Think I’ve seen this. Was it released about a year ago?Just watched “Downfall - The Case Against Boeing” on Netflix. New documentary about the 737 Max and what they knew about it.
It’s appalling people didn’t go to prison for it and $2.5bn in fines and compensation really doesn’t seem enough.
Just watched “Downfall - The Case Against Boeing” on Netflix. New documentary about the 737 Max and what they knew about it.
It’s appalling people didn’t go to prison for it and $2.5bn in fines and compensation really doesn’t seem enough.
Just watched “Downfall - The Case Against Boeing” on Netflix. New documentary about the 737 Max and what they knew about it.
It’s appalling people didn’t go to prison for it and $2.5bn in fines and compensation really doesn’t seem enough.
Yup. Basically the merger between McDonald Douglas and Boeing saw a step change in the way the company managed risk, and not for the better. They physically separated the corporate business management from the manufacturing side of the business and focused solely on the stock prices and executive bonuses. The whole attitude to risk changed and issues on the shop floor were brushed under the carpet as workers were encouraged not to report safety concerns.Just watched “Downfall - The Case Against Boeing” on Netflix. New documentary about the 737 Max and what they knew about it.
It’s appalling people didn’t go to prison for it and $2.5bn in fines and compensation really doesn’t seem enough.
Last Friday was its release mate, brand new.Think I’ve seen this. Was it released about a year ago?
The sad thing is the engineers and people on the ground will be tarnished by this when they actually are the ones who did nothing wrong. I work in the industry (not for Boeing) and I see the same corporate vs engineer arguments all the time. Gone are the days when companies were run to build things, now it's all about the bottom line.Yup. Basically the merger between McDonald Douglas and Boeing saw a step change in the way the company managed risk, and not for the better. They physically separated the corporate business management from the manufacturing side of the business and focused solely on the stock prices and executive bonuses. The whole attitude to risk changed and issues on the shop floor were brushed under the carpet as workers were encouraged not to report safety concerns.
Also, the whole Max8 design stratergy in putting a critical safety system on an aircraft that had a potential single-point-of-failure within the system on a vulnerable component (AOA probe) and then not informing operators or training pilots to use was simply NUTS.
For their CEO to walk away with a severance package of $62 MILLION is frankly criminal. As was the $2.7 BILLION in fines and NOBODY going to jail. Corporate greed and ZERO responsibility.
Agreed. The FAA don't come out of this very well. I've no doubt that they were were being leaned on to a degree. The US Gov't eventually pulled the plug on the Max but they effectively had no choice.The sad thing is the engineers and people on the ground will be tarnished by this when they actually are the ones who did nothing wrong. I work in the industry (not for Boeing) and I see the same corporate vs engineer arguments all the time. Gone are the days when companies were run to build things, now it's all about the bottom line.
This happens because the people in charge of these companies are no longer engineering people, they're project managers and sales people. They aren't people who are passionate about the products or even interested in what the company actually does. All they want is their bonuses and/or a tag under their CV saying they delivered X on-time.
This will happen and it should be expected because all companies at the end of the day exist to make money. What stops that fact from leading to something dangerous though is regulation and certainly the lack of regulation in the US is a prime reason why these dangerous things can and will happen.
As much as Boeing behaved criminally, it's also criminal that they were allowed to behave criminally but what are the FAA doing about how they themselves allowed it to happen? That's something the documentary didn't mention but the FAA should be just as culpable because they are the only people who can stop companies from doing bad things.
Flint water scandal, Purdue Pharma scandal, Dupont.... There are endless examples of documented cover ups where very few if any individuals are brought to justice.Is there another company on earth that could survive this level of disastrous circumstances. Boardroom World ring-fencing is truly impenetrable, the ring of sacrificial expendables is the nearest justice ever reaches, and even then it's very rare. From the Titanic to Covid, taking in DDT, thalidomide, Bhopal, Asbestos, Poisoned blood, train doors, aluminium chloride in drinking water,
operation Tiger, the Chagos islands, and many many more. NO-ONE faces justice...beyond the law is an understatement. And we laugh at N.Korea...
And meFlew back on one of these from Lisbon with Ryanair on Wednesday
The relationship between Boeing and the FAA was far too cosy. Too much responsibility given to company DERs and not enough scrutiny of their decisions and recommendations by independent FAA consultant DERs.Agreed. The FAA don't come out of this very well. I've no doubt that they were were being leaned on to a degree. The US Gov't eventually pulled the plug on the Max but they effectively had no choice.
I mainly deal with engineers, so I'm fairly well insulated from the suits, although occasionally I have to interact with sales reps. Totally different experience.
There was far too much taken on trust by the FAA. I think a lot of it was government pressure to try and get Boeing competitive with Airbus again.The relationship between Boeing and the FAA was far too cosy. Too much responsibility given to company DERs and not enough scrutiny of their decisions and recommendations by independent FAA consultant DERs.
I’ll give this a watch! It sounds very similar to something that was released around 12 months ago.Last Friday was its release mate, brand new.
My experience at work is similar to yours. Everyone is very risk averse and the possibility of something known to be potentially dangerous being signed off is unthinkable.There was far too much taken on trust by the FAA. I think a lot of it was government pressure to try and get Boeing competitive with Airbus again.
In my line of work I've seen it the other way where people have refused to sign off on a limited risk that is a direct read across from essentially the same system (different operator) which already has the relevant safety certification in place.
Well said.Yup. Basically the merger between McDonald Douglas and Boeing saw a step change in the way the company managed risk, and not for the better. They physically separated the corporate business management from the manufacturing side of the business and focused solely on the stock prices and executive bonuses. The whole attitude to risk changed and issues on the shop floor were brushed under the carpet as workers were encouraged not to report safety concerns.
Also, the whole Max8 design stratergy in putting a critical safety system on an aircraft that had a potential single-point-of-failure within the system on a vulnerable component (AOA probe) and then not informing operators or training pilots to use was simply NUTS.
For their CEO to walk away with a severance package of $62 MILLION is frankly criminal. As was the $2.7 BILLION in fines and NOBODY going to jail. Corporate greed and ZERO responsibility.
My experience at work is similar to yours. Everyone is very risk averse and the possibility of something known to be potentially dangerous being signed off is unthinkable.