EU referendum

[SWP's back]

thought you didn't believe in angels?

Every now and again we get one, such as The Baroness.

 

[stonerblue]

Health insurance is certainly cheaper for the majority. Not too many can afford the up front costs.

i put all the money i saved by not buying travel insurance away and in an emergency i whip out the 200E.

 

[stonerblue]

Every now and again we get one, such as The Baroness.

once again, hahahahhahaa.

 

[stonerblue]

Dalai Lama approved fuck off wall.

i wonder how many Poles it would take to fence Blighty off in a week? I bet they'd be a lot quicker than the Welsh but not quite as speedy as them Irish.

 

[sir baconface]

If we leave all UK expat pensioners in Europe will have their pensions frozen until individual deals can be made with each and every European country.

If we leave E111 cards will be worthless until such time as individual agreements can be made with each and every european countries.

Not even a decent WUM.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Fair points but doesn't get to the heart of it for me. What I am more concerned about is getting a government in position that takes ANY immigration seriously and has some balls to do something about it. At the moment we are being invaded by lorry, train and now boats. The boats problem really needs attention as the Channel will soon become like the waters between Greece and Turkey. It has been known for some time that cross Channel traffic increases after dark and we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg hence the disparity in migrant numbers getting here legally. We've got three more years of a Tory government to put up with and the only way to oust that useless Theresa May along with Cameron and Osborne is for a political coup triggered by Brexit. I don't particularly like Gove but he'd be far more efficient than anybody we've got leading us.
After that Britain can sort itself out with Europe by negotiation. We have just got to get a grip on our borders. How can you do any long term planning not knowing the numbers you are dealing with coming and going? It's asylum politics. Look at how Germany and Austria are struggling to cope for that very reason. Kent County Council is struggling for that reason too.

First, let's not confuse illegal immigration with what's legally allowed within EU rules. I am sure you're not confused, but talking about being invaded "by lorry, train and boats" and "traffic increases after dark", implies *illegal* immigration and we can try to control that in or out of the EU. We don't need to leave the EU to do that.

Second, regards to the wider control of our borders and migrants from within the EU - over which we currently have no control - why don't we just keep lobbying the EU to allow member states to introduce some caps or limits in certain circumstances? Of course free movement of labout is a cornerstone of the EU for some and gaining concessions on this won't be easy, but I am sure a middle ground can be found. We'd need to allow the federalists some room to save face, so the wording would have to couched in such a way that those who passionately believe in the free movement can still cling to the idea that this is being preserved. But at the same time, some limits could be introduced in "special circumstances". It seems eminently reaonable to me that this sort of compromise could be achieved, given the huge public concern right across Europe at the moment regarding this issue.

Third, we should remember that the immigrants that have come into the UK over the past few years are in the main tax-paying and contribute billions to our society, as well as fulfilling vital jobs in the NHS and elsewhere. Yes, they pose a burden on our public services and housing etc, but instead of worrying about how to stop them coming, perhaps we should direct the extra tax revenues they are generating at schemes to provide more school and hospital capacity, for example?

Wrecking our economy (by leaving the EU) is a pretty drastic solution to a problem that can be solved by other means.

 

[Tuearts right boot]

If only most people knew what was happening there but the media appear to be keeping it as quiet as possible. Funny that.

France, the sick man of Europe. Now the last time I heard that it was aimed at the Uk back in the 70's.

 

[mcfc1632]

First, let's not confuse illegal immigration with what's legally allowed within EU rules. I am sure you're not confused, but talking about being invaded "by lorry, train and boats" and "traffic increases after dark", implies *illegal* immigration and we can try to control that in or out of the EU. We don't need to leave the EU to do that.

Second, regards to the wider control of our borders and migrants from within the EU - over which we currently have no control - why don't we just keep lobbying the EU to allow member states to introduce some caps or limits in certain circumstances? Of course free movement of labout is a cornerstone of the EU for some and gaining concessions on this won't be easy, but I am sure a middle ground can be found. We'd need to allow the federalists some room to save face, so the wording would have to couched in such a way that those who passionately believe in the free movement can still cling to the idea that this is being preserved. But at the same time, some limits could be introduced in "special circumstances". It seems eminently reaonable to me that this sort of compromise could be achieved, given the huge public concern right across Europe at the moment regarding this issue.

