Afghanistan

That Biden has finally pulled us out of Afghanistan is IMO absolutely the correct decision. There is however a failure of intelligence with respect to the rapid collapse of Afghan forces.

I guess that but buck stops at the Commander and Chief - but honestly - accurate forecasting of Taliban strength and capability, preparedness to quickly advance the moment that US disengages - US intelligence and/or the ability to communicate up the line is obviously screwed up.
===
Me? I don't fault Biden here at all. The correct decision is to pull out. We need to get all citizens out of Afghanistan and any Afghan who has shown loyalty to our cause is now at extreme peril.
 
Last edited:
kaz7 said:
We could have got people out months ago , biden extended the withdrawal from april to now , we had no plan obviously and why they didnt expected the local forces would collapse i dont know , they have been flakey from the start . The lack of exit organisation is a failure by us however you look at it, trump signed the deal more than a year ago at least
Click to expand...
So the only other option would have been to withdraw earlier...which seems to be what I said in my post.
 
BlueMoonAcrossThePond said:
That Biden has finally pulled us out of Afghanistan is IMO absolutely the correct decision. There is however a failure of intelligence with respect to the rapid collapse of Afghan forces.
Click to expand...
Aye.

So he can do the same to Syria when Afghanistan drops off the news cycle.

Labour MP for the Wirral triggering Tories by telling them the truth about the PM/FS being more arsed about breaking their holidays.
 
mat said:
We're more pissed that that Johnson and Rabb decided their holidays for more important than this debate and had to be dragged back to parliament to discuss it.

It's gonna be a fucked up world of the Taliban do uphold their agreement with trump this showing them more trust worthy than the cunts we have in parliament.
Click to expand...
But there is no vote and therefore no point. It is a meaningless point scoring debate. They could have stayed on their holidays and liaised by secure phone
The whole shit show is not down to Boris being on his jollies. It has been a 20 year shit show with no end game.
 
mat said:
Aye.

So he can do the same to Syria when Afghanistan drops off the news cycle.

Labour MP for the Wirral triggering Tories by telling them the truth about the PM/FS being more arsed about breaking their holidays.
Click to expand...
A country can engage in forever wars at huge cost - or can wake up and think - what on earth are we doing here?

Afghanistan is a lost cause and has been a colossal blunder for any nation seeking to engage them in warfare for years and years and years running.
 
Blue Mist said:
But there is no vote and therefore no point. It is a meaningless point scoring debate. They could have stayed on their holidays and liaised by secure phone
The whole shit show is not down to Boris being on his jollies. It has been a 20 year shit show with no end game.
Click to expand...
It also shows we never learn from history.
 
BlueMoonAcrossThePond said:
That Biden has finally pulled us out of Afghanistan is IMO absolutely the correct decision. There is however a failure of intelligence with respect to the rapid collapse of Afghan forces.

I guess that but buck stops at the Commander and Chief - but honestly - accurate forecasting of Taliban strength and capability, preparedness to quickly advance the moment that US disengages - US intelligence and/or the ability to communicate up the line is obviously screwed up.
===
Me? I don't fault Biden here at all. The correct decision is to pull out. We need to get all citizens out of Afghanistan and any Afghan who has shown loyalty to our cause is now at extreme peril.
Click to expand...

Yes, it seems to me that the intelligence and planning are fouled up completely on both sides of the Atlantic.

Trump trying to frame it all as Biden's baby is quite ludicrous, including removing crowing announcements of peace with the Taliban.
Biden could either continue or stay - the latter would leave him open to attack and disrupt any military planning for the US and any allies. Pretty much lose-lose.
As he continued, either the intelligence was quite dreadful or it's been ignored. My suspicion (both UK and US) is the former, and that in some rooms the right questions weren't asked.
The UK needs to wake up and realise that we don't have that much power in anywhere awkward; might be okay in a naval conflict against a minor power, but not in somewhere like Afghanistan.

