Claudio Bravo - 2016/2017 performances (continued)

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TonyM said:
People ask why we're aren't tough with the media but IMO we should look in the mirror as a club more often and admit our mistakes, be honest, be ruthless but be fair. We should have sold Garcia at the earliest opportunity and the same with Fernando. They just weren't what we thought we were buying. Yet we persevered in hope and it just took up space in the squad and time/opportunities for others. It's the same with Bravo. If we persevere we are not doing ourselves any favours.

Players should know wherever they sign that they either fit the expectations or they're likely to go on loan or go permanently a lot sooner than they thought. If we are open about it from the start and not promising unconditional loyalty then it should be fair.
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If we had followed this reasoning, we'd have sold Sterling by now. I'd say those who say judge on 2nd season effort, have a better stand.

Some players take to new clubs like magic, others take a while to adapt. But generally they do so by midway through their 2nd season. Players who don't succeed by then tend to never succeed.

So 2 seasons minimum unless a change in manager or Philosophy deems them unfit.
 
Dax777 said:
If we had followed this reasoning, we'd have sold Sterling by now. I'd say those who say judge on 2nd season effort, have a better stand.

Some players take to new clubs like magic, others take a while to adapt. But generally they do so by midway through their 2nd season. Players who don't succeed by then tend to never succeed.

So 2 seasons minimum unless a change in manager or Philosophy deems them unfit.
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Or 2 season maximum.
 
Jazzcat said:
Do you know what egotistical means or are you just trying to throw 'big' words around to compensate for the weakness of the point you've been trying to make?
Pep is nothing of the sort and he wouldn't have had the abundant praise from former players if he had been.

Also being stubborn is a world apart from being an egotist and if he's that stubborn a man, he wouldn't be accused of tinkering either, now would he?
He has a set of footballing beliefs, a philosophy that was instilled by way of Cruyff and years of playing, and I'm pretty sure, based on his use of tactics, that adaptation to varying circumstances is one of the tenets.

I'm starting to wonder what professional accumen you've amassed that can outweigh that experience and that allows you to be so reductive and dismissive of one of the greatest professionals the sport has known. My guess 'd be none.
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no big words from me sweetcheeks. I just say it as it is. as for "professional acumin" cut the fucking shit out.
 
Bill said:
no big words from me sweetcheeks. I just say it as it is. as for "professional acumin" cut the fucking shit out.
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Sweet cheeks? I guess being dismissive comes natural to you.

No big words from you, that's for sure, or words that make much sense as you don't seem able to back them up with a single or coherent argument.

If by 'saying it as it is', you mean sounding like some tabloid pundit with less than half a clue, then by all means, keep slating Pep and Bravo if that makes you feel any better.
I'm just glad the club is being managed by people who actually know their shit instead of people who talk shit.
 
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Dax777 said:
If we had followed this reasoning, we'd have sold Sterling by now. I'd say those who say judge on 2nd season effort, have a better stand.

Some players take to new clubs like magic, others take a while to adapt. But generally they do so by midway through their 2nd season. Players who don't succeed by then tend to never succeed.

So 2 seasons minimum unless a change in manager or Philosophy deems them unfit.
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blooding a young winger in the team and using him as a sub and subbing him to get him used to the way we play is one thing and yes judge him in the second season.

you are talking about a 34 year old international goalie who played for Barca. A goalie is very different to a winger in terms of impact and importance to the game and whether you are going to win lose or draw. If the goalie is out of form and is not making a contribution in games by making any saves in games then I am afraid giving him two years to sort it is a bit silly.
 
Regardless of position a player still needs at least a season to adapt. Bravo has been signed on a three year deal so next season is the one where we can really judge the player. If after we sign better full backs, signing another centre back, getting the rest of the outfield players fully on board in terms of helping the defenders and keeper by winning the ball back quicker than we are currently doing in stopping our opponents threats and our attacking players start taking more of their chances he isn't still performing then the criticism is more justified imo.
 
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Jazzcat said:
Sweet cheeks? I guess being dismissive comes natural to you.

No big words from you, that's for sure, or words that make much sense as you don't seem able to back them up with a single or coherent argument.

If by 'saying it as it is', you mean sounding like some tabloid pundit with less than half a clue, then by all means, keep slating Pep and Bravo if that makes you feel any better.
I'm just glad the club is being managed by people who actually know their shit instead of people who talk shit.
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ok I get it, you struggle with bluntness and honesty.
i'll put it as basic as I can for you.
bravo is no good.
pep knows this but is too proud to do anything about it.

is that coherent enough for you?
 
kevin horlocks wand said:
blooding a young winger in the team and using him as a sub and subbing him to get him used to the way we play is one thing and yes judge him in the second season.

you are talking about a 34 year old international goalie who played for Barca. A goalie is very different to a winger in terms of impact and importance to the game and whether you are going to win lose or draw. If the goalie is out of form and is not making a contribution in games by making any saves in games then I am afraid giving him two years to sort it is a bit silly.
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stop talking sense. its the Bravo/ saving face thread. you must know that.
 
Bill said:
ok I get it, you struggle with bluntness and honesty.
i'll put it as basic as I can for you.
bravo is no good.
pep knows this but is too proud to do anything about it.

is that coherent enough for you?
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No, I struggle with people that think their point of view is the be all and end all of wisdom/insight without making any effort to properly motivate their argument.
I also struggle with people who think that being a football fan for x years makes them some sort of authority on the subject.
Congratulations, you've sat on your ass in the stands, now jog along.

We're back to same baseless claim: Pep is too proud to be professional.

Have you any proof for that ridiculous statement? Any evidence for that assumption, based in reality and not your gut feeling?
Or are just content to continue slating the gaffer and his appointed players like some halfwit pundit without any real footballing experience?
 
Jazzcat said:
No, I struggle with people that think their point of view is the be all and end all of wisdom/insight without making any effort to properly motivate their argument.
I also struggle with people who think that being a football fan for x years makes them some sort of authority on the subject.
Congratulations, you've sat on your ass in the stands, now jog along.

We're back to same baseless claim: Pep is too proud to be professional.

Have you any proof for that ridiculous statement? Any evidence for that assumption, based in reality and not your gut feeling?
Or are just content to continue slating the gaffer and his appointed players like some halfwit pundit without any real footballing experience?
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you got any proof he isn't

looks to me he's stubborn. any other player so off form would be left out of the side.

as for authority I have it spades, if I say a player is shit, he's shit. if a player is outstanding i'll say so and i'd be right.

i'd love to be wrong on Bravo but as I say i'm usually spot on.



it's a gift.
 
Jazzcat said:
No, I struggle with people that think their point of view is the be all and end all of wisdom/insight without making any effort to properly motivate their argument.
I also struggle with people who think that being a football fan for x years makes them some sort of authority on the subject.
Congratulations, you've sat on your ass in the stands, now jog along.

We're back to same baseless claim: Pep is too proud to be professional.

Have you any proof for that ridiculous statement? Any evidence for that assumption, based in reality and not your gut feeling?
Or are just content to continue slating the gaffer and his appointed players like some halfwit pundit without any real footballing experience?
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Bill seems to think that Pep is being 'egotistical' but that he isn't. Bill thinks he is being honest but anyone that disagrees with him isn't. In this way it is not
really worth arguing with someone that has stated that others are stubborn ?
 
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