David Silva

Dax777 said:
Does it matter that almost no one has labelled him as finished?

Does there not exist a distinction between not being at your peak, and being shit?

This thread like most David Silva related threads over the last year have been more about emotions and less about facts.

Like the continued regurgitation of the claim that he started the first 5 games on fire. This claim has been corrected multiple times by mtiple posters.

Great against West Ham, Good against Chelsea and Everton, average against Watford and didn't play against Crystal Palace. Yet no matter how many times this correction has been made, the claim, and those who make the claim, Keeps repeating it. It's like Groundhog day.

The sad part it, most here love Dave, and an argument that he is not at his peak anymore is not proof of lack of love for him, not an euphemism for him being shit.

I made a claim a while back yhatvidctake Isco over David. Why? Because Isco, or Koke or Erikson or Dybala adnuseum are just destined to be better than Dave eventually. The cye is the same. Younger playersvrisecto their peak, older players drop from their peak. Even Magic Dave will.
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You'be an amazing route.
 
Dax777 said:
Does it matter that almost no one has labelled him as finished?

Does there not exist a distinction between not being at your peak, and being shit?

This thread like most David Silva related threads over the last year have been more about emotions and less about facts.

Like the continued regurgitation of the claim that he started the first 5 games on fire. This claim has been corrected multiple times by mtiple posters.

Great against West Ham, Good against Chelsea and Everton, average against Watford and didn't play against Crystal Palace. Yet no matter how many times this correction has been made, the claim, and those who make the claim, Keeps repeating it. It's like Groundhog day.

The sad part it, most here love Dave, and an argument that he is not at his peak anymore is not proof of lack of love for him, not an euphemism for him being shit.

I made a claim a while back yhatvidctake Isco over David. Why? Because Isco, or Koke or Erikson or Dybala adnuseum are just destined to be better than Dave eventually. The cye is the same. Younger playersvrisecto their peak, older players drop from their peak. Even Magic Dave will.
Click to expand...

The claim that he started the first 5 games on fire may not be the complete truth, but it is not far from truth. Opinions differ a lot of course, but personally I think he's better against Everton than against West Brom (a slight correction of fact). Rather average against Watford (for his standard), but I've seen some more average performances from others being praised to heaven this season, so let's not argue about whether it's more about emotions and less about facts. Just a difference in opinions. And then fast forward to the next PL game he did play. The one against Newcastle. You could argue that he didn't exactly start this game on fire, but he grew into it and almost single-handedly staged our comeback. In years to come folks will talk about lethal Kun and his five goals, but let's not forget Silva's contributions in that game. So technically you can argue that the regurgitated claim is wrong, but do consider this interpretation of claims for a second. Tell me if this defies logic.

I will never interpret an argument that he is not at his peak anymore as an euphemism for him being shit, because different people have different perceptions of a player's peak and only history would tell us who is right. However, one should note that not at his peak doesn't mean that he will be replaced by other incoming players and relegated to the bench, nor does it mean that he is not a top player in the PL anymore. This is what some of us here are disagreeing about. You could argue that it is technically different from labelling him "finished", but I think it's not so different from saying that he's finished as a key player for City and that the best one can hope for him is to play a bit-part role next season.

No one would be stupid enough to believe that the greatest players would go on forever, or to deny that younger players will eventually replace them. But is this season the time? Or is it two seasons too soon? One thing I find very interesting is that when something does happen, people would say that they predicted it, say, 2 years ago. Some of them are truly the result of gifted foresight, but most of the time it is just luck and passage of time. There are cases like Yaya Toure, but then there are also the likes of Johan Cruyff and Andres Iniesta (I'm not saying Silva is as great as these two, just as examples that sometimes people write players off too soon).