Third, we should remember that the immigrants that have come into the UK over the past few years are in the main tax-paying and contribute billions to our society, as well as fulfilling vital jobs in the NHS and elsewhere. Yes, they pose a burden on our public services and housing etc, but instead of worrying about how to stop them coming, perhaps we should direct the extra tax revenues they are generating at schemes to provide more school and hospital capacity, for example?

Wrecking our economy (by leaving the EU) is a pretty drastic solution to a problem that can be solved by other means.

Wow - I would like to live in this world where we can think that Juncker et al would give us any concessions on the 'free movement' principle - let's just vote remain and throw ourselves on their 'goodwill' towards UK interest..............

Good luck with that

 

[KenTheLandlord]

Yes mate. I'm stupid. Shit education. Shit job. I bet you're fucking handsome and in shape as well. I wish I was clever and successful like you and then I could refer to Corbyn as "Jizzer" and laugh to myself whilst everyone else rightly thought I had the humour of a prepubescent.

Labour received less votes than the two parties offering a referendum. The poster I replied to thinks it's an entirely Tory thing that we are having a referendum which is a standard left wing ploy of not having the empathetic intelligence to understand any view other than their own despite every bit of evidence pointing to the fact that the "other" view is bloody popular.

But I'm not surprised that escapes you. I personally wouldn't employ you to clean the windows despite licking them being your favourite hobbie.

lol what a melt.

 

[AlgarveBlu]

First, let's not confuse illegal immigration with what's legally allowed within EU rules. I am sure you're not confused, but talking about being invaded "by lorry, train and boats" and "traffic increases after dark", implies *illegal* immigration and we can try to control that in or out of the EU. We don't need to leave the EU to do that.

Second, regards to the wider control of our borders and migrants from within the EU - over which we currently have no control - why don't we just keep lobbying the EU to allow member states to introduce some caps or limits in certain circumstances? Of course free movement of labout is a cornerstone of the EU for some and gaining concessions on this won't be easy, but I am sure a middle ground can be found. We'd need to allow the federalists some room to save face, so the wording would have to couched in such a way that those who passionately believe in the free movement can still cling to the idea that this is being preserved. But at the same time, some limits could be introduced in "special circumstances". It seems eminently reaonable to me that this sort of compromise could be achieved, given the huge public concern right across Europe at the moment regarding this issue.

.

Switzerland had a legally binding referendum on introducing limits to inward eu migration in 2014 which they won and the eu told them to fuck off - they're still trying to sort it out now

 

[Metal Biker]

If only most people knew what was happening there but the media appear to be keeping it as quiet as possible. Funny that.

Any links/search terms so I can research it? Genuinely interested.

 

[smudgedj]

If we leave all UK expat pensioners in Europe will have their pensions frozen until individual deals can be made with each and every European country.

If we leave E111 cards will be worthless until such time as individual agreements can be made with each and every european countries.

That's my 2 cents with respect to the outers.

PMSL Do you make this shit up as you go along?

 

[hgblue]

First, let's not confuse illegal immigration with what's legally allowed within EU rules. I am sure you're not confused, but talking about being invaded "by lorry, train and boats" and "traffic increases after dark", implies *illegal* immigration and we can try to control that in or out of the EU. We don't need to leave the EU to do that.

Second, regards to the wider control of our borders and migrants from within the EU - over which we currently have no control - why don't we just keep lobbying the EU to allow member states to introduce some caps or limits in certain circumstances? Of course free movement of labout is a cornerstone of the EU for some and gaining concessions on this won't be easy, but I am sure a middle ground can be found. We'd need to allow the federalists some room to save face, so the wording would have to couched in such a way that those who passionately believe in the free movement can still cling to the idea that this is being preserved. But at the same time, some limits could be introduced in "special circumstances". It seems eminently reaonable to me that this sort of compromise could be achieved, given the huge public concern right across Europe at the moment regarding this issue.

Third, we should remember that the immigrants that have come into the UK over the past few years are in the main tax-paying and contribute billions to our society, as well as fulfilling vital jobs in the NHS and elsewhere. Yes, they pose a burden on our public services and housing etc, but instead of worrying about how to stop them coming, perhaps we should direct the extra tax revenues they are generating at schemes to provide more school and hospital capacity, for example?

