Added time (the facts)

i8rags

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is it me or has everyone missed the blatant bullshit and twisting of facts from the derby.
it is very convenient to say the extra two minutes came from our celebrations etc and is almost believable, until you see these facts.
1, bellamy scores and two minutes are added to the four.
2, owen scores and no time is added.
how can this be, one rule for them and one for us, dont fall for their bullshit they robbed us and its clear for all to see.
 
didn't Taggart ban Atkinson from officiating at OT about a year ago? Or advised his superiors not to send him there? He'll certainly be welcome now.
 
there was also a subsition in the 93rd minute..so an extra 30secs to be added ...and then a further 1 min for Owens celbration
 
i8rags said:
is it me or has everyone missed the blatant bullshit and twisting of facts from the derby.
it is very convenient to say the extra two minutes came from our celebrations etc and is almost believable, until you see these facts.
1, bellamy scores and two minutes are added to the four.
2, owen scores and no time is added.
how can this be, one rule for them and one for us, dont fall for their bullshit they robbed us and its clear for all to see.


true mate...16 seconds/bellany 55 seconds...pure bullshit

lets try forget about it now and move on....to be honest they battered us on the day!
 
That's the thing though - it was 55 seconds according to Sky. If that is considered excessive then christ. Back to the days of a swift handshake and back to the centre circle.

And as Andy Gray said, you can't just add on that time for some goals and nothing for others.
 
Was looking on a Liverpool forum as wanted to hear them moan about Fergie time aswell and came across this really good post.

The opening six games of the season are a microcosm of the issues many of us have with how Premier League games are officiated:

At White Hart Lane on the opening weekend, Liverpool are losing 1-2 to Spurs. Referee Phil Dowd has already denied the away side a very good shout for a penalty when Assou-Ekottu barged into Voronin as he prepared to shoot. As the game is approaching injury-time, Liverpool are understandably eager to get on with things, yet two successive attempts to take a goal-kick are thwarted as Dowd busies himself sending off Liverpool assistant Sammy Lee.

Now, along with the minimum of three minutes already indicated to the fourth official (the word ‘minimum’ was stressed by the BBC website today in trying to explain how the injury-time at Old Trafford mushroomed), which presumably included two and a half minutes for the five second-half substitutions and a very stingy thirty seconds for other sundry stoppages including two goal celebrations and delays associated with a penalty and the booking for Gomes, the referee now had to add on the minute or so it took him to send Sammy Lee off, or so you would assume. We can also only assume that the aforementioned celebrations of Gerrard’s and Bassong’s goals did not figure very highly in Mr. Dowd’s calculations.

Now, also in injury-time, Spurs make a substitution (half a minute) and more time is wasted while the referee steps in as Torres and Huddlestone have an argument, an incident which includes both players getting a stern talking to. Another minute wasted at least. In the event, at least five and a half minutes should have been added that day at White Hart Lane, valuable minutes especially for a team like Liverpool which has long specialised in late goals. Yet Mr. Dowd blows his whistle at 93.18 as Liverpool are launching an attack. 18 measly seconds added to account for a substitution, a sending-off and a lecture for two players.

The upshot for Liverpool? The potential opportunity to rescue a point gone.

A few weeks later, with Liverpool 0-1 behind against Aston Villa at Anfield in the third game of the season, referee Martin Atkinson signals a minute of injury-time at the end of the first half. Somehow the teams are still on the pitch at 46:42 as Davies heads home a corner. Once again, it seems that ‘a minimum’ of one minute is what was meant, yet one wondered how about six minutes translated to 3:18 at White Hart Lane, yet Villa were allowed ample time to take their corner at Anfield.

The upshot for Liverpool? In the event, the potential opportunity to rescue a point again.

Then a week or so later, with Manchester United 0-1 behind to Arsenal at Old Trafford, Wayne Rooney falls over Almunia’s legs, with television replays appearing to indicate that the United striker was already on his way to ground before any contact was made (a far cry from the aforementioned Voronin case, who was clearly taken out by the defender). Mike Dean, unlike Phil Dowd on that occasion, immediately points to the spot.

The upshot for United? A potential no points eventually becomes three points.

And today, with Manchester City having equalised in the last minute of the Manchester derby at Old Trafford, the ‘minimum’ of four minutes indicated by referee Martin Atkinson eventually mushrooms to almost seven, with Michael Owen scoring the winner at 95:28 when you would have assumed that both teams would have been walking towards the dressing-room. Explanations are quick to be given, yet one substitution in injury-time doesn’t change the fact that Pavlyuchenko coming on for Tottenham in the aforementioned game at White Hart Lane in August merited only 18 seconds. Meanwhile, the celebration of Bellamy’s equaliser is rather bafflingly added to the mix, again ignoring the fact that two goals being celebrated at White Hart Lane apparently warranted thirty seconds at most.

The upshot for United? A point eventually becomes three.

Is there consistency here? Can you find any? I can.

