Back On The Chain Gang

[west didsblue]

The only thing about that press conference worth watching was the spectacle of a fat twat with a fat head trying to keep himself dry in the pissing rain with a microscopic umbrella borrowed from an aide. Everything he said was the usual out of context bloviations of a populist not worth the hot air used to generate it. Enough in there to throw some red meat to the gammon but fuck all else.

 

[Rascal]

Don’t really understand your question mate to be totally honest but the benefits that as a hard working tax payer contribute to every week,
In which some think they have a right to receive whilst behaving like a complete twat.

Do you mean welfare?

Because nobody benefits from being on welfare and welfare recipients are also tax payers. Under a universal welfare system such as we enjoy in the UK it ensures that everyone has a chance to fare well when times are hard, even the twats as you call them have a chance not to live in penury.

My 87 year old mum lives on welfare, it is called a pension, she has a right to receive that pension because we have a universal welfare system that ensures the likes of my 87 year old mum can put the heating on when its cold, buy some corned beef when she is hungry, that is not a benefit, it is what she deserves because of our universal welfare system.

The constant attacks on the welfare system and referring to payments as "benefits" undermines the principals behind the system and if it continues to be undermined when you are hopefully the ripe old age of 87 you might not be able to put on the heating, buy some corned beef and have a little bit of dignity. Even if you are a total twat I would still want you to be able to turn your heating on, even if you were a total ****, I would not begrudge you a corned beef butty, because I have paid into the system and it is your right as it is mine to expect to be looked after to a certain extent when times are hard.

 

[Ifwecouldjust.......]

Hit them in the pocket if their working put an attachment of earnings in their wage.
if their on benefits then stop the payments.
Other than that build a 600 cell breeze block prison with a concrete bed and one blanket
One very basic meal a day .
This may seem very harsh but in-light of what’s gone on in the last few days maybe not . It’d save the tax payer a lot of money of what could be directed into more needy people than pissing about with a scrote in the judicial system.
The country needs a very big wake up call and a quick one at that.

Don’t really understand your question mate to be totally honest but the benefits that as a hard working tax payer contribute to every week,
In which some think they have a right to receive whilst behaving like a complete twat.

Just a reminder that the majority of the UK workforce are on some form of welfare payments .... funded by the taxpayer so that we can provide a low paid labour force to the employers / business owners that don't actually pay any tax.



So being on welfare (benefits as you call it) is actually much more common than you seem to believe. And on top of that the majority of the people on welfare are in full time work.

 

[A57 the snake]

Do you mean welfare?

Because nobody benefits from being on welfare and welfare recipients are also tax payers. Under a universal welfare system such as we enjoy in the UK it ensures that everyone has a chance to fare well when times are hard, even the twats as you call them have a chance not to live in penury.

My 87 year old mum lives on welfare, it is called a pension, she has a right to receive that pension because we have a universal welfare system that ensures the likes of my 87 year old mum can put the heating on when its cold, buy some corned beef when she is hungry, that is not a benefit, it is what she deserves because of our universal welfare system.

The constant attacks on the welfare system and referring to payments as "benefits" undermines the principals behind the system and if it continues to be undermined when you are hopefully the ripe old age of 87 you might not be able to put on the heating, buy some corned beef and have a little bit of dignity. Even if you are a total twat I would still want you to be able to turn your heating on, even if you were a total ****, I would not begrudge you a corned beef butty, because I have paid into the system and it is your right as it is mine to expect to be looked after to a certain extent when times are hard.

A very well written post that it wasn’t a attack on everyone who receives welfare far from it .
If you can read my original post it was aimed at those whose behaviour is damaging society. If they chose to behave in the manor they do then why not punish them in taking something from them. And giving more to those who genuinely need it.
I’m a GMB branch secretary so I know all about the welfare and and such like and run regular food bank drives for those who are less fortunate amongst other things.
I’ll try and keep this on topic but the amount of members who are increasingly coming under attack ie paramedics and shop workers from thugs has got to stop. Probably that’s why I feel passionate about the way I see some in society whose behaviour has got to be stopped.

 

[Rascal]

A very well written post that it wasn’t a attack on everyone who receives welfare far from it .
If you can read my original post it was aimed at those whose behaviour is damaging society. If they chose to behave in the manor they do then why not punish them in taking something from them. And giving more to those who genuinely need it.
I’m a GMB branch secretary so I know all about the welfare and and such like and run regular food bank drives for those who are less fortunate amongst other things.
I’ll try and keep this on topic but the amount of members who are increasingly coming under attack ie paramedics and shop workers from thugs has got to stop. Probably that’s why I feel passionate about the way I see some in society whose behaviour has got to be stopped.

