Donald Trump

[Dax777]

I want lower taxes, but not at the expense of having a racist, potentially mentally ill, Prime Minister

Fair enough. So do millions who voted. Only if the political class would give them that. Won't that be something?

 

[Scottyboi]

Not long till the civil war now, fucking state of the place at the minute. If America wasn't so powerful other world leaders would be giving him some serious shit.

 

[The blue phantom]

Not really. But it won't be the first time I get accused of being a closet Trumper. The problem here ( or in real life living in New York) is that there is group think. Everyone has a liberal intellectual bent. It's a pile on of self aggrandizing commentary on 'how much better we are than these dumb, self hating, uncaring, racist loving backward cunts." Nauseating stuff really. Only if many were to be self reflective.

What do you mean not really. You either are or you ain't?

Judging by your post you sound like a staunch Republican, would you have preferred someone else rather than him?

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Not long till the civil war now, fucking state of the place at the minute. If America wasn't so powerful other world leaders would be giving him some serious shit.

They can have a civil war if they want. The problem here is that there’ll be a world war as soon as there’s a “proper” international crisis, and there are signs of one coming soon.

 

[Dax777]

What do you mean not really. You either are or you ain't?

Judging by your post you sound like a staunch Republican, would you have preferred someone else rather than him?

I'm clearly not liberal. And rail against most liberal orthodox beliefs coz they are ubiquitous. I lean more Libertarian I suppose. If I had my way, I'd want candidates like Bill Weld, Republican/Libertarian, Tulsi Gabbard Democratic Congresswoman, and Andrew Yang, Democratic Businessman. Weld is anti-big government. Wants to privatize and improve a lot of poorly run government entities and abolish Cronism infested agencies that pretend to regulate industries while in fact all it does is protect it.

He is nothing in Ideas compared to say Tulsi Gabbard, who was a Bernie supporter. A principled enough woman to resign from the DNC when they were busy sabotaging Bernie under the belief that nominating a woman was more important than anything else. Her domestic policies are liberal, but its her foreign Policy ideas that attract me. I want us out of wars, our troops home. Stop Policing the World trying to regime change. Its a failing philosophy and our warriors are dying needlessly. Retrofit our Military might to focus on technology and information over physical force.

I also like Andrew Yang because he is about the future. He is grappling with or trying to grapple what what a technologically disrupted world will bring us. Fewer "real jobs" and more "Gig jobs". He has ideas about "data rights", "Human Centered Capitalism" "medical technology innovation" "12 year congressional term limits" e.t.c. Do I agree with him all or most of his ideas? Not really (there goes that naughty phrase again) but the only thing I know for a fact is that I am not sure of the answer, and this guy is thinking about a lot and churning out ideas and seeking others. I like that. I see things I've never considered before. I call him the incubator campaign.

The above 3 I'll vote for without a doubt. At a push, I might vote for Mayor Pete too. Perhaps its his grace when speaking that draws me (kinda like Obama) I don't know. But I certainly won't vote for any of the others. They are all very familiar regurgitations of old half truths and promises built on half lies and the objectively discernible vilification of the opposition. You can miss me with that nonsense.

That's where I stand. It's not palatable. Many think it's fake. Some have even accused me of despicable things. But in the end we all stand in our truths. These are some of mine. And I make no apologies for them.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I'm clearly not liberal. And rail against most liberal orthodox beliefs coz they are ubiquitous. I lean more Libertarian I suppose. If I had my way, I'd want candidates like Bill Weld, Republican/Libertarian, Tulsi Gabbard Democratic Congresswoman, and Andrew Yang, Democratic Businessman. Weld is anti-big government. Wants to privatize and improve a lot of poorly run government entities and abolish Cronism infested agencies that pretend to regulae bodies.

He is nothing in Ideas compared to say Tulsi Gabbard, who was a Bernie supporter. A principled enough woman to resign from the DNC when they were busy sabotaging Bernie under the belief that nominating a woman was more important than anything else. Her domestic policies are liberal, but its her foreign Policy ideas that attract me. I want us out of wars, our troops home. Stop Policing the World trying to regime change. Its a failing philosophy and our warriors are dying needlessly. Retrofit our Military might to focus on technology and information over physical force.

I also like Andrew Yang because he is about the future. He is grappling with or trying to grapple what what a technologically disrupted world will bring us. Fewer "real jobs" and more "Gig jobs". He has ideas about "data rights", "Human Centered Capitalism" "medical technology innovation" "12 year congressional term limits" e.t.c. Do I agree with him all or most of his ideas? Not really (there goes that naughty phrase again) but the only thing I know for a fact is that I am not sure of the answer, and this guy is thinking about a lot and churning out ideas and seeking others. I like that. I see things I've never considered before. I call him the incubator campaign.

