12,000 points first day of sale for Cardiff Away

[frasermcfc]

Come up with a reason why a ten year rolling period would be unfair to anyone yet?

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

For arguments sake let's say 1,000 points are available each year if you attend every game.



Fan A has 10,000 points. He has been to every game for 10 years and will keep going to every game.
Fan B has 5,000 points. He has attended half the games in the last 10 years, and will continue to attend half of them.
Fan C has 0 points now but is now old enough to start going and plans to attend every game.

Under the current points system it would take 10 years for Fan C to catch Fan B and he will never catch Fan A.
Under the proposed 10 year rolling points system Fan C will overtake Fan B after 5 years, and finally be on a par with Fan A after 10 years.

Those sort of timescales in the rolling system feel right to me.

If you are Fan C the current points system stinks. Fan B has always been less committed than Fan C, but he's older so he'll stay ahead in the queue for the next 10 years. He'll take the high-demand ticket you could have had, but he'll smugly point out to you on Bluemoon that he's time-served and if you really want to catch him you need to go to Crystal Palace on a Tuesday night (he won't be going personally, he never does those sort of games).

Fan A has nothing to fear from a rolling points system.

superb example.

 

[SWP's back]

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

Why should it be fair that everyone's was wiped pre 2001?

A rolling ten year period would reward continued loyalty which is what the club care about at the end of the day.

Why the need for the 10 year rolling period, the club reward loyalty without it? Everyone has had the opportunity to get extra points by going platinum and signing up to all cup schemes, that's every season ticket holder.

There was a poster on here some time back who said there is an high percentage of season ticket holders who've never been to a cup game, that isn't showing the same loyalty as those that attend these fixtures, so why the need to punish those fans.

I've given you an example of how quickly points can be quickly amassed.

I remember the days when I couldn't get a united away ticket but in time I've claimed the ladder, likewise so will others, in time.

youve still not given a reason why a ten year rolling period would be unfair.<br /><br />-- Wed Aug 07, 2013 6:47 pm --<br /><br />

Come up with a reason why a ten year rolling period would be unfair to anyone yet?

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

For arguments sake let's say 1,000 points are available each year if you attend every game.

Fan A has 10,000 points. He has been to every game for 10 years and will keep going to every game.
Fan B has 5,000 points. He has attended half the games in the last 10 years, and will continue to attend half of them.
Fan C has 0 points now but is now old enough to start going and plans to attend every game.

Under the current points system it would take 10 years for Fan C to catch Fan B and he will never catch Fan A.
Under the proposed 10 year rolling points system Fan C will overtake Fan B after 5 years, and finally be on a par with Fan A after 10 years.

Those sort of timescales in the rolling system feel right to me.

If you are Fan C the current points system stinks. Fan B has always been less committed than Fan C, but he's older so he'll stay ahead in the queue for the next 10 years. He'll take the high-demand ticket you could have had, but he'll smugly point out to you on Bluemoon that he's time-served and if you really want to catch him you need to go to Crystal Palace on a Tuesday night (he won't be going personally, he never does those sort of games).

Fan A has nothing to fear from a rolling points system.

very good and exactly what I mean.

 

[Deleted member 52846]

Come up with a reason why a ten year rolling period would be unfair to anyone yet?

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

For arguments sake let's say 1,000 points are available each year if you attend every game.

Fan A has 10,000 points. He has been to every game for 10 years and will keep going to every game.
Fan B has 5,000 points. He has attended half the games in the last 10 years, and will continue to attend half of them.
Fan C has 0 points now but is now old enough to start going and plans to attend every game.

Under the current points system it would take 10 years for Fan C to catch Fan B and he will never catch Fan A.
Under the proposed 10 year rolling points system Fan C will overtake Fan B after 5 years, and finally be on a par with Fan A after 10 years.

Those sort of timescales in the rolling system feel right to me.

If you are Fan C the current points system stinks. Fan B has always been less committed than Fan C, but he's older so he'll stay ahead in the queue for the next 10 years. He'll take the high-demand ticket you could have had, but he'll smugly point out to you on Bluemoon that he's time-served and if you really want to catch him you need to go to Crystal Palace on a Tuesday night (he won't be going personally, he never does those sort of games).