Fair enough and chapeau for your efforts with the food banks, a sad indictment on society if there ever was one.

Punishment is a difficult concept, you may feel you are punishing an individual by removing his welfare, but does that not then run the risk of even more criminal behaviour because a man has to eat or has a family to provide for. If that happens it makes your food bank efforts even more necessary.

I am absolutely on your side about attacks on workers, it is despicable behaviour , what the answer is to it, I am uncertain, we live in a liberal society and whilst I would not be averse to it becoming more authoritarian where criminal behaviour is concerned, where is the tipping point. Attacks on workers going about there daily business is abhorrent and it is an attack on us all by proxy and I would be quite happy to see those responsible given the harshest of prison sentences, but I am not sure removing welfare is the answer.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Just a reminder that the majority of the UK workforce are on some form of welfare payments .... funded by the taxpayer so that we can provide a low paid labour force to the employers / business owners that don't actually pay any tax.

View attachment 22095

So being on welfare (benefits as you call it) is actually much more common than you seem to believe. And on top of that the majority of the people on welfare are in full time work.

Yep, Tax credits plus housing benefit are like a sort of stealth universal basic income, but geared to the benefit of corporates and private landlords. Keeps wages low and rents high.

 

[A57 the snake]

Fair enough and chapeau for your efforts with the food banks, a sad indictment on society if there ever was one.

Punishment is a difficult concept, you may feel you are punishing an individual by removing his welfare, but does that not then run the risk of even more criminal behaviour because a man has to eat or has a family to provide for. If that happens it makes your food bank efforts even more necessary.

I am absolutely on your side about attacks on workers, it is despicable behaviour , what the answer is to it, I am uncertain, we live in a liberal society and whilst I would not be averse to it becoming more authoritarian where criminal behaviour is concerned, where is the tipping point. Attacks on workers going about there daily business is abhorrent and it is an attack on us all by proxy and I would be quite happy to see those responsible given the harshest of prison sentences, but I am not sure removing welfare is the answer.

Fair do’s mate I’ll try and take my own emotions out in the future. I think we agree on most parts but like you I don’t know what the answer is .
7:30am this morning I’m picking the wife up from work ( this is honestly what happened this morning) so at the road side there’s 40-50 gas canisters of hippy crack or whatever it’s called and less than 20 yards away GMP’s finest are doing a raid on someone’s house .
Madness what a way to start your day.

 

[andthesunshineband]

Put the twats in pink jump suits with I love cleaning on the back in glitter.

Latest rag home shirt, or would that be going too far?

 

[Rascal]

Fair do’s mate I’ll try and take my own emotions out in the future. I think we agree on most parts but like you I don’t know what the answer is .
7:30am this morning I’m picking the wife up from work ( this is honestly what happened this morning) so at the road side there’s 40-50 gas canisters of hippy crack or whatever it’s called and less than 20 yards away GMP’s finest are doing a raid on someone’s house .
Madness what a way to start your day.

It is sad, I think we both know our society is crumbling at the edges, austerity caused so many problems on top of the destruction of the manufacturing base during the Thatcher years and there is a growing underclass of people who feel as hopeless as I did in 1983 when jobs were rare and unemployment was rife. I am not condoning anybodies behaviour but to feel so hopeless you live your life on happy crack must be a dreadful existence especially considering we are the 6th richest country on the planet. But rising inequality will only exacerbate it and as we are one of the most unequal countries on the planet it is not likely to improve. Check out the work of Professor Danny Dorling on inequality and it is astounding the correlations between inequality, education attainment, obesity, poverty and lots of other factors.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

Yep, Tax credits plus housing benefit are like a sort of stealth universal basic income, but geared to the benefit of corporates and private landlords. Keeps wages low and rents high.

Why do governments set the minimum wage level so low to appease industry at the detriment of the tax payer. Where does it benefit a government who then have to pay out welfare to top up these insulting salaries into some as-semblance of a living wage. Set the bar higher then we would not have to offer our work force financial support. If a company cannot afford to pay an honest wage for an honest days work then quite simply that company should not be trading in the first place. A contentious issue for sure.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Why do governments set the minimum wage level so low to appease industry at the detriment of the tax payer. Where does it benefit a government who then have to pay out welfare to top up these insulting salaries into some as-semblance of a living wage. Set the bar higher then we would not have to offer our work force financial support. If a company cannot afford to pay an honest wage for an honest days work then quite simply that company should not be trading in the first place. A contentious issue for sure.

