Anders Breivik

[squirtyflower]

No race card is being used but most of what you are saying is simply incorrect minorities are getting better qualifications and very business minded. Result the richest Briton is an Indian born in India.

This idiot was simply a racist with a sense of entitlement born from the colonist mentality many seem to have. It was fine when the Europeans went around the globe taking over nations but now people come over to Europe to live/work they are invading "the sacred land". The planet belongs to man and man should be allowed to move freely and reside where he wishes.

you have such a simplistic view of the world, i pity you

 

[Unknown_Genius]

I suppose the risk of declaring him sane, and giving him a jail term is you risk legitimising his world view, which could create sympathisers for him, "he's a maniac, but....". I personally don't think he's "insane" as such, just a very cold, calculated person, who fully believes that what he's doing is right. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to make him sound like some kind of criminal mastermind, calling him a maniac is giving him too much credit in my view. He's pathetic, one of the relatives of his victims said it best about his motives; infantile and stupid. Even with terrorist groups like the IRA and Al-Qaeda, there is some big political, and social situation, that is causing great harm to many people (ie. Israeli occupation of Palestine, Catholics in N.Ireland). For Breivik? His whole rhetoric is that the area he grew up in may have some people from Albania or Morrocco now living in it. They're not occupying the country, a Muslim isn't head of the country, and is passing laws oppressing Norweigan people. He simply has to live with them. Its the most infantile, pathetic "excuse" for terrorism I've ever heard. I would personally call him insane, and lock him up in a mental institution. That way you're not giving him any credibility, and making his 'Knights Templar' rhetoric, the ramblings of a man man, who can't be taken seriously. I think it will be the thing he least wants.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

I suppose the risk of declaring him sane, and giving him a jail term is you risk legitimising his world view, which could create sympathisers for him, "he's a maniac, but....". I personally don't think he's "insane" as such, just a very cold, calculated person, who fully believes that what he's doing is right. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to make him sound like some kind of criminal mastermind, calling him a maniac is giving him too much credit in my view. He's pathetic, one of the relatives of his victims said it best about his motives; infantile and stupid. Even with terrorist groups like the IRA and Al-Qaeda, there is some big political, and social situation, that is causing great harm to many people (ie. Israeli occupation of Palestine, Catholics in N.Ireland). For Breivik? His whole rhetoric is that the area he grew up in may have some people from Albania or Morrocco now living in it. They're not occupying the country, a Muslim isn't head of the country, and is passing laws oppressing Norweigan people. He simply has to live with them. Its the most infantile, pathetic "excuse" for terrorism I've ever heard. I would personally call him insane, and lock him up in a mental institution. That way you're not giving him any credibility, and making his 'Knights Templar' rhetoric, the ramblings of a man man, who can't be taken seriously. I think it will be the thing he least wants.

A very interesting perspective which hadn't occurred. Tempting though it is that the punishment fits the crime it would be a worrying step if we declared someone insane just because it made us feel like it was what he didn't want.

That said, I think a similar thing to U_G re: terrorists. Perhaps Thatcher had it right when she refused to confer that status upon the IRA and would only refer to them as criminals. I have previously made my ambivalent feelings on the IRA well known, so this viewpoint isn't from someone who saw the Republican movement as the devil incarnate, rather an observation that Thatcher's choice of words may have denied them the status that they craved. If someone wants to be perceived as a terrorist and you refuse to call them that, surely they can hardly claim to have won the argument.

 

[blueonblue]

That explains your views the times sir have changed.

Rather it gives me experiance of life against your simplistic veiw that everything is black or white, times have indeed changed, but from real world to idolistic based on good intentions that could not and have not stood the test of time.


That was installed because minorities were being discriminated against in the job market and it is now equal opportunities.

Are you really not able to understand that equal does not exist where there are a set of rules that discriminate in some sections favor over others based purely on % targets ?, any employer who does not select the best cadidate for a job would be a fool because its his business that will suffer, yet that is the recruitment policy this legislation enforces on public services, the police, and the armed forces, as well as hampering the private sector.

If you care to check your post its you who brings in race with the descriptive Black, a tactic the left has always used to prevent a reasoned discussion is shout racist, "Is it coz I is Black" indeed.

You come out with a statment that generalises minorities as being able to achieve a higher standard of qulifications and being "very business minded" then go on to call the nutter a racist ?, think about it.

 

[pominoz]

That explains your views the times sir have changed.

Rather it gives me experiance of life against your simplistic veiw that everything is black or white, times have indeed changed, but from real world to idolistic based on good intentions that could not and have not stood the test of time.


That was installed because minorities were being discriminated against in the job market and it is now equal opportunities.

Are you really not able to understand that equal does not exist where there are a set of rules that discriminate in some sections favor over others based purely on % targets ?, any employer who does not select the best cadidate for a job would be a fool because its his business that will suffer, yet that is the recruitment policy this legislation enforces on public services, the police, and the armed forces, as well as hampering the private sector.