The above 3 I'll vote for without a doubt. At a push, I might vote for Mayor Pete too. Perhaps its his grace when speaking that draws me (kinda like Obama) I don't know. But I certainly won't vote for any of the others. They are all very familiar regurgitations of old half truths and promises built on half lies and the objectively discernible vilification of the opposition. You can miss me with that nonsense.

That's where I stand. It's not palatable. Many think it's fake. Some have even accused me of despicable things. But in the end we all stand in out truths. This is mine. And I give no apologies for it.

Wasn't the Obama foreign policy towards the end of his tenure trying to move the States away from intervention and confrontation in the rest of the world. Certainly that was the thrust of the recent Netflix documentary. Trump certainly has stopped that in its tracks.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

All of this will be fine though because like it or not the American economy has grown for 121 months, that is the longest period of sustained growth since records began in 1854. The stock market has rose by 19% and in June alone there were 244,000 jobs created, that is twice as many as needed to keep up with the population growth of the workforce. Of course add in historically low levels of inflation and this gives Trump a certain latitude to behave as he does. As Clinton said, its the economy stupid and if a recession does not arrive before the next election, I am fairly sure that four more years of Trump will follow.

I think Trump is uncouth, a veritable racist and all round obnoxious ****, but his record on the economy so far is pretty good.

If that were true Hillary Clinton would have won on the heels of Obama's economic expansion, and Trump's approval ratings wouldn't be stuck in the 40s.

Trump loses if Democrats get the turnout they need in the knife-edge states, simple as.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

Not really. But it won't be the first time I get accused of being a closet Trumper. The problem here ( or in real life living in New York) is that there is group think. Everyone has a liberal intellectual bent. It's a pile on of self aggrandizing commentary on 'how much better we are than these dumb, self hating, uncaring, racist loving backward cunts." Nauseating stuff really. Only if many were to be self reflective.

Um, I AM better than "these dumb, self-hating, uncaring, racist loving backwards cunts."

The "problem" is that's not the entirety of his support base.

Group think is the issue for people that SUPPORT Trump.

Thinking like a common sense, decent human being and expecting that basic quality in the President is the "group think" element behind those that detest him and see him as unfit.

The real joy among his supporters is created watching those on the other side ("liberals") get all riled up and flustered when Trump or they do something controversial.

His supporters love every minute of watching what they perceive as "the left" or "Dems" getting "owned." They've been down for so long that they savor every morsel of their "victory." Which is why they're willing to put aside all common sense and decency and act in ways that are shocking to so many. The same way we enjoy United floundering around.

It's ALL about "owning the libs." Each one of his supporters takes delight in this. That's the unifying theme, the group think.

This is why the take by a previous poster on "it's the economy, stupid" is so wrong this time around.

 

[Dax777]

Wasn't the Obama foreign policy towards the end of his tenure trying to move the States away from intervention and confrontation in the rest of the world. Certainly that was the thrust of the recent Netflix documentary. Trump certainly has stopped that in its tracks.

Obama had 8 years, if he wanted to move us away from war he could have. He didn't. Look I get it, it's a tough job and lots of people hate America so I'm not saying it's going to be easy. I think so far, and perhaps by luck rather than design, ( I'm guessing here) Trump seems to be less war waging than the previous 5 guys. Those are just the facts. But I'm not a Trump Foreign Policy advocate ( he barely had one outside of photo-op showmanship). But so far nothing has gone badly wrong yet, so I don't know.

I'd rather see what a well organized Tulsi Gabbard can put together.

As a sidenote another reason why I like the 3 candidates I do us because they are all consensus builders. Weld was a 2 time Republican Governor in a Liberal State. Gabbard is comfortable on both sides of the isle. Yang a problem solver. No matter what happens in the end I'd probably want all three running major parts off the next government.

 

[Ban-jani]

People nowadays expect to support the most idiotic, backward ideas or people with zero criticism. There’s a demand that their position is unchallenged and “respected” and that anyone who doesn’t agree to allow their support of intolerant people or ideas, are intolerant themselves.

It’s absolutely nauseating and ridiculous.

