US & Israel attack Iran

at one point in the past, Netanyahu was the only leader Trump had respect for.
Trump is a businessman who sees the world order through those very same eyes.
These are not my opinions but make sense.
What is my opinion is Trump is an egotistical, vain, money driven narcissist. Opinion based on his actions versus definition.
 
In his latest statement Trump claims they are knocking the crap out of Iran. To me that does not sound like a targeted campaign and the veneer has slipped. In reality it sounds like a Gazza type operation. The innocent pay the price.
In another story he has apparently left specific instructions as to what should be done to Iran if he is taken out. I think we all know what that means.
 
There are plenty of prominent Jews speaking out about this.





Unfortunately there is also a number of large Jewish organisations who have doubled down aswell. But its definitely not all Jews who agree with Israels actions and its very important to keep making that distinction.

There are indeed Jews, particularly outside Israel, who are very critical of Israel's actions and a large group who are, at best, uncomfortable. I'm one of those and I know plenty of others who are. But there's something you need to understand about the ultra-religious Jews who claim to be anti-Zionist, and you won't like it.

They aren't doing this for political reasons but religious ones. They literally believe the Old Testament, that it is the word of god, and that the world was created by him less than 6,000 years ago. They also immutably believe that god promised the land to the Jewish people in perpetuity and will return it to them exclusively when the Messiah comes. In fact I think they believe the whole planet will be given to the Jews.

The reason they are so anti-Zionist (in the truest sense in that they don't believe the State of Israel should exist in its current form) is their belief that god gave the land exclusively to the Jewish people and only god can give it back, not soldiers or politicians. That obviously ignores the possibility that god acted through politicians like Herzl, Weizmann, Ben Gurion, the UN, etc.

When the Messiah arrives (anyone who doesn't accept the word of god in the way that they do (which includes me and definitely all you lot) will certainly have no place in the Holy Land and probably in the world full stop. In summary, they are the ultimate adherents to the concept of racial or religious supremacy, and definitely don't believe in any two-state solution.

Still think they're morally upright heroes?
 
That's a very stupid post but I know which side you're on. I'm wasting my time therefore but I'll point out some stats. The Holocaust exterminated about a third of the global Jewish population. I think we can agree that was clearly about race, therefore genocidal.

Let's say 70,000 were killed in Gaza. About 20-25k of those were direct or indirect combatants and about another 15k would have died anyway, from disease or other natural causes, according to the normal death rate over the period since October 2023.

That leaves about 30-35k civilian deaths due to Israeli action, which is maybe 1.5% of the Gaza population. There are another 3m Palestinians living in the West Bank. While all those deaths are regrettable (and were unnecessary) If this was truly about race, and an intent to exterminate Gazans, do you not think that figure would have been much, much higher?

Just want to point out for the sake of accuracy that the 30,000 number killed by the Iranians is a disputed figure as it was collected through "anonymous sources in Iran" which could well have their own agenda. HRANA, a human rights body focused on Iran has been able to verify about 7,000 deaths.

Also, the claim that the Iranians bombed their own school by mistake has been proven to be incorrect:


Are all these factually correct?

I think Gaza deaths are 3.7% of the population (1.9million) if 70,000 is right, almost certainly higher I would think.
Iran deaths seem low at 7000 as even the Guardian has openly given a figure of 30,000 but who knows, could be 7000 could be 100,000.
The bombing of the school does look to be Israel/USA rather than Iran.
 
There are indeed Jews, particularly outside Israel, who are very critical of Israel's actions and a large group who are, at best, uncomfortable. I'm one of those and I know plenty of others who are. But there's something you need to understand about the ultra-religious Jews who claim to be anti-Zionist, and you won't like it.

They aren't doing this for political reasons but religious ones. They literally believe the Old Testament, that it is the word of god, and that the world was created by him less than 6,000 years ago. They also immutably believe that god promised the land to the Jewish people in perpetuity and will return it to them exclusively when the Messiah comes. In fact I think they believe the whole planet will be given to the Jews.

The reason they are so anti-Zionist (in the truest sense in that they don't believe the State of Israel should exist in its current form) is their belief that god gave the land exclusively to the Jewish people and only god can give it back, not soldiers or politicians. That obviously ignores the possibility that god acted through politicians like Herzl, Weizmann, Ben Gurion, the UN, etc.

When the Messiah arrives (anyone who doesn't accept the word of god in the way that they do (which includes me and definitely all you lot) will certainly have no place in the Holy Land and probably in the world full stop. In summary, they are the ultimate adherents to the concept of racial or religious supremacy, and definitely don't believe in any two-state solution.

