“The work of God”?

[aguero93:20]

What did god do before creating the universe? Did he just sit around for an almost infinite amount of time scratching his arse?

Where did god come from?

Hallucinogens.

 

[Blue Mist]

The simple way to tell if there is a god is wait a few months. If this season is declared null and void with no Premier league team crowned as champions then there is a god. Simple really.

 

[Brightwell’s left peg]

a vagina

More likely from an Arse I'd say.

 

[crazyg]

If religion serves a purpose e.g. providing comfort in hard times, or a code of conduct to follow, then in that regard it is a good thing.
I am unconvinced by the existence of any form of god
If I were to follow any religion it would probably be Daoism.
Also don't forget that our club has its' origin in St. Marks...

is that pronounced DOH! ?

 

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

If it is God's work then those fuckers down the East Lancs need to take note - wreck a coach and God's vengeance is mighty indeed. Haha, thirty fuckin' years for a title and then this happens!

 

[Grassland Blue]

Yes.

 

[Blue Mist]

If it is God's work then those fuckers down the East Lancs need to take note - wreck a coach and God's vengeance is mighty indeed. Haha, thirty fuckin' years for a title and then this happens!

I know everyone hates them (apart from Ric who has locked the Dip thread to stop the abuse) but do you think this points to god being a City fan ? I suppose he could be an Everton fan but surely if he was he would have acted before now.

 

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

I know everyone hates them (apart from Ric who has locked the Dip thread to stop the abuse) but do you think this points to god being a City fan ? I suppose he could be an Everton fan but surely if he was he would have acted before now.

God is a football fan and consequently, unless they change their sinful ways, the Dippers, the PL, the FArce, Uefa, FICKFUFA, the RDAHMeedya are destined for a long spell in the fiery furnaces reserved for the unholy!

 

[Ohrodneyrodney]

A lot of people seem really angry with a God they say doesn't exist.

Cant really get that.

 

[vmsuhail]

Apologies for lack of sources related to religious text, I’ve got some bits to do before I finish work for the day and go on my one walk to exercise as instructed.

Replies above in red.

No issues. I can kind of figure out the sources (Qur'an, hadith, tafsir, seerah). If not I'll ask.

Obstacles and an opportunity to overcome hardship is one thing. Being born into a famine or the middle of a war and dying in your infancy isn’t a test, it’s unnecessary cruelty.
By your replies I’m presuming you are a Muslim, it seems to me that god enjoys testing Muslims very hard. He tests them harder than non-Muslims in the west. In Syria, in Iraq, in Kashmir, in China, in Palestine.

Yes, it is in the scriptures that God tests the believers especially.
Qur'an 29:2-3 "Do the people think that they will be left to say, "We believe" and they will not be tried?. But We have certainly tried those before them, and Allah will surely make evident those who are truthful, and He will surely make evident the liars."

Islam doesn't subscribe to the prosperity principle. Wealth, children, fear, hunger are all tests. God tests the wealthy by making them accountable for how they spend it and for ignoring the needs of those they could help.
Qur'an 64:15-16 "Your wealth and your children are but a trial, and Allah has with Him a great reward. So fear Allah as much as you are able and listen and obey and spend; it is better for your selves. And whoever is protected from the stinginess of his soul, it is those who will be the successful."

I’m not buying the fact it’s a test, not when toddlers are being blown up, starving to death or being killed by a terrible disease. If I was god I would never create such a world.

Toddlers blown up go straight to heaven. Granted this is an imperfect world, but it is finite. God also created the infinite afterlife that compensates for any sufferings and a Day of Judgement. What kind of world would you create with human beings having free will ?

What’s the point in dinosaurs though? Why have them if you’re going to have them for billions of years to just get rid of them and give the world to those that are supposedly your children.

Just as we see all the species around us having a role in the food-chain and equilibrium of the Earth, dinosaurs might have had a similar role at the time.

The message is weak though, who are we supposed to believe? How do I know that Muhammad is right and Jesus isn’t? They both make extraordinary claims but the only evidence I have is the book. Should I believe Joseph Smith? He made the same claims after all.

The Qur'an helps in this regard by unifying the message of all the prophets. We make no distinction between Muhammad(saw) and Jesus(as).

At least that’s something. Being punished for being a contrarian isn’t moral though. Questioning someone claiming divinity is logical, not punishable in my view.

Agreed. The questioning that is not allowed is after the proof of prophethood is established (by miracles and other signs that the Prophets bring with).

If it’s true I’ve no chance - “sorry God I thought Islam was a load of nonsense that didn’t help me understand the world nor the universe and the story of Muhammad going to the moon on a unicorn made me laugh. Oh and maybe don’t be so antisemitic in the bloody first chapter. Please show me mercy though”

Religion is to understand God, not the universe and the scriptures are there to answer questions on faith. Prophets teaching science is counter-productive and a waste of time. They'll have a hard time teaching the ignorant masses of the laws of physics and cosmology.

