Coronavirus (2021) thread

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Blue Maverick said:
How many are dying of other stuff now though, cancer, suicides etc, if you stopped testing how many would are there actually in hospital with Covid and dying? Anymore than flu in winter ? I’m sorry but Covid will be around forever like flu, we are vaccinating and the vulnerable are all done, we were promised once they were protected we could get on with life, it’s now time to do that. Will people die of Covid in the future, probably but just like other diseases unfortunately that’s a fact of life, enough is enough now.
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except it’s not - one more month makes perfect sense
 
Blue Maverick said:
How many are dying of other stuff now though, suicides etc,
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Suicide rates haven't gone up since the pandemic began. I think its weird that so many people bring up suicides when there's absolutely nothing to back it up with, and it certainly isn't contagious that makes just going out dangerous to a certain extent in the manner a highly infectious disease does.

Blue Maverick said:
if you stopped testing how many would are there actually in hospital with Covid and dying? Anymore than flu in winter ? I’m sorry but Covid will be around forever like flu, we are vaccinating and the vulnerable are all done, we were promised once they were protected we could get on with life, it’s now time to do that. Will people die of Covid in the future, probably but just like other diseases unfortunately that’s a fact of life, enough is enough now.
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Enough isnt enough just because loads of people want to stamp their feet and say it is. If we say 'enough is enough' and open everything up and run the country in a pre covid manner it simply can't work. Hospitals fill up to the brim and then what do we do? Genuine question? We've said enough is enough, now we don't have any hospital beds for sick people, Covid or otherwise, so what's the next plan?
 
ayrshire_blue said:
So what's the alternative? Turn people away who are struggling to breathe because we can't be fucked with it any more?
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With these fuckers in charge it doesn’t really matter. We’ve known for months that younger patients react fantastically well to treatments for COVID (oxygen, dexamethasone etc) so we could have some temporary facilities in that can do a quick bit of oxygen and some drugs that gets patients in and out quickly. You might call them Nightingales? Or we could spaff a small countries GDP on a useless test and trace system, more ’tests’ per million people than almost every other country and continually flip flop between managing COVID and thinking we can eliminate it.

When you hear Hancock saying they didn’t pay people to isolate (THE single biggest thing that would have made a difference throughout this prolonged pandemic) because “they didn’t want people ‘gaming’ the system” it tells you all you need to know. His sister, him, Gove‘s mates and many Tory MP’s and their cronies making millions from this and they were worried about some scally claiming £500 when he didn’t have COVID just about sums them up. Meanwhile, the comfortably off middle class getting 80% of their monthly money for being on holiday for 18 months. (It’s no surprise some don’t want it to end).
Hospitals are currently 97% full but bed numbers are down by a quarter, due to COVID restrictions, we have a workforce that’s shagged out, asked to do more and more (treat COVID, get the waiting lists down, vaccinate everybody, treat COVID, get the waiting lists down, vaccinate everybody faster, do more, do more, do it faster) and there’s still not the first sign of a plan from the useless wankers.

We also know that the fitter you are, the less effects youll usually have if you catch it and the fatter you are, the more likely you are to get into trouble so we keep KFC, McDonalds and the like open whilst banning outdoor sport, closing gyms and closing swimming pools. Clueless doesn’t even begin to describe them.
 
The Light Was Yellow Sir said:
With these fuckers in charge it doesn’t really matter. We’ve known for months that younger patients react fantastically well to treatments for COVID (oxygen, dexamethasone etc) so we could have some temporary facilities in that can do a quick bit of oxygen and some drugs that gets patients in and out quickly. You might call them Nightingales? Or we could spaff a small countries GDP on a useless test and trace system, more ’tests’ per million people than almost every other country and continually flip flop between managing COVID and thinking we can eliminate it.

When you hear Hancock saying they didn’t pay people to isolate (THE single biggest thing that would have made a difference throughout this prolonged pandemic) because “they didn’t want people ‘gaming’ the system” it tells you all you need to know. His sister, him, Gove‘s mates and many Tory MP’s and their cronies making millions from this and they were worried about some scally claiming £500 when he didn’t have COVID just about sums them up. Meanwhile, the comfortably off middle class getting 80% of their monthly money for being on holiday for 18 months. (It’s no surprise some don’t want it to end).
Hospitals are currently 97% full but bed numbers are down by a quarter, due to COVID restrictions, we have a workforce that’s shagged out, asked to do more and more (treat COVID, get the waiting lists down, vaccinate everybody, treat COVID, get the waiting lists down, vaccinate everybody faster, do more, do more, do it faster) and there’s still not the first sign of a plan from the useless wankers.

We also know that the fitter you are, the less effects youll usually have if you catch it and the fatter you are, the more likely you are to get into trouble so we keep KFC, McDonalds and the like open whilst banning outdoor sport, closing gyms and closing swimming pools. Clueless doesn’t even begin to describe them.
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Agree with most of that tbf.

Problem is, we as the public still lose out it in the end whatever we do. If we turn round and say enough is enough and the government have done this or that and simply start living our lives like it were December 2019, it comes at the cost of fellow citizens. Who's fault that is is by the by, it doesn't sit morally right with me that we'd allow it to happen.
 
ctwrd said:
Until the next month and the next.

it’s all too easy for you short sighted guys to argue for “just a few more weeks”
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No, because delay to long and it will put any exit wave back too far and into the autumn/winter time, when hospitals will have flu and everything else to deal with as we open up.

I think 4-5 weeks is the least worst option we have at our disposal when it comes to the motto of saving lives and protecting the NHS.
 
ctwrd said:
Until the next month and the next.

it’s all too easy for you short sighted guys to argue for “just a few more weeks”
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pretty comical comment. We have watched history repeating its self over and over and those airing the the side of caution are “short sighted”

I’d suggest those shouting to ignore the data after watching the way this has panned out over the last 14 months are the short sighted. Or just wilfully ignorant.