Fan A has nothing to fear from a rolling points system.

Good post.

I don't see what people aren't getting that if you go to a lot of games you'll always have a lot of points so they won't ever have to worry about losing points because they're always gaining them.

 

[Regular Joe]

A lot of "Fan A" types are missing the point. This is not about them and they will be ok come what may.

The issue is the relationship between "Fan B" and "Fan C", and the current system is now getting so ridiculously (in my opinion) biased towards "Fan B" that something needs to change.

 

[allan harper]

Come up with a reason why a ten year rolling period would be unfair to anyone yet?

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

For arguments sake let's say 1,000 points are available each year if you attend every game.

Fan A has 10,000 points. He has been to every game for 10 years and will keep going to every game.
Fan B has 5,000 points. He has attended half the games in the last 10 years, and will continue to attend half of them.
Fan C has 0 points now but is now old enough to start going and plans to attend every game.

Under the current points system it would take 10 years for Fan C to catch Fan B and he will never catch Fan A.
Under the proposed 10 year rolling points system Fan C will overtake Fan B after 5 years, and finally be on a par with Fan A after 10 years.

Those sort of timescales in the rolling system feel right to me.

If you are Fan C the current points system stinks. Fan B has always been less committed than Fan C, but he's older so he'll stay ahead in the queue for the next 10 years. He'll take the high-demand ticket you could have had, but he'll smugly point out to you on Bluemoon that he's time-served and if you really want to catch him you need to go to Crystal Palace on a Tuesday night (he won't be going personally, he never does those sort of games).

Fan A has nothing to fear from a rolling points system.

When you put it like that I can understand what you're getting at but:

It's basically a formula to help new comers get to the top quicker, which I'll never agree with, I don't care how many points i have.

The club already have a system to help new comers, it's called platinum and cup schemes, add time and money to those two and put the graft in like the rest of us have had to do, you'll soon work your way up the ladder.

The price of watching football is taking its toil on most of us, you say those at the top will stay at the top, not really, I'm already cutting my London trips down, so will a lot of other fans, there's an opportunity to catch us up, I'm not arsed if its done that way but to take points off everyone especially when some bloke wasn't even watching us 10 years ago is pure wrong.

 

[Deleted member 52846]

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

For arguments sake let's say 1,000 points are available each year if you attend every game.

Fan A has 10,000 points. He has been to every game for 10 years and will keep going to every game.
Fan B has 5,000 points. He has attended half the games in the last 10 years, and will continue to attend half of them.
Fan C has 0 points now but is now old enough to start going and plans to attend every game.

Under the current points system it would take 10 years for Fan C to catch Fan B and he will never catch Fan A.
Under the proposed 10 year rolling points system Fan C will overtake Fan B after 5 years, and finally be on a par with Fan A after 10 years.

Those sort of timescales in the rolling system feel right to me.

If you are Fan C the current points system stinks. Fan B has always been less committed than Fan C, but he's older so he'll stay ahead in the queue for the next 10 years. He'll take the high-demand ticket you could have had, but he'll smugly point out to you on Bluemoon that he's time-served and if you really want to catch him you need to go to Crystal Palace on a Tuesday night (he won't be going personally, he never does those sort of games).

Fan A has nothing to fear from a rolling points system.

When you put it like that I can understand what you're getting at but:

It's basically a formula to help new comers get to the top quicker, which I'll never agree with, I don't care how many points i have.

The club already have a system to help new comers, it's called platinum and cup schemes, add time and money to those two and put the graft in like the rest of us have had to do, you'll soon work your way up the ladder.

The price of watching football is taking its toil on most of us, you say those at the top will stay at the top, not really, I'm already cutting my London trips down, so will a lot of other fans, there's an opportunity to catch us up, I'm not arsed if its done that way but to take points off everyone especially when some bloke wasn't even watching us 10 years ago is pure wrong.