Still think they're morally upright heroes?
Religion ehe
It fukin stinks
 
There are indeed Jews, particularly outside Israel, who are very critical of Israel's actions and a large group who are, at best, uncomfortable. I'm one of those and I know plenty of others who are. But there's something you need to understand about the ultra-religious Jews who claim to be anti-Zionist, and you won't like it.

They aren't doing this for political reasons but religious ones. They literally believe the Old Testament, that it is the word of god, and that the world was created by him less than 6,000 years ago. They also immutably believe that god promised the land to the Jewish people in perpetuity and will return it to them exclusively when the Messiah comes. In fact I think they believe the whole planet will be given to the Jews.

The reason they are so anti-Zionist (in the truest sense in that they don't believe the State of Israel should exist in its current form) is their belief that god gave the land exclusively to the Jewish people and only god can give it back, not soldiers or politicians. That obviously ignores the possibility that god acted through politicians like Herzl, Weizmann, Ben Gurion, the UN, etc.

When the Messiah arrives (anyone who doesn't accept the word of god in the way that they do (which includes me and definitely all you lot) will certainly have no place in the Holy Land and probably in the world full stop. In summary, they are the ultimate adherents to the concept of racial or religious supremacy, and definitely don't believe in any two-state solution.

Still think they're morally upright heroes?
Don't they say about Rape that it is not about sex it is about control? Similarly I think this permanent war is nothing to do with religion (unless they think God is an utter mad man or woman or etc) it is just about gang related violence where each gang wants to establish their power and only their power. They want to control the other. I've said previously on this thread the only people with a consistent moral, decent and fair view of this mess would be a pacifist who has castigated every single side. i.e very, very few!
 
Also, the claim that the Iranians bombed their own school by mistake has been proven to be incorrect:


I read it and it said it wasn't possible to say whether it was or not. Airstrikes go wrong and missiles in flight also do. Given the Iranians were sending missiles in all sorts of directions, that can't be ruled out.

Remember all the wailing and gnashing of teeth over the Israelis allegedly causing significant casualties at a hospital in Gaza? Turned out it was a Hamas rocket.
 
I read it and it said it wasn't possible to say whether it was or not. Airstrikes go wrong and missiles in flight also do. Given the Iranians were sending missiles in all sorts of directions, that can't be ruled out.

Remember all the wailing and gnashing of teeth over the Israelis allegedly causing significant casualties at a hospital in Gaza? Turned out it was a Hamas rocket.
No Israeli and US Air strikes, no dead children. Irrespective of the source.
 
But do you think they were purely racially motivated deaths, or casualties of a war, admittedly rather a one-sided one.
If you are asking me whether I think it is a genocide? The answer is No. If 70,000 Israelis had died at the same time as 70,000 Palestinians then no one would be even asking the question. So it's the lack of Israeli deaths that seems to piss people off! The fact is that Israel invented a very, very effective way of fighting a war without many of their own troops dying. Most of us thought it would be a Stalingrad type war with house to house fighting and multiple deaths on each side.
 
I read it and it said it wasn't possible to say whether it was or not. Airstrikes go wrong and missiles in flight also do. Given the Iranians were sending missiles in all sorts of directions, that can't be ruled out.

Remember all the wailing and gnashing of teeth over the Israelis allegedly causing significant casualties at a hospital in Gaza? Turned out it was a Hamas rocket.
According to who
 
And of course, no nutball Iranian regime, no need for Israeli and Us Air strikes and no dead children?
There are "nutball" regimes everywhere, including the US and Israel.
It's already be proven there was no imminent threat from Iran so, air strikes were not needed.

The death of Four US servicemen has received 1000x more coverage than the School in Iran.
 
There are "nutball" regimes everywhere, including the US and Israel.
It's already be proven there was no imminent threat from Iran so, air strikes were not needed.

The death of Four US servicemen has received 1000x more coverage than the School in Iran.
News run and owed by ?
 
Don't they say about Rape that it is not about sex it is about control? Similarly I think this permanent war is nothing to do with religion (unless they think God is an utter mad man or woman or etc) it is just about gang related violence where each gang wants to establish their power and only their power. They want to control the other. I've said previously on this thread the only people with a consistent moral, decent and fair view of this mess would be a pacifist who has castigated every single side. i.e very, very few!
That's what religion is... control and suppression
 

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