COVID-19 — Coronavirus

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BobKowalski said:
I’ve already remarked on the stupidity of using the term ‘herd’ as if we were cud chewing bovines. Allowing the focus to be on ‘herd immunity’ was clumsy given in reality all countries in Europe are expecting high infection rates and all countries are trying to slow the spread of infection so as not to overwhelm their systems. The only real difference seemed to be that we were ‘encouraging’ the initial spread which was risky as we have no reliable way to monitor the spread other than extrapolate based on rising infection cases from a relatively small pool of those tested.

But no they are not refocusing as you suggest. Hancock is denying it was the aim when two days previously it was the aim. If you want to refocus then just do that and issue statements which say it’s now stage 3 (or whatever) and our primary focus is now x and don’t mention what went before. You don’t actively deny it was a focus two days after saying it was a focus. It makes you look incompetent. The Govt can’t afford to look incompetent or look like it doesn’t know what it is doing, especially if it doesn’t know what it is doing.
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The lightweight Hancock is fortunately, like his heavyweight boss Johnson, just a front man. Claiming 'herd immunity' wasn't a policy just an inappropriate scientific term invites the question why the concept was referred to in the first place.The answer is that it was a serious error of judgement - but not all herds chew the cud.
 
Out at our village hall today, got a little market on with tea and cakes etc. All very normal round here bar the strange toilet roll shortage...

Back to work at school tomorrow, I find the normality refreshing after being on here most of the weekend.
 
mcfc1632 said:
Just an observation - I know and accept that people find it hard to rise above the need to simply slag of the government and PM because - well simply because it is the Tories and Johnson - and they cannot stop their need to hate.

FWIW - whilst I have not really had a positive thing to say about Johnson - I absolutely think that we should all thank fuck the election in December happened and brought about a resounding working majority - no matter for which party

I have not seen it commented on - but at least we can take a view - positive or critical - of the government's handling. Just imagine what things would be like if the position at Westminster was like it had been throughout 2018/19 - utterly paralysed and unable to make any decisions - with parties playing political games.

That would be undeniably far far worse - and I genuinely do not think that anyone could not agree with this view - unless they are just so utterly full of hate as do be not to be able to think.
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That's a fair point, I wouldn't disagree with that. My point in the other post wasn't even necessarily me saying Johnson is being dishonest regarding the plans for the virus or even a criticism of those plans. Just a comment on his dishonesty, the fact that most people know he is unusually dishonest and the impact that could have at a time of crisis when implementing the plans effectively right through to social order itself might depend on people believing what he is telling them.
 
Ric said:
Was due to take the family to London next weekend (planned on taking my lad to Chelsea away before it got rearranged/cancelled) but not sure if it's a good idea now. Can't get refunds for the train or hotel (or theatre tickets for the Sat night) so it'd leave me out of pocket but don't know if we want to be travelling around on the tube, in a busy theatre etc. Or is that an over the top reaction - should we just carry on as planned?
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Not a good idea! I suspect by, say, next Thursday, it won't even be a consideration.

I wonder how long before we follow our European counterparts with closures (shops, bars etc etc) before lockdown?
 
Chippy_boy said:
Even if they are not then there's a potential question about criminal negligence.

As I said, we are getting ahead of ourselves.
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You are certainly getting ahead of yourself because you’re one of those who see it as entirely black and white. I’m not going into the pros and cons of any particular approach but to suggest it’s a no-brainer to follow policy X over policy Y is bollocks. A complex mix of scientific, social and behavioural considerations are at play.

As usual, people get entrenched and have to make more and more outrageous statements in a bid to be heard over the shouting.
 
M18CTID said:
Not an over the top reaction at all mate - just commonsense. I’m trying to stay away from busy areas as much as possible, and that means no trips to town, the pub, etc. Unfortunately, it looks like I have to get the bus to work tomorrow but there’s not much I can do about that one.
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My work is about 25 mins walk away so am gonna walk it
 
AlgarveBlu said:
People should also do their own research and not feel intimidated to contribute to these threads otherwise we will have a set of polarized views which inevitably end up in a ‘there can be only one’ battle to the end . This is a time where everybody irrespective of their Profession, age, political leaning, economic background ,cultural leaning and medical disposition should participate and share their views/information and more importantly concerns and have a bit of a laugh as well as it’s grim enough out there as it is.

Not easy I know and am being slightly hypocritical her; as I was livid myself on here with the bloody it’s ‘just a flu’ crew a few weeks back as there need to be lines in the sand when spreading misinformation on globally agreed scientific fact which could cause other people to make misguided decisions. There are good debaters/contributors on here but the information can get lost if it’s always squeezed in between a rebuttal and a fuck you at the end of it.
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As you say, far too polarised, I’ve pretty much stopped posting on it, I’m content reading up and following my own path.
 
