Another new Brexit thread

[kevin horlocks wand]

I'm one of the least politically educated/aligned folk there is, unashamedly so, but it doesn't take otherwise to know that the amount of rabble-rousing and shithousery akin to kids in a school canteen when someone drops a plate is disgraceful from adults; let alone elected officials.

How is that carry on always allowed? Genuinely staggers me.

The parliament is a disgrace . The lot of them

 

[cibaman]

We could have a ‘Government of National Unity’ led by hardcore Remainers

Embrace the chaos

Yesterday Barry Gardiner suggested that a national unity government (led by JC), should rule for 6 months, the time he believes it would take to hold a referendum. He’d obviously thought this through as a few minutes earlier he’d insisted that he would not “make up policy on the hoof”.

Must admit it seems like a hugely entertaining idea. Not only the prospect of them organising the referendum (there was no suggestion of a renegotiation beforehand) in that time, but also dealing with all of the non Brexit issues.

 

[mcfc1632]

It is disingenuous to pretend that a sizeable amount of MP's have not from the first second done all they can to stop brexit and not to facilitate it.

Talk about rewriting history and the facts;-)

 

[west didsblue]

The parliament is a disgrace . The lot of them

Simplistic nonsense.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Simplistic nonsense.

Do you ever post a point on the topic other than spoiling for a fight and insulting posters

 

[west didsblue]

Do you ever post a point on the topic other than spoiling for a fight and insulting posters

Regularly but when you make a simplistic comment you get a simplistic response.
Why don't you tell us why all 650 MPs are a disgrace and we can maybe discuss it.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Regularly but when you make a simplistic comment you get a simplistic response.
Why don't you tell us why all 650 MPs are a disgrace and we can maybe discuss it.

I feel that may take sometime don’t you ? It’s a generic comment about parliament in general and the fact that they just grandstand and shout at each other and are very good at saying what they dont like but not very good at saying what they do want .

You will see I gave balance and my comment applies equally to all parties and whether remain or leave

 

[west didsblue]

I feel that may take sometime don’t you ? It’s a generic comment about parliament in general and the fact that they just grandstand and shout at each other and are very good at saying what they dont like but not very good at saying what they do want .

You will see I gave balance and my comment applies equally to all parties and whether remain or leave

Yes they certainly do shout at each other and often the theatre of it all overshadows the underlying debate. But I honestly don't believe all of Parliament is a disgrace. I would argue that the government is a disgrace for the following reasons:
- Parliament voted through the invocation of Article 50 by a huge majority in March 2017.
- The government did not try to establish a parliamentary consensus for 2 years. 2 fucking years!!
- The government then tried to force through their own version of Brexit which ironically wasn't Brexity enough for the Brexit ultras in their own party
- The government then expected the opposition to help vote it through when they couldn't get the necessary support from their own ranks
- Although a series of indicative votes didn't provide a clear path forward they should have provided a clue for the government as to which direction to take
- The government ignored what were likely to be the ways ahead that could potentially command a consensus and fell in behind their ultras whose proposals only ever got very little support across the house.

What did you expect MPs who oppose the No Deal Brexit that the government clearly favour to do?

Parliament has done its job. The government has failed monumentally.

 

[pudge]

Simplistic nonsense.

What's your explanation for rabble-rousing then?

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

I'm one of the least politically educated/aligned folk there is, unashamedly so, but it doesn't take otherwise to know that the amount of rabble-rousing and shithousery akin to kids in a school canteen when someone drops a plate is disgraceful from adults; let alone elected officials.

How is that carry on always allowed? Genuinely staggers me.

 

[hgblue]

They need to get the death of "No Deal" over the line, of course, which everybody knows. But also, Johnson having to go asking for an extension weakens him so all the opposition are going to wait until that happens. He and his advisor pitched themselves as the masters at wargaming, but got outgamed.

He isn’t going to request an extension and he isn’t going to break the law and if that has blown your mind I’d suggest you use your self proclaimed superior intellect and work it out for yourself ;)

 

[west didsblue]

What's your explanation for rabble-rousing then?

If you mean the confrontational debates in the House, that's how it's always been.
If you're talking about some on the far right making out they stand for the people against Parliament and the judiciary and using blatant lies to make their case, that's dangerous demagoguery that needs to be robustly exposed for what it is.

 

[Gareth Barry Conlon]

He isn’t going to request an extension and he isn’t going to break the law and if that has blown your mind I’d suggest you use your self proclaimed superior intellect and work it out for yourself ;)

He's going to resign?

