Champs League Draw

[cibaman]

Whilst the 'draw' is clearly fixed because of the myriad of provisions and restrictions in place about who can play who and when, I can't convince my self that it's 'bent'. Could you begin to imagine the fall out if it was ever proved that UEFA had engineered the draw other than by use of a series of convoluted, but accepted rules. There would be so many in line to sue them it wouldn't even be worth joining the queue and UEFA would simply end up being disbanded. The only question I would ask, is why 4 different people picked the balls for the teams and the same guy drew all the balls for the groups.
If there are going to be changes in the way teams are seeded then, once again, Platini has admitted that like FFP, he can only act with the blessing of the 'big' clubs. So I don't hold out much hope for any favourable changes towards City. Bayern may well have something to say about the current system as they seem to be the elite team that consistently gets handed the toughest group.

I suppose if they were trying to fix it, then the way to do it would be to somehow hold back the Group E ball until the Roma ball came out. But there wouldn't have been much point doing that if we'd already drawn Porto and Olympiacos so for the fix to work they would have to rig all of the pots. Given that all of the clubs had representatives there to watch the draw and that the big clubs will all have contacts within UEFA it would be crazy for UEFA to even think of doing that.

The big clubs may want City to be perpetually in a Group of Death, but just as long as they're not in it with them. The only clubs that really have an interest in seeing the draw fixed are the English clubs and their influence in UEFA doesn't stretch to forcing Platini to risk the wrath of the likes of Bayern or Real Madrid just to make sure that City play Roma.

 

[Citizen in Pakistan]

We need to make our balls bigger so that next time its to big to be drawn with the Munich one,Im happy with league title,fuk this so called champions league ,what kind of world tournament have the same teams drawn against each other every year

 

[Maldeika]

Whilst the 'draw' is clearly fixed because of the myriad of provisions and restrictions in place about who can play who and when, I can't convince my self that it's 'bent'. Could you begin to imagine the fall out if it was ever proved that UEFA had engineered the draw other than by use of a series of convoluted, but accepted rules. There would be so many in line to sue them it wouldn't even be worth joining the queue and UEFA would simply end up being disbanded. The only question I would ask, is why 4 different people picked the balls for the teams and the same guy drew all the balls for the groups.
If there are going to be changes in the way teams are seeded then, once again, Platini has admitted that like FFP, he can only act with the blessing of the 'big' clubs. So I don't hold out much hope for any favourable changes towards City. Bayern may well have something to say about the current system as they seem to be the elite team that consistently gets handed the toughest group.

I suppose if they were trying to fix it, then the way to do it would be to somehow hold back the Group E ball until the Roma ball came out. But there wouldn't have been much point doing that if we'd already drawn Porto and Olympiacos so for the fix to work they would have to rig all of the pots. Given that all of the clubs had representatives there to watch the draw and that the big clubs will all have contacts within UEFA it would be crazy for UEFA to even think of doing that.

The big clubs may want City to be perpetually in a Group of Death, but just as long as they're not in it with them. The only clubs that really have an interest in seeing the draw fixed are the English clubs and their influence in UEFA doesn't stretch to forcing Platini to risk the wrath of the likes of Bayern or Real Madrid just to make sure that City play Roma.

The big teams do not really care what opponents they get in the group stage. With Bayern it was often better to get the big teams then teams like Lille, BATE, Moskow etc. Terrible pitches where the risk for injuries is big, bad weather, teams that are difficult to play against, a lot fouls and parked busses...

The biggest problems in the recent years to get out of group stage was in the treble year against teams like BATE, Lille and Valencia. And that was the "easiest" draw of the last 5 years.

If you want to win the CL you just have to beat everybody.

The setting for sure is more important to the teams in the second category that hope to get out of the group.

 

[Maldeika]

I note that UEFA are looking at changing the draw rules...
I guess that Bayern, Barcelona and Real Madrid have had enough of getting a tough group with us in it and have broken ranks with the English Old G14 members...
;-)

Getting Bayern three times out of four may have had a large hand in this. They're definitely one of the more vocal cartel members and Hoeness, Ruminegge etc always have their sticky fingers somewhere.

Hunting ghosts again. Bayern does not care. I did not know that any of them was a big friend of Mr. Platini... - I have heard them critisizing in that direction often enough. Do not mix UEFA (the European football association with Platini as head) and ECA (the organization of the European big clubs that is headed by Rummenigge - ManCity is a member of it, too)

Platini's son is working for PSG and was Platini was playing for Juventus for years - 2 teams that would profit of a new rule... (and not just this year as this two teams have less success in Europe but are booked to win the Championship again - much more than e.g. ManCity in England where there is more competition)

 

[taconinja]

You're going to have a tough sell trying to paint Bayern Munich as a noble, innocent victim always righteously looking out for everyone and persevering stoically in the face of all challenges.