I also think there is a perception among some that the Taliban are stupid tribesmen - clearly they've spent their time in the run-up to the withdrawal date putting things in place.
 
mat said:
We're more pissed that that Johnson and Rabb decided their holidays for more important than this debate and had to be dragged back to parliament to discuss it.

It's gonna be a fucked up world of the Taliban do uphold their agreement with trump this showing them more trust worthy than the cunts we have in parliament.
Click to expand...
He has gone out of the house now, so if he stayed to listen to some of the excellent speakers elected and on behalf of us the people, he may have learnt something but no he’s gone on more important business. No doubt!

PS my bad he’s back now hiding
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: mat
BlueMoonAcrossThePond said:
That Biden has finally pulled us out of Afghanistan is IMO absolutely the correct decision. There is however a failure of intelligence with respect to the rapid collapse of Afghan forces.

I guess that but buck stops at the Commander and Chief - but honestly - accurate forecasting of Taliban strength and capability, preparedness to quickly advance the moment that US disengages - US intelligence and/or the ability to communicate up the line is obviously screwed up.
===
Me? I don't fault Biden here at all. The correct decision is to pull out. We need to get all citizens out of Afghanistan and any Afghan who has shown loyalty to our cause is now at extreme peril.
Click to expand...
I think the consensus of the ex-forces MPs (and Rory Stewart) is that the low-cost (in lives) of continuing to maintain forces there and prevent this scenario was quite feasible. Peace means there for the long haul - did I hear the average age of people in Afghanistan is 18??? - and how long were US troops based in Europe after WW2?

The only question then would be whether the Taliban had entered "peace" talks (with Trump!) only to get foreign forces out - but surely only the most stupid president would not wonder if they were lulling him into a false sense of security. He was of course flushed with the success of his peace deal with North Korea.

Biden might have pulled the plug on the Trump plan, but the "If-not-now, when?" * question probably plays well with voters who don't think the lives of people far away are worth the life of a single Pomeranian grenadier (i think Pomerania is a small town in Indiana). But what would the Taliban do if they thought "the West" was there "for ever"?

* I think this may be a very dangerous question. The answer is "When the future 'now' is different to this 'now'".
 
Was that Theresa May making the case for an EU army?

“We boast about Global Britain, but where is Global Britain on the streets of Kabul?”

“What does it say about NATO if we are entirely dependent on a unilateral decision taken by the United States?”

“I do find it incomprehensible and worrying that the United Kingdom was not able to bring together not a military solution but an alternative alliance with countries to continue to provide the support necessary to sustain a government in Afghanistan.”
 
Vic said:
Was that Theresa May making the case for an EU army?

“We boast about Global Britain, but where is Global Britain on the streets of Kabul?”

“What does it say about NATO if we are entirely dependent on a unilateral decision taken by the United States?”

“I do find it incomprehensible and worrying that the United Kingdom was not able to bring together not a military solution but an alternative alliance with countries to continue to provide the support necessary to sustain a government in Afghanistan.”
Click to expand...
I was listening to it on the car radio and for once was impressed by both Tory and Labour Mps that spoke (not government obvs).
it really is a shit show and comparisons were made to South Korea which had/has a US presence for decades. Peace in Afghanistan was always a long term commitment. I cannot believe that The U.K. and Us have just pulled out and let this happen. What does it say about both of us and the UN.
heartbreaking for the majority of Afghans.
 
Gray said:
So our overcrowded island is getting more overcrowded.
Click to expand...
Absolutely ridiculous isn't it.
Thousands are waiting for homes yet we can just let people in whilst gifting them freebies.
As usual this government treats tax payers with contempt whilst letting everyone in from overseas.
The UK is finished.
 
BLUEMATT23 said:
Absolutely ridiculous isn't it.
Thousands are waiting for homes yet we can just let people in whilst gifting them freebies.
As usual this government treats tax payers with contempt whilst letting everyone in from overseas.
The UK is finished.
Click to expand...

If you don't like it you are welcome to leave
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Unread Posts

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top