump on Europe and the wider world, but to emphasize that America is not Trump and the MAGAts who, especially now, are not nearly as prevalent as they might seem…they are just stealing all the oxygen atm.

To be sure, there are existential crises that may need to be addressed in the very near future, but even wild pendulum swings like Trump end up being compensated for over time.

All of that said, when he announces the end of the Department of Education today, it’ll be more evidence of the shock and awe they’re attempting to use to overwhelm us all.
 
Onholiday(somemightsay) said:
Getaway doesn't take place til later this year for a mates 40th.

Been over a few times but to be fair haven't really ventured outside of NY, L.A., San Fran, Washington & Vegas from memory.

Future trips were going to be more based around musical origins further south........
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Enjoy, regardless of where you go, but if you can get out of town and find the real
America outside a huge metropolis, it will open your eyes…and possibly not always in the best way, maybe?!
 
BobKowalski said:
Well said and having been to the US I agree that it is a mix of different countries and the people are invariably friendly, but most people do not visit the US and the US is Trump and Musk. Right now and for the foreseeable future the US is inimical to the security and prosperity of the UK and Europe and we will have to treat the country and its people with that in mind. You cannot divorce the administration from the people that elected them.

Once the trust is gone, the US is never going to get it back. That is the reality and one we all have to face going forward.
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Time is a great healer. Trump, I hope, is a once (twice!) in a lifetime event.

We’ll see.
 
ChicagoBlue said:
My point was not to minimize the effects of Trump on Europe and the wider world, but to emphasize that America is not Trump and the MAGAts who, especially now, are not nearly as prevalent as they might seem…they are just stealing all the oxygen atm.

To be sure, there are existential crises that may need to be addressed in the very near future, but even wild pendulum swings like Trump end up being compensated for over time.

All of that said, when he announces the end of the Department of Education today, it’ll be more evidence of the shock and awe they’re attempting to use to overwhelm us all.
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Yeah, find a Trump voter, a Thatcher voter 'n a Brexit voter, and a genuine ticket holder at York away. All rarer than rocking horse faeces.
 
The biggest thing Americans are losing from this right now is world trust.
Trust takes a long to build and seconds to demolish. There is still time to keep this trust.
How the Americans act right now can avoid this loss...
 
When Musk's AI chatbot Grok was asked if Trump is a Russian asset it replied there is a 75%-85% chance he is.

"Don't Google it, just Grok it" said Musk just 3 days ago.

Awkward.

www.newsweek.com

Elon Musk's chatbot says there's a strong chance Trump is "Russian asset"

Musk's AI chatbot Grok suggested Trump was 85 percent likely to be "a Russian asset" when simply asked if the president was one, without any qualifiers.
www.newsweek.com www.newsweek.com
 
So he's publicly admitted he's after the panama canal, canada and greenland now. If any leader of any country with the means to carry out those threats, makes those kind of comments publicly, you start preparing for war.
fulabeer said:
The biggest thing Americans are losing from this right now is world trust.
Trust takes a long to build and seconds to demolish. There is still time to keep this trust.
How the Americans act right now can avoid this loss...
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What are they supposed to do though? They've just elected the twat and they're very quickly dismantling any way of putting any kind of road block in their way. Some bad press and a few protests aren't going to result in anything more than a smirk from Trump as he carries on doing whatever he wants.
 
ninjamonkey said:
So he's publicly admitted he's after the panama canal, canada and greenland now. If any leader of any country with the means to carry out those threats, makes those kind of comments publicly, you start preparing for war.

What are they supposed to do though? They've just elected the twat and they're very quickly dismantling any way of putting any kind of road block in their way. Some bad press and a few protests aren't going to result in anything more than a smirk from Trump as he carries on doing whatever he wants.
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AIUI the constitution gives Congress the right to remove the president for various reasons, more than one of which could be justified by current or past actions.

Even Republicans in Congress will stop cheering the Mango Mussolini the second he becomes unpopular.

His popularity with the US public is the problem.
 
ninjamonkey said:
So he's publicly admitted he's after the panama canal, canada and greenland now. If any leader of any country with the means to carry out those threats, makes those kind of comments publicly, you start preparing for war.

What are they supposed to do though? They've just elected the twat and they're very quickly dismantling any way of putting any kind of road block in their way. Some bad press and a few protests aren't going to result in anything more than a smirk from Trump as he carries on doing whatever he wants.
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This is probably why he doesn't want Russia on his back.
It's a fukin carve up
 
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