 

[doomgob]

Shouldn't be any seeding at all

 

[adrianr]

I note that UEFA are looking at changing the draw rules...
I guess that Bayern, Barcelona and Real Madrid have had enough of getting a tough group with us in it and have broken ranks with the English Old G14 members...
;-)

Getting Bayern three times out of four may have had a large hand in this. They're definitely one of the more vocal cartel members and Hoeness, Ruminegge etc always have their sticky fingers somewhere.

Hunting ghosts again. Bayern does not care. I did not know that any of them was a big friend of Mr. Platini... - I have heard them critisizing in that direction often enough. Do not mix UEFA (the European football association with Platini as head) and ECA (the organization of the European big clubs that is headed by Rummenigge - ManCity is a member of it, too)

Platini's son is working for PSG and was Platini was playing for Juventus for years - 2 teams that would profit of a new rule... (and not just this year as this two teams have less success in Europe but are booked to win the Championship again - much more than e.g. ManCity in England where there is more competition)

Lol, it's a big proposed change to the very top of European football, of course Bayern care.

 

[kun]

Shouldn't be any seeding at all

Dear god no.

No seeding = City, Bayern, Barca, Real

 

[BlueNomad]

Seeding should be based on position in home league last season AND your country's performance in the CL. So, that would mean that the top leagues would get their champs and maybe 2nd place teams in Pot 1, with Pots 2 & 3 filled by the runners up and third place (and in some cases 4th place) teams of the top leagues, with the minnows and qualifiers being in Pot 4. It is amazing that The Arse have to qualify every year due to League position, but get into Pot 1 every year due to CL coefficient!?!

This would (roughly) mean that Champs of England, Spain, Germany, Italy plus some second place teams in those countries, plus Champs from top two UEFA coefficient other leagues would be Pot 1, then Pot 2 would be 3rd place from top UEFA coefficient leagues and smaller country Champions (France, Portugal, etc..), and so on.

It is beyond ridiculous that City are CHAMPIONS of England, yet rated lower than the teams they beat to win the League. The COEFFICIENT should enable your LEAGUE greater opportunities, and your own club's POSITION WITHIN YOUR LEAGUE should be rewarded with a Pot 1/2 position. As Champions of a high coefficient league, we should AUTOMATICALLY go into Pot 1.......otherwise it becomes the "past Champions legacy competition!"

 

[bayern blade]

You're going to have a tough sell trying to paint Bayern Munich as a noble, innocent victim always righteously looking out for everyone and persevering stoically in the face of all challenges.

I doubt that any of us care, but for what it's worth we are as fed up as you lot are with getting the same clubs year after year, if we if qualify you just know it will be f##king Arsenal in the next round again.

 

[Matty]

http://www.thedaisycutter.co.uk/2014/08/eufa-coefficients-a-vicious-circle-that-needs-to-be-broken/

 

[jrb]

Just in case anyone has missed this news? A few days old now.

UEFA is close to changing the seeding system for the group stages of the Champions League, Sky Sports News’ Chief News Reporter Bryan Swanson can reveal.

UEFA has confirmed that, under new proposals, the top eight seeds would comprise of the defending Champions League winners, along with the seven domestic league winners of the top-ranked UEFA nations.

Initial talks over the seeding system took place earlier this year, and the plans were approved by the club competitions committee in May.

UEFA president Michel Platini, and other top officials, hope the new rules will prevent defending league champions seeded lower than other teams from their country.

UEFA plan to change the seeding process for the Champions League from next season onwards

Chelsea and Arsenal were both in pot one in this month's draw and seeded higher than Premier League holders Manchester City.

The new rules would prevent top-ranked domestic champions from being drawn in the same group.

Had the rules been introduced this season, it would have meant Manchester City were placed in pot one.

The plan needs approval from the UEFA Executive Committee before it can be introduced but it is hoped it would take effect from next season.

UEFA's next Executive Committee meeting takes place on September 18 in Nyon.

UEFA has also confirmed to Sky Sports News HQ that it has received no complaints from any club involved in the Champions League this season following Thursday's draw in Monaco.

Video via the link. http://www1.skysports.com/football/...ans-change-to-champions-league-seeding-system

I wonder who's on UEFA Executive Committee? He used to be the CEO of....... And he's still a board member to this day. ;-)

UEFA Executive Committee

The UEFA Executive Committee is UEFA's supreme executive body. It comprises the UEFA President and 15 other members elected by a UEFA Congress. Moreover, upon proposal of the Women's Football Committee, the UEFA Executive Committee appoints a woman as an additional member with the same rights and duties as the other UEFA Executive Committee members.

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http://www.uefa.org/about-uefa/executive-committee/index.html

 

[aguero93:20]

You're going to have a tough sell trying to paint Bayern Munich as a noble, innocent victim always righteously looking out for everyone and persevering stoically in the face of all challenges.

