Another new Brexit thread

[Ancient Citizen]

No, i'm saying he's a ****, I know he's a ****, but just because he supported leaving the EU, does not make me a **** who shares his cuntish views on everything.

That's what dave_blue12 was, and has been since, trying to insinuate. "Look at this nasty man and what this nasty man says! You must agree with him on these comments, because he supports brexit, and you support brexit too!"

As if brexit means we must automatically agree on everything he believes and says and it's absolute nonsense.

16.2 million remainers, and not one **** amongst them ;)

 

[Vic]

Yep - it should come as no surprise that the English might just be getting a tad fed up with Brexit

fixed

Questions I'd have put in that ludicrously-contrived comres poll for the Brexitgraph...

Are you fed up with Brexit enough to wish we'd never started on this never-ending palaver?

And they asked one about whether the Queen should get involved but that was like the original leave/remain vote, i.e. woefully imprecise, so better to ask:

In a situation where Parliament votes for something, and a PM who has lost a vote of confidence but is hanging on as PM wants to do something else, should the Queen support our sovereign Parliament or the discredited PM?

 

[aguero93:20]

I'm pretty certain it's cross-party in Congress to support the GFA.

Yeah the Republicans have said the same, one of the few times they've publicly gone against Trump. Neither party can afford to lose their Irish American voters to the other side and both take a lot of pride in the GFA. It's about the only foreign intervention by the US in the last 50 years that hasn't gone badly wrong.

 

[Vic]

Possibly the first time I have disagreed with you on here

I think that he is that self-serving and wedded to the EU coattails he will simply play his role as directed

I think he's willing to take a massive hit now given the prospect of sunlit uplands in fifty years time.

(Now where have I heard that argument?)

 

[MillionMilesAway]

I'm pretty sure there is no one in either UK or US that would wish to see the GFA fail (not sure about DUP nutters tbh), but there are many who (IMHO) seek to politicise it for their own ends which is appalling.

There are, but I don't think it isn't split pro/anti Trump in Congress.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I'm pretty certain it's cross-party in Congress to support the GFA.

I would have thought it would be cross party in the States, UK and Ireland (other than a few loons).

 

[Saddleworth2]

Not really - although I can see what you mean and why others would think that is the case

It is a question of adopting a starting point of where we are now and not where we were in May 2016

The pre-referendum world has gone - the horse has bolted - the genie is out of the bottle - and so on......

It is August 2019 and we are facing an exit from the EU - we cannot simply click our heels and wake up in Kansas

I haven't a single bloody clue what you are talking about. I'm not entirely sure I want to know either.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

I'm pretty sure there is no one in either UK or US that would wish to see the GFA fail (not sure about DUP nutters tbh), but there are many who (IMHO) seek to politicise it for their own ends which is appalling.

Don’t worry when we find a solution to Northern Ireland , something like the one we have already reached where there will be no hard border and checks away from the border but once that is accepted as a workable solution....

Get ready for Gibraltar.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

I would have thought it would be cross party in the States, UK and Ireland (other than a few loons).

Ha, yes you;d hope so.

It was in response to this:
"It seems no one is really asking why poor Ireland is being politicised across the pond - the answer seems to be nothing to do with Ireland, the UK or even Brexit. It's just the pro /anti trump domestic battle playing out in another way."

 

[Vic]

It looks so obviously bluff from a EU perspective, the more so because:
- Johnsonn has publicly presented it as a bluff
- Uk is not preppared for no-deal
- No deal might make the UK the pariah of international agreements, already the US won't accept the UK breaking the GFA

So far the UK has kept extending the process under the hope that somehow it could push the EU to the table towards a more favourable deal. All this is doing so far is extending the economic uncertainty of Brexit withought apparent change with the EU. As if it was mainly a matter of "superior negotiating skills" rather than the technical consequences of certain red lines.

Perhaps the impression is that upon no deal the EU would itself be forced to put up a border in Ireland blowing up it's relation with the republic. It must be said thhough that there are plenty of other options to punish the UK by other means that would have ecionomic consequences.

No-one wants to punish the UK.

