My questions to Europhiles is:
Why are there hundreds and thousands of people camping in Calais to come to this country? and
Why are there now hundreds of people, at least a thousand a month going to Zeebrugge to try and board ferries illegally to come to the uk? and
Why are the huge majority of these people in Zeebrugge young single Iraqi men?
Yes I do think this situation will change. The fact that anyone within the EU cannot come here, set up and work, or claim benefits will have an impact, a huge impact. I think it will reduce, not eliminate, the opportunities for terrorists and fundamentalists to get into the country do easily. Even though we don't have open borders all it means is we check everyone's passport. If someone holds a German, French or Italian or Greek or Polish passport, they have virtually as much right to enter the UK as the British. That quite simply has to be checked and stopped.Do you think Exiting the EU would change this situation in any way?, Illegals cant claim benefits and cant work legally, at most it suggests there are a lot of companies in the UK hiring cash in hand labor from Illegal immigrants, or at least there is a reputation that they are. stop that and the problem goes away.
This was laid bare with devastating clarity by the Lord Chancellor, Michael Gove, when he gave his reasons for joining the campaign to leave the EU: ‘As a minister, I’ve seen hundreds of new EU rules cross my desk, none of which were requested by the UK Parliament, none of which I or any other British politician could alter in any way and none of which made us freer, richer or fairer.
‘It is hard to overstate the degree to which the EU is a constraint on ministers’ ability to do the things that we were elected to do.’
He went on: ‘Every single day, every single minister is told, “Yes Minister, I understand, but that is against EU rules.” I know it. My colleagues in Government know it. And the British people ought to know it, too: your government is not, ultimately, in control in hundreds of areas that matter.’
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/a...al-lie-s-festered-45-years.html#ixzz40teNZs5O
Yes I do think this situation will change. The fact that anyone within the EU cannot come here, set up and work, or claim benefits will have an impact, a huge impact. I think it will reduce, not eliminate, the opportunities for terrorists and fundamentalists to get into the country do easily. Even though we don't have open borders all it means is we check everyone's passport. If someone holds a German, French or Italian or Greek or Polish passport, they have virtually as much right to enter the UK as the British. That quite simply has to be checked and stopped.
To your second point. I'd rather deal with the source (remove the illegals) as opposed to the symptoms (employing them when they're here). Deal with the source and the problem is better managed.
Correct they aren't solely the illegals I was understanding you to be referring to, but they are illegals who believe they can get here and the French weren't doing much to get them out of France, I question why not? I accept they are being moved on now, but that's all it is, moving them on. Europe should be sending these people back to their countries to fight for what they believe in, not sponsoring them to stay in Europe while they try to get into Britain.but they aren't the illegals camped at Calais which is what I was referencing, they cant legally get in anyway so why would exiting the EU change that like was suggested in the post I quoted.
Correct they aren't solely the illegals I was understanding you to be referring to, but they are illegals who believe they can get here and the French weren't doing much to get them out of France, I question why not? I accept they are being moved on now, but that's all it is, moving them on. Europe should be sending these people back to their countries to fight for what they believe in, not sponsoring them to stay in Europe while they try to get into Britain.
The other illegals, people who have obtained European passports by deception and lying are the problem we need to sort out. If we extract ourselves from the freedom of movement agreements we will have better control. At the moment these illegals, and possibly terrorists can just walk into our country and settle here.
Let's just remove that right from any European unless they have a job and are self funded, pay for their education and have the necessary health insurances - perhaps after five years contribution they could apply to naturalise and be exempt from these requirements. Also they should pay additional tax for all the other inbuilt benefits they will receive, like policing.
1. In order, I'm not particularly concerned about having an EEA. We should be able to compete within Europe and the world on commercial terms.