I doubt that any of us care, but for what it's worth we are as fed up as you lot are with getting the same clubs year after year, if we if qualify you just know it will be f##king Arsenal in the next round again.

What's to complain about there? Easy tie.

 

[Sir peace frog]

If you haven’t spotted this, television companies in countries with four competing teams (England, Germany, Spain) or two (France, Italy, Russia) want their matches split equally over Tuesday and Wednesday. So it quickly became apparent last week that once Juventus had been drawn from pot 2 and placed in Group A, Roma, the only other Italian team in it, had to go in the lower half of the draw and face teams in Groups E to H. The presence of Paris Saint-Germain in Group F meant Monaco had to go in Groups A to D. this passed unnoticed.

By the time we have factored in that teams from the same country cannot play each other – again to give the TV companies value – it is possible to start calling the draw at the midway stage. Once Juventus were out it was 50-50 that Roma would play one of Manchester City or Chelsea. They couldn’t face Liverpool or Arsenal.

 

[shemnel]

If you haven’t spotted this, television companies in countries with four competing teams (England, Germany, Spain) or two (France, Italy, Russia) want their matches split equally over Tuesday and Wednesday. So it quickly became apparent last week that once Juventus had been drawn from pot 2 and placed in Group A, Roma, the only other Italian team in it, had to go in the lower half of the draw and face teams in Groups E to H. The presence of Paris Saint-Germain in Group F meant Monaco had to go in Groups A to D. this passed unnoticed.

By the time we have factored in that teams from the same country cannot play each other – again to give the TV companies value – it is possible to start calling the draw at the midway stage. Once Juventus were out it was 50-50 that Roma would play one of Manchester City or Chelsea. They couldn’t face Liverpool or Arsenal.

yeah this was talked about in the time after the draw, just shows quite nicely the power of TV over football competitions (not that we didn't know but a nice example)

 

[Sir peace frog]

If you haven’t spotted this, television companies in countries with four competing teams (England, Germany, Spain) or two (France, Italy, Russia) want their matches split equally over Tuesday and Wednesday. So it quickly became apparent last week that once Juventus had been drawn from pot 2 and placed in Group A, Roma, the only other Italian team in it, had to go in the lower half of the draw and face teams in Groups E to H. The presence of Paris Saint-Germain in Group F meant Monaco had to go in Groups A to D. this passed unnoticed.

By the time we have factored in that teams from the same country cannot play each other – again to give the TV companies value – it is possible to start calling the draw at the midway stage. Once Juventus were out it was 50-50 that Roma would play one of Manchester City or Chelsea. They couldn’t face Liverpool or Arsenal.

yeah this was talked about in the time after the draw, just shows quite nicely the power of TV over football competitions (not that we didn't know but a nice example)

its from a martin Samuel reply thing he has in the mail,talks sense that bloke

 

[shemnel]

If you haven’t spotted this, television companies in countries with four competing teams (England, Germany, Spain) or two (France, Italy, Russia) want their matches split equally over Tuesday and Wednesday. So it quickly became apparent last week that once Juventus had been drawn from pot 2 and placed in Group A, Roma, the only other Italian team in it, had to go in the lower half of the draw and face teams in Groups E to H. The presence of Paris Saint-Germain in Group F meant Monaco had to go in Groups A to D. this passed unnoticed.

By the time we have factored in that teams from the same country cannot play each other – again to give the TV companies value – it is possible to start calling the draw at the midway stage. Once Juventus were out it was 50-50 that Roma would play one of Manchester City or Chelsea. They couldn’t face Liverpool or Arsenal.

yeah this was talked about in the time after the draw, just shows quite nicely the power of TV over football competitions (not that we didn't know but a nice example)

its from a martin Samuel reply thing he has in the mail,talks sense that bloke

It was when they drew City out 3rd from pot 2 and they "had to go into Group E" with Bayern which got a lot of heads scratching but UEFA were deafening in their silence about the whole thing. Incredible really.

 

[taconinja]

You're going to have a tough sell trying to paint Bayern Munich as a noble, innocent victim always righteously looking out for everyone and persevering stoically in the face of all challenges.

I doubt that any of us care, but for what it's worth we are as fed up as you lot are with getting the same clubs year after year, if we if qualify you just know it will be f##king Arsenal in the next round again.

No, I agree with you. It's the other poster stating the opposite with whom I disagree. :)

 

[lancs blue]

Not sure if it's been mentioned elsewhere but it looks as if all the CL squads are up on the UEFA site except..............ours and PSGs.

 

[Bottomless_Sailor]

Not sure if it's been mentioned elsewhere but it looks as if all the CL squads are up on the UEFA site except..............ours and PSGs.

And Zenit.

Galatasaray's is up though.