Wrecking our economy (by leaving the EU) is a pretty drastic solution to a problem that can be solved by other means.

Lol. David Cameron spent twelve months trying to get concessions from the EU, and after travelling around kissing the arses of the Latvian, Lithuanian and Bulgarian presidents amongst others, and with the threat of a UK referendum just around the corner to help him, he came back with a packet of peanuts and a chewed up smartie. If we vote to Remain we're getting what we're given for the foreseeable future and those who vote Remain better not come on here pissing and moaning about it.

 

[mcfc1632]

Lol. David Cameron spent twelve months trying to get concessions from the EU, and after travelling around kissing the arses of the Latvian, Lithuanian and Bulgarian presidents amongst others, and with the threat of a UK referendum just around the corner to help him, he came back with a packet of peanuts and a chewed up smartie. If we vote to Remain we're getting what we're given for the foreseeable future and those who vote Remain better not come on here pissing and moaning about it.

Agree with this except with the bit I have bolded which I would suggest should be .....what we deserve... Because it will be because we have lemming like leapt over the cliff despite the obvious clear precipice on the horizon and many warning signs that we could have taken note of....

 

[Blue Hefner]

I predict a narrow win for the 'in' campaign

Just out of interest - I get people move for work, I get people move for safety but how stupid/desperate do you have to be to jump on a overcrowded boat and try and make it to UK

The EU, appear at least, to be doing very little to stop/stem the tide. If this is the contempt they hold the UK and the citizens on continent in and that they are happy for this free movement of god knows who then it's time we left and sorted ourselves out

 

[SWP's back]

lol what a melt.

There you are again destroying me with your laconic rapier like wit.

 

[EalingBlue2]

Besides the war debt there was the labour government and the unions, Margret came along and sorted that bunch of c*nts out ( I left school aged 15 and was a fully paid up branch attending union member for twenty years, an I`m telling you straight they were a bunch of self serving c*nts).

So lets look at where we are now shall we, a far faster growing economy than anywhere in the EU, not because of but in spite of the EU.
Over 90% of UK companies do no business with the EU but trade world wide on price and quality, unemployment is far higher and living standards far lower than the UK in your exalted EU.

This type of post perfectly encapsulates the dishonesty of politics today, the Brexit campaign keeps using that 90% and uses it in a way to imply that 90% export outside EU only 10% within. Now in this figure as I understand it they count businesses all as equal so rolls Royce and a two man window cleaning company count as the same, they also count all the companies - which is the vast majority that don't export at all. So local cabbies, shops etc whose sole role is domestic and are small businesses are wrapped up in a statistic.

The vast majority of businesses do not export anything anywhere (other than the odd tourist pound spent - of which no one would know if EU or not) also it discounts the fact that on the open market, with free trade and access directly EU exports will always be under reported anyway.

 

[EalingBlue2]

I predict a narrow win for the 'in' campaign

Just out of interest - I get people move for work, I get people move for safety but how stupid/desperate do you have to be to jump on a overcrowded boat and try and make it to UK

The EU, appear at least, to be doing very little to stop/stem the tide. If this is the contempt they hold the UK and the citizens on continent in and that they are happy for this free movement of god knows who then it's time we left and sorted ourselves out

I've met and talked t a few boat people in Australia and they are generally coming from less dangerous places in Syria. My general perspective was two fol - one, that if you have absolutely nothing to lose the downside of drowning trying to do something is not that great if you gave death, oppression, disease and have no hope and secondly that people do not have access to perfect or even good information so the promise of what they will get and the ease of the trip is not perhaps fully understood.

 

[KenTheLandlord]

There you are again destroying me with your laconic rapier like wit.

No point in using my full wit on a half wit.

 

[EalingBlue2]

I was referring to this part of a post by you:

"................Churchill their leader was one of the most pro europe leaders this country will ever have. He would be turning on his grave at the Mosely like rhetoric of the outers.............."

In that case I am happy with it, Churchill always stood against such shite, always (or at least from fairly early in his life) believed in tolerance (by the standard of the day) and I should have said SOME of the outers though as I think if focused on economics, sovereignty etc he would have had very different views on those matters, but the vocal Brexit voices seem to have given up on it now and it's all immigration and jack boots