It’ll be 4/5 weeks at most here to get the double doses up enough. As single dose clearly isn’t enough for the Indian variant. Which is another “history repeating its self” event. Should have red listed India way before we did.
 
everythingchangesbutblue said:
Didn't they send covid infected care home residents back into care homes resulting in 1000s and 1000s of deaths? They are vermin.
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This is the sort of comment that just reduces the arguments to yah boo sucks level.
1. There is evidence that the scientific advice at the time was that asymptomatic transmission was not possible. Maybe. The enquiry should sort that out.
2. It is clear that testing capacity was not up to testing all these ppl before returning them to care. What do you suggest should have been done?
3 You can argue that there was a v. poor misjudgement. Does not make them "vermin".
Argue your case rather than name calling.
 
KS55 said:
This is the sort of comment that just reduces the arguments to yah boo sucks level.
1. There is evidence that the scientific advice at the time was that asymptomatic transmission was not possible. Maybe. The enquiry should sort that out.
2. It is clear that testing capacity was not up to testing all these ppl before returning them to care. What do you suggest should have been done?
3 You can argue that there was a v. poor misjudgement. Does not make them "vermin".
Argue your case rather than name calling.
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I'll do what i want. They are vermin.
 
grunge said:
pretty comical comment. We have watched history repeating its self over and over and those airing the the side of caution are “short sighted”

I’d suggest those shouting to ignore the data after watching the way this has panned out over the last 14 months are the short sighted. Or just wilfully ignorant.

It’ll be 4/5 weeks at most here to get the double doses up enough. As single dose clearly isn’t enough for the Indian variant. Which is another “history repeating its self” event. Should have red listed India way before we did.
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Those ignoring the data are those not opening up.
 
ayrshire_blue said:
So what's the alternative? Turn people away who are struggling to breathe because we can't be fucked with it any more?
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yes pretty much. The delta variant has a case fatality of 0.1% (you can look that up in the PHE papers)
There are 67,000,000 people in the UK, say everyone caught it that's 85,000 dead. That is the MAXIMUM figure and a very unlikely one as there's loads of people with antibodies out there. Back when this started the case fatality rate was around 2% equating to 600,000 plus deaths which is why the panic set in.
Now given that 300k+ people a day are getting 2nd doses and there's already 30 million of these people out there we can say these will reduce the 85k dramatically. There will always be that 2 million over 50's anti vaxxers no matter if the lockdown lasts for another decade and it will eventually cost them 2,000 lives going off the PHE stats. The reality is the potential deaths is probably going to be around the 15k mark if it's let rip through the country. That is not that many and doesn't warrant the shutting down of the economy.
 
ayrshire_blue said:
Agree with most of that tbf.

Problem is, we as the public still lose out it in the end whatever we do. If we turn round and say enough is enough and the government have done this or that and simply start living our lives like it were December 2019, it comes at the cost of fellow citizens. Who's fault that is is by the by, it doesn't sit morally right with me that we'd allow it to happen.
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From my perspective, 1500 people died today, and will die tomorrow and the day after and possibly 1% of those people died ‘with COVID‘. Half of them will have been ‘elderly’ and the average age of them will be lower than the average age of the total UK COVID deaths. Death is undoubtedly often a bastard, however it comes, but it’s coming for all of us, one way and another and continually enforcing never tried before non-pharmaceutical interventions on everybody, with no assessment of the cost of those interventions, doesn’t sit right with me, I’m afraid.
 
KS55 said:
This is the sort of comment that just reduces the arguments to yah boo sucks level.
1. There is evidence that the scientific advice at the time was that asymptomatic transmission was not possible. Maybe. The enquiry should sort that out.
2. It is clear that testing capacity was not up to testing all these ppl before returning them to care. What do you suggest should have been done?
3 You can argue that there was a v. poor misjudgement. Does not make them "vermin".
Argue your case rather than name calling.
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1 is wrong and don't let the MP's and Government Scientists convince you otherwise.

There was an absolute ton of evidence that asymptomatic transmission was possible just look at the diamond princess papers from February 2020 which gave an ideal scenario of a contained environment spreading asymptomatically. They just choose to ignore the science published in other countries (even Italy and Spain had papers asymptomatic transmission before it kicked off here). They appeared to go down a mypoic UK centric point of view blaming poor UK data when actually you could just look at Italy as see what was going on.

for 2 they could have put them in covid recovery hotels pretty easily

3 is fair enough. It's been awfully run from the start to this day but they've got the vaccines rollout right so fair dos. I do believe they are trying the best.
 
BerkshireBlue said:
yes pretty much. The delta variant has a case fatality of 0.1% (you can look that up in the PHE papers)
There are 67,000,000 people in the UK, say everyone caught it that's 85,000 dead. That is the MAXIMUM figure and a very unlikely one as there's loads of people with antibodies out there. Back when this started the case fatality rate was around 2% equating to 600,000 plus deaths which is why the panic set in.
Now given that 300k+ people a day are getting 2nd doses and there's already 30 million of these people out there we can say these will reduce the 85k dramatically. There will always be that 2 million over 50's anti vaxxers no matter if the lockdown lasts for another decade and it will eventually cost them 2,000 lives going off the PHE stats. The reality is the potential deaths is probably going to be around the 15k mark if it's let rip through the country. That is not that many and doesn't warrant the shutting down of the economy.
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The case fatality must be moving all over the place as vaccine effectiveness, virulence and immunity change.
If you look in the genomics data you can find one new escape mutation has been discovered 73 times in the last 28 days. The potential for future strains is there. That imo is why they want to dampen this down.
 
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