Discontent that will end the Tory Govt is coming

[halfmist]

Perhaps there might have been more opposition if Hancock had said "We are giving PPE contracts to Tory donors who have no experience of procuring PPE". With hindsight, of course.

So your saying they should not do deals with companies who are Tory donors.
OK fair point.
Does this principle extend to a Labour Government, should they get elected, that no deals should be done with a Trades Union who have donated to the Labour Party.
In the interest of objectivity of course.

 

[law74]

So your saying they should not do deals with companies who are Tory donors.
OK fair point.
Does this principle extend to a Labour Government, should they get elected, that no deals should be done with a Trades Union who have donated to the Labour Party.
In the interest of objectivity of course.4

Companies that didn't exist when "lobbying" ministers - pals for contracts?

 

[halfmist]

How the fuck do you oppose the existence of a VIPLane that Lord Agnew as late as the 8th this month denied in the Lords existed?? Go on - simple question answer awaited.

You call it a VIP lane others call it a triaging system.
The Government were desperate to acquire equipment to protect front line staff, fact.
They were inundated with 100’s of Companies offering their services, fact.
There simply wasn’t the time to undertake a full audit on them all, fact.
The Labour Party, at the time were clamouring for a quick solution, not for the applications to sit on a Ministers desk for months.
The VIP lanes were open to all MP’s,Ministers and Senior Officials, not just Tory MP’s,fact
Now with that wonderful thing called hindsight, things are emerging which had they been known at the time, of course, no Government would have sanctioned them.
No doubt it will all come out in the Enquiry that the Government has sanctioned.

 

[halfmist]

Companies that didn't exist when "lobbying" ministers - pals for contracts?

That’s a red herring.
It takes about 5 minutes to bring a company in to existence.
Very, very, few companies had experience in securing PPE contracts because there had not been the demand for them until Covid.
These companies were competing with other Governments and other companies throughout the world for the equipment so the negotiations were bound to be a bit take it or leave it.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

You call it a VIP lane others call it a triaging system.
The Government were desperate to acquire equipment to protect front line staff, fact.
They were inundated with 100’s of Companies offering their services, fact.
There simply wasn’t the time to undertake a full audit on them all, fact.
The Labour Party, at the time were clamouring for a quick solution, not for the applications to sit on a Ministers desk for months.
The VIP lanes were open to all MP’s,Ministers and Senior Officials, not just Tory MP’s,fact
Now with that wonderful thing called hindsight, things are emerging which had they been known at the time, of course, no Government would have sanctioned them.
No doubt it will all come out in the Enquiry that the Government has sanctioned.

Hindsight?
If only they’d run an exercise in 2016, where they planned for a pandemic and where all the shortfalls were highlighted and a plan to address those shortfalls, including PPE provision amongst many others, were clearly identified. Then, imagine the government of the day didn’t ensure those gaps were closed and then there was a pandemic 3 years later?
If that had happened that would surely be negligence not something to be criticised, after the event, as only solvable with hindsight?

 

[halfmist]

Hindsight?
If only they’d run an exercise in 2016, where they planned for a pandemic and where all the shortfalls were highlighted and a plan to address those shortfalls, including PPE provision amongst many others, were clearly identified. Then, imagine the government of the day didn’t ensure those gaps were closed and then there was a pandemic 3 years later?
If that had happened that would surely be negligence not something to be criticised, after the event, as only solvable with hindsight?

If only they’d run an exercise in 2016.
Interesting theory.
Say they had, then bought a lot of stuff that was-
a)out of date by the time of the pandemic.
b)the wrong type of equipment
c) no pandemic at all and it all had to be thrown away
The opposition would have had a field day, moaning about wasting money,particularly if it was purchased by any company with even the remotest connection to the Tories.
As we say hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

[law74]

That’s a red herring.
It takes about 5 minutes to bring a company in to existence.
Very, very, few companies had experience in securing PPE contracts because there had not been the demand for them until Covid.
These companies were competing with other Governments and other companies throughout the world for the equipment so the negotiations were bound to be a bit take it or leave it.

I can remember watching the news about April May time in 2020 and listening to companies that had stitches, sewing machines and experience of producing high quality produce that had offered to make PPE, the government never even got back to them to explore the potential.

 

[bluethrunthru]

You call it a VIP lane others call it a triaging system.
The Government were desperate to acquire equipment to protect front line staff, fact.
They were inundated with 100’s of Companies offering their services, fact.
There simply wasn’t the time to undertake a full audit on them all, fact.
The Labour Party, at the time were clamouring for a quick solution, not for the applications to sit on a Ministers desk for months.
The VIP lanes were open to all MP’s,Ministers and Senior Officials, not just Tory MP’s,fact
Now with that wonderful thing called hindsight, things are emerging which had they been known at the time, of course, no Government would have sanctioned them.
No doubt it will all come out in the Enquiry that the Government has sanctioned.

Testicles - there were a number of companies who were established tried and tested suppliers to the NHS who had access to manufacturers of PPE that met the required standards but they were frozen out because this lot were too bust lining their mates pockets. There were people from those companies complaining that was the situation at the time and that will come out in the upcoming investigations and reports. They were the quick solution but the grifters and spivs overlooked them.

Biggest PPE suppliers 'ignored' by Government while 'VIP' firms got contracts

MPs were told there was a "feeding frenzy" for opportunists with friends in high places - while established firms struggled to get the attention of the government

www.mirror.co.uk

Investigation into the management of PPE contracts - National Audit Office (NAO) press release

This investigation examines DHSC's performance in managing PPE contracts. It is a factual account of what has happened since November 2020.

www.nao.org.uk

 

[halfmist]

I can remember watching the news about April May time in 2020 and listening to companies that had stitches, sewing machines and experience of producing high quality produce that had offered to make PPE, the government never even got back to them to explore the potential.

No doubt under your rules, with the benefit of hindsight of course, they would have had to do full due diligence on them first.
My experience of Government contracts pre Covid was something like a 20 page booklet had to be completed, even worse when the EU had any connection with a project.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

If only they’d run an exercise in 2016.
Interesting theory.
Say they had, then bought a lot of stuff that was-
a)out of date by the time of the pandemic.
b)the wrong type of equipment
c) no pandemic at all and it all had to be thrown away
The opposition would have had a field day, moaning about wasting money,particularly if it was purchased by any company with even the remotest connection to the Tories.
As we say hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Or, they could have just stockpiled PPE and then rotated it through the system so it was never out of date. Sadly we’ve got governments with no ability to plan anything. ‘Just in time’ is brilliant until the day it isn’t, and then it’s catastrophic. Gas storage? No need. Spare capacity in hospitals? No need.
We have traded off resilience for risk and, without a pandemic, a supply chain shock like Brexit and a war in Ukraine, muddling through might have been possible. However in failing to prepare this government have prepared to fail and that, by any measure you could put in place, they have most assuredly done.