Can't talk about Erikson or Dybala, haven't watched them much. Koke maybe, in a year or two he would be better than Spanish Dave. But Isco? The Isco you wax lyrical about? I'm not so sure. At one time I desperately hoped that he could succeed Silva and keep Valencia going, but he had not shown such ability in the few opportunities he was given. I blamed the coach and the shit management of the club for that, and his stint at Malaga seemed to prove me right. But nowadays I'm very disappointed at him. He has potentials to be even greater than Andres Iniesta, but as years go by he only shows glimpses of it. While Real Madrid is not the best place for nurturing talent, every coach gave him ample chances to establish himself in the team. Zidane, the one who snatched him from our hands, started him every game back in January. In May, you see him spending more time on the bench than on the pitch. Even in Spain NT, a much more natural environment for his play, he performed much worse than Silva in March. Dribbled to dead ends far too much, thereby losing the ball far too often. Reports said different coaches had made such criticisms known to Isco, but there's a stubborn streak about him which I don't know who he learned from:P If Pep could change that about him, it would be truly a miracle. I would put my bets on Brahim rather than Isco.
 
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Walking on the blue moon said:
The claim that he started the first 5 games on fire may not be the complete truth, but it is not far from truth. Opinions differ a lot of course, but personally I think he's better against Everton than against West Brom (a slight correction of fact). Rather average against Watford (for his standard), but I've seen some more average performances from others being praised to heaven this season, so let's not argue about whether it's more about emotions and less about facts. Just a difference in opinions. And then fast forward to the next PL game he did play. The one against Newcastle. You could argue that he didn't exactly start this game on fire, but he grew into it and almost single-handedly staged our comeback. In years to come folks will talk about lethal Kun and his five goals, but let's not forget Silva's contributions in that game. So technically you can argue that the regurgitated claim is wrong, but do consider this interpretation of claims for a second. Tell me if this defies logic.

I will never interpret an argument that he is not at his peak anymore as an euphemism for him being shit, because different people have different perceptions of a player's peak and only history would tell us who is right. However, one should note that not at his peak doesn't mean that he will be replaced by other incoming players and relegated to the bench, nor does it mean that he is not a top player in the PL anymore. This is what some of us here are disagreeing about. You could argue that it is technically different from labelling him "finished", but I think it's not so different from saying that he's finished as a key player for City and that the best one can hope for him is to play a bit-part role next season.

No one would be stupid enough to believe that the greatest players would go on forever, or to deny that younger players will eventually replace them. But is this season the time? Or is it two seasons too soon? One thing I find very interesting is that when something does happen, people would say that they predicted it, say, 2 years ago. Some of them are truly the result of gifted foresight, but most of the time it is just luck and passage of time. There are cases like Yaya Toure, but then there are also the likes of Johan Cruyff and Andres Iniesta (I'm not saying Silva is as great as these two, just as examples that sometimes people write players off too soon).

Can't talk about Erikson or Dybala, haven't watched them much. Koke maybe, in a year or two he would be better than Spanish Dave. But Isco? The Isco you wax lyrical about? I'm not so sure. At one time I desperately hoped that he could succeed Silva and keep Valencia going, but he had not shown such ability in the few opportunities he was given. I blamed the coach and the shit management of the club for that, and his stint at Malaga seemed to prove me right. But nowadays I'm very disappointed at him. He has potentials to be even greater than Andres Iniesta, but as years go by he only shows glimpses of it. While Real Madrid is not the best place for nurturing talent, every coach gave him ample chances to establish himself in the team. Zidane, the one who snatched him from our hands, started him every game back in January. In May, you see him spending more time on the bench than on the pitch. Even in Spain NT, a much more natural environment for his play, he performed much worse than Silva in March. Dribbled to dead ends far too much, thereby losing the ball far too often. Reports said different coaches had made such criticisms known to Isco, but there's a stubborn streak about him which I don't know who he learned from:P If Pep could change that about him, it would be truly a miracle. I would put my bets on Brahim rather than Isco.
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Much respect. A reasoned view on every claim. You Sir are a class act.
 
karen7 said:
Sorry but you can't be a lady on here,COC rule 274b the women must be of the rough and ready type,must be able to use the **** word at all times
The coven will give you lessons ;)
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Oops, thanks for telling me my fellow rough and ready sister. Now off to insert the **** word after every second word of my posts:P
 
I'd like to see the lad get the whole summer off, recuperate and come back next season firing on all cylinders. He needs the rest and is the kind of player that could be pivotal to what Pep is going to try and do - there arent too many more intelligent players out there.
 