2. We have an established financial services and service sector we are also pretty good in scientific and product innovation. I agree we haven't got much of a manufacturing sector compared to many others, and I put that down in part to being in the EU
3. Britains economy will be at least what it will be if we stay in the EU, get outside and I think we will prosper. Let me ask at this stage why are we paying French and German power companies more for the electricity we as consumers and Businesses use than they pay in Germany and France to name but two?
4. For as long as we are dependent upon immigrants to work and deliver services alongside our unemployment figures, and don't believe all you read. In Oz about how well we're doing in terms of job creation. We have a massive amount of people who have had to go self employed and who work for very low wages, plus there is a huge dependency on zero hour contracts. It ain't good here, trust me.
5. Well I would have no objection to having non Brits working here if there is work for them, by that I mean if there's no work they'll need to return to their bative country and claim their benefits and child allowance there's, not here. I would expect the same to apply to Brits abroad, work if there is work, if can manage without a wage, i.e. On pensions and savings then great... our government still pays the pension to those who go overseas as well as to those who come here from overseas, it just doesn't work.
6&7 are good questions that need to be worked out though it will mainly be about unpicking ourselves from all the red tape and governance that has imposed upon us BH the EU.
I appreciate you won't agree with many or indeed any of the above but the thought of remaining under the control of a massive unelected bureaucracy really makes me wonder why we ever let it get this far.
Yet I'm a right wing europhile that favors staying in. Which is why, as I say, it's not as simple as you make out. You're also not centre moderate and blue moon, by and large is left of centre.I guess the old Fox News adage proves that, the longer people are told the hard right is the new centre the more they believe it. If Bluemoon is seen as left that just shows how far to the right people now think is the normal. My centre moderate views are positively communist on here.
Can't argue with your experience except to say that the true cost of electricity in France is significantly cheaper than the UK according to the figures in the attached.... Taxes are something else!Point three is WRONG
I own a house here and a house in France.
My electricity is far cheaper in the UK.
It is essentially a leadership contest though and both Dave and Boris know it.
“REPORT: 2015 Migrant Crisis Will Cost Sweden KR583,000,000,000 – 14x The Country’s Defence Budget,” by Oliver JJ Lane, Breitbart, February 19, 2016 (thanks to The Religion of Peace):
A Swedish economist, researcher, and business professor has calculated the total cost of the migrant crisis for 2015 for Sweden, and has reached a “conservative” lifetime estimate of around 600 billion Swedish Kronor (£48.3 billion).
Stockholm University associate professor Jan Tullberg has looked beyond the immediate costs of merely receiving migrants and their initial impact — extra policing, higher social benefits — and claims to have found the true cost of just one year’s migration. Taking the claims of the Swedish government at face value has calculated what these ‘new Swedes’ will cost the state from now until they leave the country or die, which ever comes first.
I didn`t bother with the full story because it goes on a bit, look it up if your that bothered, the point is that the true cost of these financial migrants is far higher than the lying sacks of shit in government are telling us.
We can not magic jobs, houses, schools, or hospital beds/ GP hours out of thin air, twist it any way you want, finite resources x increased population equals less.
Nor can you compare controlled immigration, where we have control of our borders and bring in who we may need, as opposed to a free for all where the vast majority are low/non skilled who do nothing but undermine existing pay and conditions, create divisions in society and even threaten the security of this country.
So are you saying Corbyn is voting for Dave? very interesting that one
Yet I'm a right wing europhile that favors staying in. Which is why, as I say, it's not as simple as you make out. You're also not centre moderate and blue moon, by and large is left of centre.
I've lost count of the amount of times that Ealing claims not to be left wing then launches into a rant against the right whilst giving the left a free pass. As for that comment about this being one of the most right-wing football forums in Europe, Jesus wept.
Anyway, I've no idea which way I'm going to vote yet. There will be decent arguments for and against yet there will also be scaremongering on both sides.
Dunno about football forums in general as this is the only one I go to but this is far more right wing based than the other forums I visit.
Not that this is a left/right argument really but Im on a game dev forum which is quite left based and the split is 59 stay in 13 leave and 13 undecided.