 

[Fred_Quimby]

Listening to his antics last night and it frightened me. So much sounding like a facist - Hitler and Mussolini.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Obama had 8 years, if he wanted to move us away from war he could have. He didn't. Look I get it, it's a tough job and lots of people hate America so I'm not saying it's going to be easy. I think so far, and perhaps by luck rather than design, ( I'm guessing here) Trump seems to be less war waging than the previous 5 guys. Those are just the facts. But I'm not a Trump Foreign Policy advocate ( he barely had one outside of photo-op showmanship). But so far nothing has gone badly wrong yet, so I don't know.

I'd rather see what a well organized Tulsi Gabbard can put together.

As a sidenote another reason why I like the 3 candidates I do us because they are all consensus builders. Weld was a 2 time Republican Governor in a Liberal State. Gabbard is comfortable on both sides of the isle. Yang a problem solver. No matter what happens in the end I'd probably want all three running major parts off the next government.

you are a good bit closer to the situation than I am but am all for consensus builders. Trumps trashing of the Iran nuclear agreement may well yet take a turn for the worse. I sincerely hope not.

 

[Dax777]

you are a good bit closer to the situation than I am but am all for consensus builders. Trumps trashing of the Iran nuclear agreement may well yet take a turn for the worse. I sincerely hope not.

I won't pretend I have enough foreign policy chops to fully grasp the original deal and it's effects, nor the effects of pulling out of it. But I know many criticized the deal at the time ( both Liberals and Conservatives) and many critized Trump's pull out without s plan in place, again from both sides.

I cannot say for sure who is right and which is better. But the results will tell us more in future.

 

[BobKowalski]

Um, I AM better than "these dumb, self-hating, uncaring, racist loving backwards cunts."

The "problem" is that's not the entirety of his support base.

Group think is the issue for people that SUPPORT Trump.

Thinking like a common sense, decent human being and expecting that basic quality in the President is the "group think" element behind those that detest him and see him as unfit.

The real joy among his supporters is created watching those on the other side ("liberals") get all riled up and flustered when Trump or they do something controversial.

His supporters love every minute of watching what they perceive as "the left" or "Dems" getting "owned." They've been down for so long that they savor every morsel of their "victory." Which is why they're willing to put aside all common sense and decency and act in ways that are shocking to so many. The same way we enjoy United floundering around.

It's ALL about "owning the libs." Each one of his supporters takes delight in this. That's the unifying theme, the group think.

This is why the take by a previous poster on "it's the economy, stupid" is so wrong this time around.

They've been down for so long that they savor every morsel of their "victory."

As a matter of interest what exactly have they ‘been down for so long’ about? Not disputing what you are saying just curious as to what they are so bent out of shape over?

 

[Saddleworth2]

I won't pretend I have enough foreign policy chops to fully grasp the original deal and it's effects, nor the effects of pulling out of it. But I know many criticized the deal at the time ( both Liberals and Conservatives) and many critized Trump's pull out without s plan in place, again from both sides.

I cannot say for sure who is right and which is better. But the results will tell us more in future.

From what I understand it was flawed but better than nothing. To rip it up without a very good plan for something better is criminal imo.

 

[SWP's back]

Only those who know little about tax law think raising tax rates increase the taxes on the rich. It doesn't.

Hmmm

 

[Dax777]

From what I understand it was flawed but better than nothing. To rip it up without a very good plan for something better is criminal imo.

You are probably right. That seems to be the general view

 

[BobKowalski]

I won't pretend I have enough foreign policy chops to fully grasp the original deal and it's effects, nor the effects of pulling out of it. But I know many criticized the deal at the time ( both Liberals and Conservatives) and many critized Trump's pull out without s plan in place, again from both sides.

I cannot say for sure who is right and which is better. But the results will tell us more in future.

Trump trashed the Iran deal because it was Obama’s deal. But it wasn’t just Obama’s deal it was a deal that involved five other nations namely France, U.K., Germany, China and Russia so Trump also trashed these nations efforts and this could potentially harm US relations with its allies and strongest opponent long after Trump. It was a dumb move born out of envy and spite.

The one potential upside is that Trump has adopted the slogan ‘speak loudly and carry a small stick’. Trump is not a military interventionist nor does he mind being played by the North Korea’s of this world and I suspect/hope the same will apply to Iran.

 

[malg]

2,659 pages in and he still hasn't started a war, or pushed the big nuclear button.

 

[Dax777]

Hmmm

Oh my God SWP. So much information. Please forgive me for I'm going to need a little more time to take this all in, maul it over, synthesize it, teach it to others so I know I fully understand it. Before I can even begin to ponder serving you a response worthy of this deep interaction.


Did I channel you enough without the cursing?