 

[pudge]

If you mean the confrontational debates in the House, that's how it's always been.
If you're talking about some on the far right making out they stand for the people against Parliament and the judiciary and using blatant lies to make their case, that's dangerous demagoguery that needs to be robustly exposed for what it is.

I mean the bollocks of shouting and roaring over every second word like a bunch of school kids.

These are adults and elected officials, don't wash over that kind of behaviour with "it's the way it's always been". No matter when it started it's disgraceful behaviour.

Embrassing stuff. Why it's allowed, beats me.

 

[mcfc1632]

If anyone else is interested in me repeating my opinion they only need to ask.
As it appears to be just you, I'm not going to waste my time as you don't appear to have the capacity for a reasoned discussion.

It is OK - it was clear to me by your response you don't even understand the basics of why the prospect of Scotland leaving the UK would reduce if the UK had already left the EU.

You do a lot of posturing and make a load of aggressive and argumentative posts - but rarely is there anything of substance unless you are repeating the words of someone else.

So there you have it - yet again you make snide and argumentative posts, e.g.

I have more of a clue than you. But then so does practically everyone else on the forum.
Your analysis of the Scotland independence issue is absolutely laughable. If it was anyone else I’d explain why but for you I would be wasting my time.

Then run and hide when called out to explain yourself

FFS - if you had some substance, or even a clue, you would want to blast me with it. That you run for cover speaks volumes to the truth.

Anyway, as a good number of us on here know - you are always looking to provoke others to get into arguments with you so then you can play the victim.

So crack on - perhaps someone else will ask you for some substance - such as setting out the key economic and trade factors that suggest that the UK leaving the EU will be bad for the UK and compare them against the impact on Scotland if they were to plan to leave the UK after the UK has already left the EU.

 

[west didsblue]

I mean the bollocks of shouting and roaring over every second word like a bunch of school kids.

These are adults and elected officials, don't wash over that kind of behaviour with "it's the way it's always been". No matter when it started it's disgraceful behaviour.

Embrassing stuff. Why it's allowed, beats me.

I wouldn't call it rabble rousing then.
It's heated debate that sometimes goes too far.

 

[west didsblue]

It is OK - it was clear to me by your response you don't even understand the basics of why the prospect of Scotland leaving the UK would reduce if the UK had already left the EU.

You do a lot of posturing and make a load of aggressive and argumentative posts - but rarely is there anything of substance unless you are repeating the words of someone else.

So there you have it - yet again you make snide and argumentative posts, e.g.

Then run and hide when called out to explain yourself

FFS - if you had some substance, or even a clue, you would want to blast me with it. That you run for cover speaks volumes to the truth.

Anyway, as a good number of us on here know - you are always looking to provoke others to get into arguments with you so then you can play the victim.

So crack on - perhaps someone else will ask you for some substance - such as setting out the key economic and trade factors that suggest that the UK leaving the EU will be bad for the UK and compare them against the impact on Scotland if they were to plan to leave the UK after the UK has already left the EU.

You're just embarrassing yourself now.
No-one cares what you think of me. Least of all me.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

I mean the bollocks of shouting and roaring over every second word like a bunch of school kids.

These are adults and elected officials, don't wash over that kind of behaviour with "it's the way it's always been". No matter when it started it's disgraceful behaviour.

Embrassing stuff. Why it's allowed, beats me.

Watch them as well they look up at the screens to see if they are on tv.

 

[pudge]

I wouldn't call it rabble rousing then.
It's heated debate that sometimes goes too far.

Well, it's not that as that would require intellect and decorum in order for it to be debate.

How can all that "hear, hear" and shouting, roaring nonsensical bollocks that literally aids nothing be "debate"?

It's what you'd expect from children. For it to come from elected officials in such a position of power is ludacrious!

It's one of the most staggering things that has seemingly been accepted as the norm.

Bunch of ballbags. That's not a simplistic generalisation, just a fact.

 

[west didsblue]

Well, it's not that as that would require intellect and decorum in order for it to be debate.

How can all that "hear, hear" and shouting, roaring nonsensical bollocks that literally aids nothing be "debate"?

It's what you'd expect from children. For it to come from elected officials in such a position of power is ludacrious!

It's one of the most staggering things that has seemingly been accepted as the norm.

Bunch of ballbags. That's not a simplistic generalisation, just a fact.

I would say it is a simplistic generalisation but we'll have to agree to differ.