City & FFP | 2020/21 Accounts released | Revenues of £569.8m, £2.4m profit (p 2395)

[whitenoise]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I’m confused (not unusual believe me) by a point that doesn’t seem to have been mentioned in the media (or on here unless I’ve missed it, this has been a very fast moving thread at times).

If City get fined, say it is £50 million, it’s all very well that it doesn’t hit the books for the purposes of FFP, but who pays it eventually? We assume our owner will take the initial hit, but eventually surely he’s going to expect to recoup that?

It’s the fans, every time – a football club is a business, fans are the customers - any costs will have to be recouped from the fans eventually.

How detached from reality are UEFA really? With no fans, they don’t exist.

 

[rugbyblue]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

How detached from reality are UEFA really? With no fans, they don’t exist.

7.8 custard & pickled onion muffins from reality

 

[Balti]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

It's all very well us all banging the war drum and saying "take them to court" but it's much more complicated than that. Most legal situations are posturing on both sides and playing brinksmanship until a settlement is reached. I would imagine that's the way this will go. As to who gets the best deal out of any compromise, well that depends on which side is most confident of victory should a judge have to rule. You can spend a hundred billion on lawyers and your opponent spent £25 but it doesn't guarantee victory. And a defeat in a court would be disastrous for the sheikh.

Having said that, this weird "offer/acceptance" of sanctions thing is obviously legally significant. In reality this is already a legal battle between our solicitors and theirs, who will both be pulling every string for both sides.

I'm not knowledgeable about EU law. In American law, if you accept a punishment it sets a precedent and becomes very hard to challenge later.

If we accept a settlement, what is to stop them from sanctioning us even worse next season? We will not only have admitted guilt but also admitted that FFP is something we accept on principle.

If, and that's a big "if", these leaks are correct, this is all-out war. They mean to drive away players with a limited CL squad by reducing our foreign players to 13 spots, they intend to disqualify our revenue, AND they intend to make it harder by depriving us of CL revenue. The latter two make compliance next year damned-near impossible, and it opens us up to this process again.

Out of curiosity, what about all this suggests UEFA want a compromise? They say they want us to break even, and yet they enforce the fine against our CL revenue, which is a clear intention of causing non-compliance so that they can hit us harder next season. They could just as easily ask for a fine that doesn't affect breakeven compliance, which I'm sure left our executives shocked (and hence this delay).

If these are the sanctions we're looking at, this is an existential threat to the club. It shocks me that people think David Gill is putting on a show to look tough. He wants us dead. If this were really a dog and pony show, why the delay from both City and PSG? It seems most likely that we both got hit with sanctions that went far beyond expectation, and now we're reeling. That's my read on it. This would have been settled last week if FFP wasn't a serious threat.

I dunno, just some thoughts. Does anyone know enough about European law to answer my question about precedent-setting?

this is an existential threat to the club

That's some seriously worrying perspective right there.

I've radically altered my view on this over the last 24 hours. If these cunts want to step then let them fucking try it. I hope we take them to court and fucking smash every bone in their skulls. The bitter, arrogant, nasty little fucks.

If we accept it then the precedent is set for them to screw us over and over again

Fuck the corrupt debt loving cartel bastards and their petty little scheme to restrict competition which is illegal under EU Law

Take it legal City

 

[Petetheblu]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Fifty million would give Plattini plenty of cash to fight us in the future if we were to question anything else. We have to box clever, no knee jerk reactions.


Only good thing to come from this unfair judgement is it will bring solidarity to the club and the league will be smashed on Sunday.

 

[Stoned Rose]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Far to many pages to read so can I just get 3 things straight please-

1. Is the reported 50m fine in pounds or in euros?

2. Can the owner pay this out of his own personal wealth or does it have to come 'out of' the club's money?

3. Is the reported CL squad restriction 18 or 21 players? (I've heard both in radio reports today)

Thanks :)

1. Depends on the exchange rate.

2. The club does not have any money.

3. 18 year olds.

 

[80s Shorts]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Is Agbonglahor still out ?

 

[jonmcity]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Is it possible to have an injunction stopping any sanctions until the legal case is dealt with. This cartel needs dealing with in my opinion, but its not my money. Its against any rational concept of fair play, the opposite in fact.

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

Is Agbonglahor still out ?

Hopefully not.

 

[SkyBlueCanuck]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

this is an existential threat to the club

That's some seriously worrying perspective right there.

I've radically altered my view on this over the last 24 hours. If these cunts want to step then let them fucking try it. I hope we take them to court and fucking smash every bone in their skulls. The bitter, arrogant, nasty little fucks.

fuck yeah!

Pride in Battle does not allow for laying down for bullshit like Platini's cartel.

 

[Blue Haze]

Re: City & FFP (continued)

I'm not knowledgeable about EU law. In American law, if you accept a punishment it sets a precedent and becomes very hard to challenge later.

If we accept a settlement, what is to stop them from sanctioning us even worse next season? We will not only have admitted guilt but also admitted that FFP is something we accept on principle.

If, and that's a big "if", these leaks are correct, this is all-out war. They mean to drive away players with a limited CL squad by reducing our foreign players to 13 spots, they intend to disqualify our revenue, AND they intend to make it harder by depriving us of CL revenue. The latter two make compliance next year damned-near impossible, and it opens us up to this process again.

Out of curiosity, what about all this suggests UEFA want a compromise? They say they want us to break even, and yet they enforce the fine against our CL revenue, which is a clear intention of causing non-compliance so that they can hit us harder next season. They could just as easily ask for a fine that doesn't affect breakeven compliance, which I'm sure left our executives shocked (and hence this delay).

If these are the sanctions we're looking at, this is an existential threat to the club. It shocks me that people think David Gill is putting on a show to look tough. He wants us dead. If this were really a dog and pony show, why the delay from both City and PSG? It seems most likely that we both got hit with sanctions that went far beyond expectation, and now we're reeling. That's my read on it. This would have been settled last week if FFP wasn't a serious threat.

I dunno, just some thoughts. Does anyone know enough about European law to answer my question about precedent-setting?

this is an existential threat to the club

That's some seriously worrying perspective right there.

I've radically altered my view on this over the last 24 hours. If these cunts want to step then let them fucking try it. I hope we take them to court and fucking smash every bone in their skulls. The bitter, arrogant, nasty little fucks.

Same here.

I think they gave us a delay to "think about it" because what they really want is our signature. They want us to accept it so that when they do it again next season, we won't have a leg to stand on. Over and over until our CL revenue is gone and compliance becomes problematic.

And then the whammy, our league which recently passed its own FFP "based on UEFA FFP". Wow. Now it's TV income and league registrations.

Not an expert here but it does worry me that this is conceivable. Once we agree to this shit, what's to stop the league from doing the same thing with the EPL FFP?

The entire concept of compromise is premised on your opponent believing you have a right to exist. They don't. The big clubs don't want deals that just delay our inevitable dominance, they want us gone. What makes anyone believe that Platini, Gill, and all the other agents of the G14 want a real compromise?


Aaah, never mind. This is worst-case scenario. I just don't understand the assumption that we are negotiating on good faith. The only thing that will make UEFA back down is the threat that their FFP will be thrown out, or lose money in litigation. That's it. Short of that, they'll do anything to see the end of us.