But once we're out, and need the unanimous agreement of every member state for a deal (rather than qualified majority now), then Spain may raise Gibraltar, France will not agree to anything that reinforces London's financial clout, carmakers will see no reason to revive the dying UK car industry at the expense of their own, and other nations may have their particular issue. Punishment isn't the problem, it's an inevitable lack of helping the UK given that we've chosen to damage the EU as well as ourselves, and we've poisoned the well of goodwill (just see MB's vitriol toward Verhofstadt for how a mild-mannered man can turn nasty against someone who likes us).

It may be a bit like the Quaker who comes home to find his wife in bed with another man, gets a gun and points it at the man and says "Friend, I mean thee no harm, but thou art standing where I am about to shoot". (A bit like - don't push it!)

 

[Saddleworth2]

Ha, yes you;d hope so.

It was in response to this:
"It seems no one is really asking why poor Ireland is being politicised across the pond - the answer seems to be nothing to do with Ireland, the UK or even Brexit. It's just the pro /anti trump domestic battle playing out in another way."

Ok. USA politics on both sides has always been pretty consistent in its support for the GFA though so is it really a Trump thing?

 

[aguero93:20]

Ok. USA politics on both sides has always been pretty consistent in its support for the GFA though so is it really a Trump thing?

The only link that Trump has to it is that he's badly overplayed his hand on it and caused McConnell to publicly oppose him on the issue.

 

[Ban-jani]

What are you on about? Arron Banks?

I’ve no idea anymore.

Yeah Banks is a ****.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Ok. USA politics on both sides has always been pretty consistent in its support for the GFA though so is it really a Trump thing?

I don't think so, and certainly not domestic pro/anti. It seems to be all of Congress telling Bolton (and therefore presumably Trump) that he's talking rubbish.

 

[bluethrunthru]

But once we're out, and need the unanimous agreement of every member state for a deal (rather than qualified majority now), then Spain may raise Gibraltar, France will not agree to anything that reinforces London's financial clout, carmakers will see no reason to revive the dying UK car industry at the expense of their own, and other nations may have their particular issue. Punishment isn't the problem, it's an inevitable lack of helping the UK given that we've chosen to damage the EU as well as ourselves, and we've poisoned the well of goodwill

And some say that is us taking back control lol !!

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

Abac that is a given, when they aren't lying they are dreaming up new ones, and I do believe they are all heinous people, and i dont support their right to harm the vast majority of the country with their poisonous agenda.
Turning the other cheek has never worked, it's a glib phrase designed to subjugate the public. Very fkin noble and all that but the country is facing a far right bought catastrophe, such sentiments only help brexit

I think your all mad, but I support your right to be mad.

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

So, unsurprisingly Remainers are clinging to this like a literature in a storm, brexiteers likewise Bolton/Trumps comments about expedition of US/UK trade after brexit.
It seems no one is really asking why poor Ireland is being politicised across the pond - the answer seems to be nothing to do with Ireland, the UK or even Brexit. It's just the pro /anti trump domestic battle playing out in another way.

In fairness The US didn't start it.
UK Government are quite willing to use us as bargaining chip. Depending on your point of view, so are the EU.

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

mcfc1632 said: ↑
Possibly the first time I have disagreed with you on here

I think that he is that self-serving and wedded to the EU coattails he will simply play his role as directed

I think he's willing to take a massive hit now given the prospect of sunlit uplands in fifty years time.

(Now where have I heard that argument?)

I think the difference with Varadkar's stance is that you would find he has the support of the vast majority of the country.
Certainly more than 52%

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

In fairness The US didn't start it.
UK Government are quite willing to use us as bargaining chip. Depending on your point of view, so are the EU.

Absolutely.

 

[mcfc1632]

Yes and we have had this debate before. The essential part of the agreement and the tricky bit was not having the same customs arrangement across the border but having and establishing a power sharing government in Northern Ireland so the good people of Northern Ireland could govern itself .

But you all fell out and you are ruled directly from England again . We don’t want that we want you to govern in stormont. You keep falling out .

And by the way I have not seen a single post by any leaver which says fuck the GFA , sod it. We want peace respected and the gfa agreement to be upheld. We don’t want a border and we want peace.

However at the moment the only political voice is the shouty DUP. I would love it if stormont could be reestablished and Northern Ireland had a proper political voice of its own. At the moment it is being used as a political football between the eu and the uk and Northern Ireland deserves better.

So fucking well said

There is, IMO, so much shallow shite posted on these threads because the EU have weaponised the border issue, that it is difficult to take some posters seriously