Muhammad's (saw) ascension to the heavens was to show him the signs, to meet the prophets and speak to God. We are not required to base our faith on miracles. They are only proofs for those who witness them (and this event wasn't witnessed by anyone).

The antisemitic claim is ludicruous. This is the verse in the 1st chapter you're referring to.
Qur'an 1:6-7 "Guide us to the straight path, the path of those upon whom You have bestowed favor, not of those who have evoked [Your] anger or of those who are astray."
Notice that there is no mention of Christians or Jews in the verse. Even if the latter part of the verse is referring to them, as some scholar or commentator opine, it is still talking only of the sinful people and not the righteous among them. If Qur'an criticizes the Jews who violated the Sabbath, it is only honouring the Jewish faith. It is similar to how Jesus(as) called out the rabbis and the pharisees.

As for the righteous among them, Qur'an speaks of them in much much higher regard than the Old Testament itself. I'll give some examples to illustrate this.
Example 1: The greatest Jewish prophet Moses(as) kills an Egyptian

Old Testament - And it came to pass in those days, when Moses was grown, that he went out unto his brethren, and looked on their burdens: and he spied an Egyptian smiting an Hebrew, one of his brethren. And he looked this way and that way, and when he saw that there was no man, he slew the Egyptian, and hid him in the sand” (Exodus. 2:11-12)

Qur'an 28:15-16 - And he entered the city at a time of inattention by its people and found therein two men fighting: one from his faction and one from among his enemy. And the one from his faction called for help to him against the one from his enemy, so Moses struck him and killed him. [Moses] said, "This is from the work of Satan. Indeed, he is a manifest, misleading enemy. He said, "My Lord, indeed I have wronged myself, so forgive me..."

In the OT narration, Moses(as) is seen as spying and intentionally killing the Egyptian, whereas in the Qur'anic account, he only wanted to help his fellow Israelite, but accidentally his blow was too strong that the Egyptian got killed and immediately after that Moses(as) repents for his mistake.

Example 2: Aaron(as), the high priest and brother of Moses(as) is involved in a grave sin of making golden calf idol.

Old Testament - "He(Aaron) took what they handed him and made it into an idol cast in the shape of a calf, fashioning it with a tool. Then they said, "These are your gods, Israel, who brought you up out of Egypt" - Exodus 32:4

Qur'an 20:90-94 - And Aaron had already told them before [the return of Moses], "O my people, you are only being tested by it, and indeed, your Lord is the Most Merciful, so follow me and obey my order. They said, "We will never cease being devoted to the calf until Moses returns to us. [Moses] said, "O Aaron, what prevented you, when you saw them going astray, from following me? Then have you disobeyed my order?" [Aaron] said, "O son of my mother, do not seize [me] by my beard or by my head. Indeed, I feared that you would say, 'You caused division among the Children of Israel, and you did not observe [or await] my word.' "

In the Qur'anic account, Aaron(as) has no role in making the idol (this is done by a Samiri), and he even warns the people that they are being tested by this.

Example 3: Prophet Jacob (Israel)'s reaction on hearing the dream of Joseph(as).

Old Testament - "Listen," he (Joseph) said, "I had another dream, and this time the sun and moon and eleven stars were bowing down to me. When he told his father as well as his brothers, his father rebuked him and said, "What is this dream you had? Will your mother and I and your brothers actually come and bow down to the ground before you?" - Genesis 37:9-10

Qur'an 12:5-6 "He (Jacob) said, "O my son, do not relate your vision to your brothers or they will contrive against you a plan. Indeed Satan, to man, is a manifest enemy. And thus will your Lord choose you and teach you the interpretation of narratives and complete His favor upon you and upon the family of Jacob, as He completed it upon your fathers before, Abraham and Isaac. Indeed, your Lord is Knowing and Wise."

In the OT narration, Jacob(as) rebukes his son for seeing a dream and shows dislike for the dream, whereas in the Qur'an, Jacob(as) is shown as a wise father, advises his son not to disclose the dream to his jealous brothers and reassures that the Lord has chosen him.

As you can see, Qur'an honors the Jewish prophets and clears them of the sins and bad character attributed to them in the OT. Islam rejects stories like the affair of Prophet David(as) with Bathsheba. Caliph Ali(as), son-in-law of the Prophet declared he would whip a Muslim who narrated the story of David's affair from the OT. Such is the reverence an Arab prophet from the lineage of Ismael(as) showed towards the Jewish prophets. So, how convincing is your claim of anti-semitism in the Qur'an ?

It's already a long post, I'll reply to the other comments another day..