Newcomers will probably never get to the top. The only newcomers that will ever reach a high level of points would be those who go to every single home and away game for years and years on end and they won't be able to do that for many years when they're first starting out. In fact, to reach the top, even with ten year rolling points, would take a newcomer about twenty-five years.

 

[swblue7]

3k points = No hope :-(

 

[fathellensbellend]

what is being overlooked in these loyalty points arguments, is that those time served fans really did earn their points the hard way, in the first few years most games were just 10 loyalty points, no 100 points for tipping up for Timisoara at home, or hundreds of points for joining cup schemes.

In fact you could argue some of the recent incentives offered for loyalty points have virtually deemed those first few seasons of points earning nearly worthless, at a time when the team was dire and empty seats at away games was the norm, but then again those moaning now, were not interested then.

 

[mayo31]

Whoever at the club came up with the platinum and gold schemes must be seen as a genius within the club.

It has brought more money in, created what some call 'points whoring' and thereby demand for all tickets, home and away.

What the knock ons for demand are I not totally sure but a club that is in demand attracts other things like sponsors etc.

Obviously us being at the top is also a big draw but it is all part of the plan

 

[ChichesterBlue]

How can it be fair that I amass more points then someone else this season, meaning I've spent more time/money than that person, then in 10 years time we both have our points wiped out for this season. I'm not seeing what you're seeing mate.

For arguments sake let's say 1,000 points are available each year if you attend every game.

Fan A has 10,000 points. He has been to every game for 10 years and will keep going to every game.
Fan B has 5,000 points. He has attended half the games in the last 10 years, and will continue to attend half of them.
Fan C has 0 points now but is now old enough to start going and plans to attend every game.

Under the current points system it would take 10 years for Fan C to catch Fan B and he will never catch Fan A.
Under the proposed 10 year rolling points system Fan C will overtake Fan B after 5 years, and finally be on a par with Fan A after 10 years.

Those sort of timescales in the rolling system feel right to me.

If you are Fan C the current points system stinks. Fan B has always been less committed than Fan C, but he's older so he'll stay ahead in the queue for the next 10 years. He'll take the high-demand ticket you could have had, but he'll smugly point out to you on Bluemoon that he's time-served and if you really want to catch him you need to go to Crystal Palace on a Tuesday night (he won't be going personally, he never does those sort of games).

Fan A has nothing to fear from a rolling points system.

When you put it like that I can understand what you're getting at but:

It's basically a formula to help new comers get to the top quicker, which I'll never agree with, I don't care how many points i have.

The club already have a system to help new comers, it's called platinum and cup schemes, add time and money to those two and put the graft in like the rest of us have had to do, you'll soon work your way up the ladder.

The price of watching football is taking its toil on most of us, you say those at the top will stay at the top, not really, I'm already cutting my London trips down, so will a lot of other fans, there's an opportunity to catch us up, I'm not arsed if its done that way but to take points off everyone especially when some bloke wasn't even watching us 10 years ago is pure wrong.

Weren't you a newcomer once? Surely using the (great) example provided, a period of 10 years to catch people up is hardly a short time period - ie "newcomers" aren't gonna catch any of the top points fans up unless they match their attendance record over a 10 year period (given the example used).

I love the way that a lot of fans think that supporting City started at COMS. All I earned for 19 years of season tickets in the North Stand at Maine Road was a measly 1500 loyalty points for being classed as a "regular season ticket holder", so all the "newcomers" in the new stadium were able to catch some of us up pretty quickly, but fair's fair...if they attend matches over a decent period of time, they deserve the points and the right to have a chance at attending the top away games.
People didn't stand around shouting "this isn't fair, I was at the XXXX game in 1984, where were all you lot then" etc etc. Under your way of thinking, if this points system would have started back in the 80's with no rolling window and fans had the same view then of "I aint giving up any points from 10, 12, 15 years ago etc",, you wouldn't have had a chance of attending any of the big games now. A rolling window will reward future fans who are consistently attending home & away games over a given period of time.

Your example of using platinum to catch people up is not a good one as it's a level playing field for everyone, ie every fan could take up platinum if they so wished, and generally the top 25% of attending fans will no doubt do so.