EU referendum

EU referendum

  • In

    Votes: 503 47.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 547 52.1%
  • Total voters
    1,050
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SWP's back said:
PB has put a list of a about a dozen back in the thread.

And Britain lost the last 40 times it voted against something.
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That's because we'd lost before the votes were counted. The Permanent Repeesentatives (Head of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in Brussels and his / her equivalents) meet in the days before the Council of Ministers meet. By that stage it is usually clear who has enough votes to win so the 40 or so defeats are protest votes. That said, sometimes last minute compromises are reached between Ministers. We have been on the successful side of the vote 98 percent of the time IIRC.
 
RichardDunneOwnGoal said:
But Mac, either way you're in some form or another aligning yourself with people who you detest. If you vote to remain you're an ally of the people who seek to privatise the NHS, people who depress the standard of living of working people in this country to line their own pockets.

What's more, there is a broad spectrum of people who wish to leave the EU, and they're not all motivated by the same ambitions.

To allow a tiny minority of extremists among those supportive of a leave vote to deter you from voting leave is incredibly folly, IMO.

I just see a lot of people voting against their best interests and not trusting themselves and the electorate to get it right in the longterm following an out result, it depresses me frankly.

And as PB rightly pointed out, it's the EU itself which is fuelling the rise of the far right.

I just can't reconcile the fact that people believe emboldening the status quo is the best way to insure their futures, when it's precisely the status quo which is strangling them. As I said, depressing.
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What makes you believe that?? The nhs is going nowhere and the point of the eu is working together. The likes of Boris And Nigel are the selfish ones.
 
without a dream said:
Unless it would prevent a disturbance to the economy, is strategically important or the aid is in line with EU2020 visions. It was more than possible for them to 'bail them out', they just had to be a little clever about it.
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Why the fuck should we have to be "a little clever" about aiding our own industry and protecting the jobs of those workers and those at all the companies that rely on them?
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Why the fuck should we have to be "a little clever" about aiding our own industry and protecting the jobs of those workers and those at all the companies that rely on them?
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OUR Government did worse than that and blocked the EU from increasing tariffs on the Chinese. We shafted our steel industry!

Dave and Gideon probably saw that as a price worth paying for increasing investment in other areas from China. I would tend to disagree but i dont have the full business case in front of me!
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Why the fuck should we have to be "a little clever" about aiding our own industry and protecting the jobs of those workers and those at all the companies that rely on them?
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We shouldn't have to, my point was just that it's more than possible to do so, as plenty of other EU countries prove.

This government has very little interest in saving the UK steel industry, they're much happier cosying up to the Chinese.
 
Monkfish said:
He had mental problems for sure, but if the leave campaign had not spewed the bile it has over the last few months maybe he wouldn't have believed in what he did

He thought he was doing the 'right thing' - where did he get that idea from?
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Pinning it on Leave is a bit far.

The dripfeed of xenophobia in large sections of the media has been going on for years, and while it might be partly to do with Farage and his cronies, it's not Vote Leave.
 
CitizenTID said:
That's a good point. I just worry what they'll do in the short term while they can. If the NHS was completely privatised, I can't see the option of overturning that being easy at all and very unlikely to happen.

I guess I'm just completely unsure which side I can trust if any. I've never taken an interest in politics, but after this last Tory election I know we need them out - I can't be doing with anyone who are so blatantly out for themselves and theirs rather than looking after the whole population. Obviously this referendum is a big deal so have tried putting more effort into trying to find the right decision.

EDIT: After reading about TTIP I'm voting OUT definitely. Fuck that. I've always had the impression Cameron is hiding something and him and Osbourne are puppets of corporations like Virgin wanting more and more and more, sacrificing the health and financial well being of the population. All about removing "barriers" such as reducing food safety rules to expand profit margins - fuck that!

I think Brexit is definitely the far lesser of the two evils. At least their campaign is promoting pumping money back into the NHS (the EU money) which suggests they're more likely to prevent privatisation.
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mate it's up to you at the end of the day, i was on the fence at first swell. whatever you think is the best.
 
Monkfish said:
He had mental problems for sure, but if the leave campaign had not spewed the bile it has over the last few months maybe he wouldn't have believed in what he did

He thought he was doing the 'right thing' - where did he get that idea from?
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thats a load of rubbish, as others have said you are trying to point score and use someones death to say we should remain. she was killed by a nutcase, not by the leave campaign.
 
RichardDunneOwnGoal said:
Of course we're a European nation, we're geographically part of the continent of Europe.

Your rationale seems to be that if you're not an EU member state, you're not a European nation?

Truly bizarre. Are Switzerland not a European nation because they're not part of the EU and have no wish to be?
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My rationale is that i was brought up with a Sicilian Nonna who moved here after escaping Mussolini, had my mother and another 3 kids, married an Irishman, remarried a bloke from Levenshulme, and here me and my brothers are. One works in Madrid, my dad lives in Spain. We are European.
 
MillionMilesAway said:
Pinning it on Leave is a bit far.

The dripfeed of xenophobia in large sections of the media has been going on for years, and while it might be partly to do with Farage and his cronies, it's not Vote Leave.
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Lets just take things down to brass tacks and Leave is all about immigration the central message is taking back control of our borders. There is no economic/ financial benefit of leaving the EU what so ever this has been proven time and time again there is no doubt leave will make us poorer even leave admit that. To vote leave you are fundamentally racist, xenophobic or both. Its the fear of the brown people whether that's Gove giving you the soft sell with his warnings on the Turks or its Nigel with his blatant Nazi style poster showing us all the invasion of the immigrants. Or the leave propaganda with maps of UK, Iraq and Iran.

It is no surprise that this campaign has split the nation up with the older generation favouring leave and the younger more tolerant voting stay. I accept that there are some exceptions to the general rule of thumb but in general that is the picture of how this is. The sad thing is once all this is over I can see more trouble ahead as more far right groups start to gain more support regardless of the outcome come Thursday.
 
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