If you care to check your post its you who brings in race with the descriptive Black, a tactic the left has always used to prevent a reasoned discussion is shout racist, "Is it coz I is Black" indeed.

You come out with a statment that generalises minorities as being able to achieve a higher standard of qulifications and being "very business minded" then go on to call the nutter a racist ?, think about it.

Talk about generalising about minorities, do you really think all black people can not talk English properly.

 

[SWP's back]

Ive met atleast two that can PiO you're right.

 

[metalblue]

minorities are getting better qualifications and very business minded

I trust there are words missing from the above otherwise I'd have to say that is one of the most derogatory statements I have read on here.

 

[mcmanus]

blueonblue is retired

retired = old

old = bigoted

blueonblue how dare you have an opinion on such a young man's subject. Sir times have changed don't you know, old timer.

 

[SWP's back]

minorities are getting better qualifications and very business minded

I trust there are words missing from the above otherwise I'd have to say that is one of the most derogatory statements I have read on here.

Obvious racist troll is obvious.

 

[JamesMCFC]

<a class="postlink" href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17789206" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17789206</a>

Anders Breivik describes Norway island massacre

Breivik says he learned to shut off his emotions to kill his victims
Continue reading the main story
Norway Attacks

Breivik trial: Day by day
Norway's trial of the century
Unanswered questions
Breivik profile
Anders Behring Breivik has described how he shot people who were "begging for their lives" during his island rampage in which dozens died last July.

Testifying before an Oslo court, he described seeing people curled up and "completely paralysed" as he reloaded his weapon and shot them in the head.

Earlier the 33-year-old said he was normally a nice person but had shut off his emotions to carry out the attacks.

The main aim of the trial is to decide whether he is sane or insane.

On 22 July 2011, Breivik set off a car bomb near government buildings in Oslo, killing eight, and then massacred 69 participants in a Labour Party youth camp on the nearby island of Utoeya.

A Norwegian broadcaster is showing the proceedings but not Breivik's testimony, which is being conveyed by reporters.

The BBC's Steven Rosenberg in the courtroom says Breivik described in chilling detail how he killed people on Utoeya.

Continue reading the main story
At the scene


Matthew Price
BBC News, Oslo
There's a very sombre atmosphere at the Breivik trial.

The last session was incredibly hard for people to listen to - not just the victims and bereaved, but also others, including journalists.

The moment-by-moment account Breivik gave of what he did on the island, moving from place to place, describing how he shot his victims in the head, was chilling.

Before shooting his first victims, Breivik said he had "100 voices" in his head telling him not to do it.

But after that moment of hesitation, he said he pulled the trigger, shot two people in the head and moved on.

Displaying no emotion, Breivik went on to say he had entered a cafe where several people were hiding.

"Some of them are completely paralysed. They cannot run," he said. "Two people were curled up."

He said he reloaded after running out of ammunition. "People were begging for their lives. I just shot them in the head."

The stunned silence in the courtroom was replaced with tears, our correspondent adds.

'Protection mechanism'
Breivik admits killing all 77 victims but denies criminal responsibility, saying he was defending Norway from multiculturalism.

He said he had envisaged the most important attack as being the Oslo bombing, but Utoeya "became the most important attack when the government building did not collapse" as planned.


Breivik's second target was a Labour Party summer youth camp on Utoeya
Depending on whether he is found sane or not, he faces either prison or committal to a psychiatric institution.

Breivik himself maintains he is sane but a practitioner of political extremism.

Earlier on Friday, he insisted he was "under normal circumstances a very nice person, very caring about those around me".

He said he "absolutely" understood why his testimony was horrifying to others.

But said he had embarked on a deliberate programme of "dehumanisation" in 2006 to prepare to carry out killings.

He added that empathy was not possible, as he would "break down mentally" if he tried to comprehend what he had done.

Asked if he could feel sadness, he said "yes", saying the funeral of a friend's brother had been his "saddest day".

Asked whether he had tried other methods before resorting to violence, he said he had tried "everything" - getting involved with political parties, writing essays and contributing to internet debate.

In additional points, Breivik:

claimed he had not wished to kill "civilians" when he had targeted the government buildings in Oslo, only "government targets", but it was impossible to exclude "civilian" deaths entirely
said that from 2006 he had studied the weaknesses and strengths of organisations from the IRA to al-Qaeda, concluding that the most successful was al-Qaeda, because they "embrace martyrdom" - "and that is key to the successful resistance fight".
said it was impossible for "cultural conservatives" like him to get any of their ideas published in the media or in books, due to an alleged project to protect liberal beliefs
said he believed Japan and South Korea were ideal states, as they had "taken a stand against multiculturalism and Marxism in the 1970s"
In Thursday's testimony, Breivik said he hoped his car bomb in Oslo would kill the whole government, and had also hoped to kill all those on Utoeya - more than 500 in all.

Breivik's evidence is scheduled to last five days, concluding on Monday. The entire proceedings are expected to last 10 weeks.

It's unimaginable to me how any one can go round shooting people and feel no remorse, no pity.