I imagine somebody somewhere gets a tax-break of some sort as well as cheap labour, while it also massages the unemployment figures.

 

[Rascal]

Why do governments set the minimum wage level so low to appease industry at the detriment of the tax payer. Where does it benefit a government who then have to pay out welfare to top up these insulting salaries into some as-semblance of a living wage. Set the bar higher then we would not have to offer our work force financial support. If a company cannot afford to pay an honest wage for an honest days work then quite simply that company should not be trading in the first place. A contentious issue for sure.

Be careful, you are close to saying you want the total collapse of the Capitalist system.

Marx and his work on surplus value explains it all, but remember being a Marxist is naughty, it makes you an insurgent, a commie, a red under the bed, a nasty lefty etc etc.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

Be careful, you are close to saying you want the total collapse of the Capitalist system.

Marx and his work on surplus value explains it all, but remember being a Marxist is naughty, it makes you an insurgent, a commie, a red under the bed, a nasty lefty etc etc.

Is that what it would do, bring total collapse of the capitalist system simply by paying a living wage. It smacks in the face of common decency by underpaying a workforce in order to massage the books. Again I have no idea why governments insist on adopting this mantra as the cost to the taxpayer via top up benefits must be immense. If you pay a work force a living wage then you would naturally increase output and quality of workmanship as opposed to lethargy apathy and the dreadfully piss poor service we see before us today.

I don't think the commie Red Under The Bed Brigade or the Marxist Movements have anything to offer otherwise they would have acheived the heady height's of office already. I think it's just reactionary politics from a minority and although it sounds really good to go it just never seems to catch on.

I am not heavily into politics or even profess to have an understanding of the genre at your level so instead I adopt the Mazzerelli Swiss Cheese Mantra by voting for any party that appeals to my own sense of ideal come election time.

Wasn't that young urban guerilla "Wolfie" Smith, from Tooting a Marxist who constantly spent every episode emulating his hero Che Guevara.

 

[A57 the snake]

Why do governments set the minimum wage level so low to appease industry at the detriment of the tax payer. Where does it benefit a government who then have to pay out welfare to top up these insulting salaries into some as-semblance of a living wage. Set the bar higher then we would not have to offer our work force financial support. If a company cannot afford to pay an honest wage for an honest days work then quite simply that company should not be trading in the first place. A contentious issue for sure.

Bang on ...

 

[Saddleworth2]

I think they create anti- social havoc because they know full well that there's no deterrent to deter.
Incarceration's the only answer and the time for honoring themselves must surely be at an end. Lock em down and free society of these feral miscreants that plague our streets.

If you build the prisons They Will Come!

We could start with the criminals in Whitehall. The ones that hand out contracts to their mates, or lie to the public on a daily basis. One of them is well practiced in hi viz orange.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

We could start with the criminals in Whitehall. The ones that hand out contracts to their mates, or lie to the public on a daily basis. One of them is well practiced in hi viz orange.

If indictable offenses then yes by all means prosecute them to the full extent of the law.

 

[stonerblue]

More fucking coppers on the streets. Not rocket science.

 

[Saddleworth2]

If indictable offenses then yes by all means prosecute them to the full extent of the law.

But who makes the law? Who is responsible for enforcing it and who seeks to influence the judiciary?
Westminster is rotten to the core mate.
When last did we have a Police federation that has stated unequivocally that they have no confidence in the Home Secretary?
'Old ideas wrapped as new initiatives to hide systemic underfunding and undermining of the entire judiciary system'
They get away with it because police can't and won't strike.

 

[Marklr]

And its by adopting policies exactly the opposite of this (other than the educating them bit which will never happen whilst the prisons are being run by G4S and Serco) that has allowed the Norwegian Government to close prisons.

How Norway turns criminals into good neighbours

Twenty years ago, Norway started focusing on rehabilitating prisoners, and sharply cut reoffending rates.

www.bbc.co.uk

but well done for falling for the latest piece of red meat thrown to you by the Tories.

Fuck all to do with the tories or whatever they've said recently...that's been my opinion for a long time. And you can't compare Norway to the UK.

 

[Mr Kobayashi]

Fuck all to do with the tories or whatever they've said recently...that's been my opinion for a long time. And you can't compare Norway to the UK.

Why not?