Pablo ZZZ Peroni said:
Not a good idea! I suspect by, say, next Thursday, it won't even be a consideration.

I wonder how long before we follow our European counterparts with closures (shops, bars etc etc) before lockdown?
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Not long at all id imagine.
I think the actual figures for cases and fatalities are being hidden from the public. There will be many many more than currently being reported.
 
Lancet Fluke said:
That's a fair point, I wouldn't disagree with that. My point in the other post wasn't even necessarily me saying Johnson is being dishonest regarding the plans for the virus or even a criticism of those plans. Just a comment on his dishonesty, the fact that most people know he is unusually dishonest and the impact that could have at a time of crisis when implementing the plans effectively right through to social order itself might depend on people believing what he is telling them.
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This is partly why Johnson brings up the experts with him.

What he says or does is irrelevant, it's the people guiding him that we need to listen to because they are shaping public health policy.

To be honest this shows there is an even greater argument to remove NHS/public health decision making away from politics.

Look at the US, they have a stupid moron deciding who lives and who dies.
 
read this morning that over 70's are to be told to stay at home within a few weeks and have home deliveries for groceries.
I have a weekly home delivery as i do not drive and went online a few days ago to do my shop for next week and they have no available slots for deliveries at all left and they have a 3 week window up to 3rd April so clearly thats not going to work
 
Lancet Fluke said:
That's a fair point, I wouldn't disagree with that. My point in the other post wasn't even necessarily me saying Johnson is being dishonest regarding the plans for the virus or even a criticism of those plans. Just a comment on his dishonesty, the fact that most people know he is unusually dishonest and the impact that could have at a time of crisis when implementing the plans effectively right through to social order itself might depend on people believing what he is telling them.
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I would expect/hope/guess that the UK government's strategy is that being determined by the medical and scientific leaders / experts.

Why on earth would any UK PM/Government do anything else????

It would simply not make sense.....

Option 1: Follow the medical and scientific advice and you are safe from criticism in the future if it goes wrong and you can take the credit if it is proven to have been correct

Option 2: Do not follow the medical and scientific advice - and if the route you go is proven to be incorrect you are utterly toast.

I think that Johnson has a host of character flaws - but those flaws only make me think that he would hide behind the medical and scientific advice

People are just being irrational IMO - some just because of their need to hate
 
Stortz said:
You answer the phone with ahoyhoy???
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- Pronto?
Chippy_boy said:
FWIW, I've decided I am not going to post much more on this thread (not zero posts, but a significant drop) because people clearly have intrenched positions.

I hope (and expect) that the government will soon start to introduce measures much more in line with those of Italy, Spain and France. And that therefore, once they have done that, the actual numbers (not the reported ones) will begin to fall, and things will get back under control. There seems to be circa a 2 week lag, where after lock down, reported numbers continue to rise - representing those already infected before the lockdown, working their way through the system. Getting infected > Incubating > Feeling ill > Getting Worse and finally being picked up as a statistic. That is taking about 2 weeks. So perhaps mid April, things may seem a bit less grim.

In the meantime, I expect it to get progressively worse and more Italy-like, with some awful stats and stories to come over the next 3 or 4 weeks. It's just too depressing and I am going to try to stay safe and concentrate on other things.
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Take care, this thread isn't going anywhere and it's absolutely of marginal importance in your life. It's nice to chat and share information, but if it causes you more stress and frustration than useful confrontation it is better if you limit your visits.

George Hannah said:
I was particularly impressed by
PicPAEX--tojpeg_1507734579557_x1.jpg

Paul Expert, Research Associate, Global Digital Health unit, Imperial College London
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He does have a smouldering stare ;)
 
mcfc1632 said:
I would expect/hope/guess that the UK government's strategy is that being determined by the medical and scientific leaders / experts.

Why on earth would any UK PM/Government do anything else????

It would simply not make sense.....

Option 1: Follow the medical and scientific advice and you are safe from criticism in the future if it goes wrong and you can take the credit if it is proven to have been correct

Option 2: Do not follow the medical and scientific advice - and if the route you go is proven to be incorrect you are utterly toast.

I think that Johnson has a host of character flaws - but those flaws only make me think that he would hide behind the medical and scientific advice

People are just being irrational IMO - some just because of their need to hate
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Just imagine if Boris ignored the advice of this country’s top experts, the very same people would be spontaneously combusting.
 
hertsblue said:
read this morning that over 70's are to be told to stay at home within a few weeks and have home deliveries for groceries.
I have a weekly home delivery as i do not drive and went online a few days ago to do my shop for next week and they have no available slots for deliveries at all left and they have a 3 week window up to 3rd April so clearly thats not going to work
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There’s probably a good few over 70’s that don’t know how to use the internet, certainly some of my neighbours don’t, luckily I’m in a position to do it for them.
 
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