Four matches this season which include a very good case for a Liverpool penalty turned down, while an apparent dive by Wayne Rooney was given. No time added for all of the incidents at White Hart Lane, yet almost seven added today for less. We could also mention the five minutes handed to Chelsea in each of their games against Hull and Stoke where they scored an injury-time winner in each, a potential two points becoming six.

Manchester United and Chelsea have shared the last five Premier League titles, and that’s no surprise. Along with having the best squads and the most money in those five years, they have also benefited more from borderline (and often downright wrong) refereeing decisions than any other team. Why? Well we know from watching Liverpool that our players do not badger the referee, surround him, scream in his face, and our manager and coaches do not accompany him to the dressing-room at half-time. There is no constant pressure from the moment he arrives at the stadium, no harassment, no intimidation. The club and its staff, playing and otherwise, treats the man in black with respect, as do most other clubs at the top level.

Manchester United and Chelsea do not. It’s no surprise that the short-lived ‘respect’ campaign started because of a Chelsea player (Ashley Cole), and probably none either that it’s only victim was a non-United or Chelsea player. The worst offenders for abusing officials, yet it’s a Liverpool player who becomes the poster-boy for respecting match officials or else. Michael Ballack chased a referee during the Champions League semi-final, even put his hands on him. John Terry and Ashley Cole regularly scream abuse, as does Wayne Rooney. More than that, it’s a constant pressure being applied around the neck of what is, at the end of the day, an amateur.

The media prefer to turn a blind eye, of course. When Rafa spoke out against the intimidation of referees by Manchester United back in January, he was laughed at. Another Keegan. Funny how two of the referees he mentioned by name on that occasion as being victims of intimidation at Old Trafford (Mike Dean and Martin Atkinson) were the ones who gave the two aforementioned helping hands to Mr. Ferguson’s team this season so far. I, personally, do not see that as a coincidence. It’s the intimidation tactics that Ferguson has employed over the years and which has given them the edge on so many occasions at work once again. We saw it again last season when, if Riley hadn’t added five minutes against Villa and Webb hadn’t given them a penalty when they were 0-2 behind against Spurs, the title race may have been even closer.

The small details. Borderline decisions going their way time and time again. The media may prefer to concentrate on them being the better team today, but that’s a cop-out. Plenty of times, Liverpool or Arsenal have dominated a game only to come out of it with a point. Dominating a game and not winning it is something that happens to every team, something which, to quote the cliché, evens out over the course of a season. Yet I can only remember an inexplicable five or six minutes being added in a Liverpool game once (CL Semi, 2005) and that benefited Chelsea, not us.

These kind of bewildering decisions only happen for Man. Utd and Chelsea. They never even out. Those two clubs, as good as their teams are, have an extra advantage that we don’t. In other words, we’re at a disadvantage from the get-go. How many more times is it going to have to happen before a pattern emerges to those who hide behind the old “you’re paranoid, conspiracy theory, blah, blah” bullshit? This is happening, and it’s making things very difficult for any other team. The choice is stark - hope that Rafa and his players begin intimidating refs so that we benefit from their weaknesses, or go on trying to win fairly and watching United and Chelsea pick up the points that we’re consistently losing.

But then, Rafa got a disrepute charge slapped on him for saying less than Ferguson (who escaped scot-free) did after the Community Shield, while Torres and Mascherano were made an example out of at Old Trafford around the time of the start of the respect campaign, while the likes of Wayne Rooney consistently gets away with more. If anyone is still waiting for those things to “even out”, you'll be waiting.
 
We see it.

What needs to be seen is that it is institutionalised.

Not just us. Spuds at OT last season, Spuds v. CFC yesterday.

Referees, whether you add the nine bob note epithet or not, are no longer upto the game. It is beyond their capabilities. And it suits the OldTopFour because until it changes they are the only beneficiaries of the so-called 'swings and roundabouts', the likes of Spuds, Villa, Everton, MCFC never get a bloody go on the swings.

And the truth is that referees do not seem to notice that they need help. They justify every flaw on the back of vague International Board decisions.

Yesterday, the ref can add any time on for any cause. That's what it says.

Until we get away from the notion that 'the ref is right, even when he is a pillock' you will get consolidation of the OldTopFour and refs, pundits and RagLovers coming out with dubious justification after dubious justification.
 
All great point so either add them to the FA Watch thread please so they can be mentioned to the FA directly.
 
Ben10 said:
there was also a subsition in the 93rd minute..so an extra 30secs to be added ...and then a further 1 min for Owens celbration

Please stop trying to justify the bullshit that you have gotten away with.
 
Here's a little ditty for Taggart

"Fergie Time" (To the tune of “Summertime”) :

Fergie Time
And the fixing is easy
Officials help us
They toe the line

But we need help,
‘cos City are drawing
so hush little whistle
give us more time

One of these matches
They’re going to stuff us quite badly
They’re going to kick our arse
And make us look bad

Until that moment
There ain’t nothing to harm us
‘cos refs understand me
and know what I’m like when mad.

------------
Now let's calm down a bit.
Their days are looking numbered and were on the up !
Proud of everyone.
 

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