TFC said:
I'd like to see the lad get the whole summer off, recuperate and come back next season firing on all cylinders. He needs the rest and is the kind of player that could be pivotal to what Pep is going to try and do - there arent too many more intelligent players out there.
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If he were a little more of a thinker maybe he'd have pulled himself out of this summer's Euros on the basis that the club pay him 200k a week and he's been injured or rubbish for most of the season. His rush to be selected and be fit for this tournament is endemic of the attitude too many footballers at Manchester City have had in the last few years. These lads need to learn WE are the priority. Not a fucking international tournament every summer.

It's telling though that it's rarely gotten a mention in a negative light (that he's off to the euros). If it were Vinny who were on his way the relevant thread would be full posts like my paragraph above.
 
BillyShears said:
If he were a little more of a thinker maybe he'd have pulled himself out of this summer's Euros on the basis that the club pay him 200k a week and he's been injured or rubbish for most of the season. His rush to be selected and be fit for this tournament is endemic of the attitude too many footballers at Manchester City have had in the last few years. These lads need to learn WE are the priority. Not a fucking international tournament every summer.

It's telling though that it's rarely gotten a mention in a negative light (that he's off to the euros). If it were Vinny who were on his way the relevant thread would be full posts like my paragraph above.
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Isn't he close to the magic 100 caps? Probably feels that if he puts club before country at this stage of his career then he won't get selected again.
 
Spain are strong enough in the midfield I doubt they use him for every match. And when he's been healthy for us this year he's hardly been at world class form. Will see what happens in the Euros. Hopefully he doesn't see a ton of work this summer.
 
BillyShears said:
If he were a little more of a thinker maybe he'd have pulled himself out of this summer's Euros on the basis that the club pay him 200k a week and he's been injured or rubbish for most of the season. His rush to be selected and be fit for this tournament is endemic of the attitude too many footballers at Manchester City have had in the last few years. These lads need to learn WE are the priority. Not a fucking international tournament every summer.

It's telling though that it's rarely gotten a mention in a negative light (that he's off to the euros). If it were Vinny who were on his way the relevant thread would be full posts like my paragraph above.
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I doubt very much that the club pay him anything like £200K per week. Like you I don't know what he gets but not many players get remotely close to £200K per week. In any sport the pinnacle of achievement is to represent your country. We are not and should not be the priority. If you don't want international players then don't sign them.
 
pardoeofftomexico said:
I doubt very much that the club pay him anything like £200K per week. Like you I don't know what he gets but not many players get remotely close to £200K per week. In any sport the pinnacle of achievement is to represent your country. We are not and should not be the priority. If you don't want international players then don't sign them.
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It's not true that the pinnacle of every sport is international tournaments. Maybe 30 years ago that was the case but in football today it certainly isn't the case. And not withstanding that, it isn't about never playing any tournament, it's about being intelligent enough to know when your international career might start having a negative impact on your club career and maybe making allowances since the club are the ones paying your wages. I'm not really arsed whether he earns 200k a week, 150k a week, or 50k a week btw. The point is his JOB is playing football for Manchester City.
 
David Silva has been a magnificent player for us, but I got to say going to the Euro's has put a big question mark on his future with us.

He has had a poor season...fact.....and I am not convinced about the ankle problem...if rest was the answer, I am sure City would have given him time off in the season.
With the Euro's he will be lucky to get 3 weeks rest, and I simply do not believe he will be 100% when he comes back.
 
BillyShears said:
It's not true that the pinnacle of every sport is international tournaments. Maybe 30 years ago that was the case but in football today it certainly isn't the case. And not withstanding that, it isn't about never playing any tournament, it's about being intelligent enough to know when your international career might start having a negative impact on your club career and maybe making allowances since the club are the ones paying your wages. I'm not really arsed whether he earns 200k a week, 150k a week, or 50k a week btw. The point is his JOB is playing football for Manchester City.
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It may not be as important to you. You may think City winning the premier league should be more important to a player than his country winning the World Cup or European Championships. I honestly don't think that is the case with the players.
 
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