Donald Trump

[Bill Walker]

You’re still confused.
Not everything the US and other countries spend on defence goes to NATO. In fact, only a tiny proportion of it does. Most military operations that the US take part in are nothing to do with NATO. The reason it’s an issue is that if NATO has to respond to an attack on one of its members the US would end up picking up a disproportionate amount of the response. That hasn’t happened yet, although Trump is making it more likely by questioning US support for it and thereby encouraging Russia to do something in the Baltic states.

The above chart (by the anti Trump CNN) shows America's contribution to NATO, it is 3.61%, a higher contribution (percentage wise) than any other country

What dont you understand about that ? These are solely contributions to NATO, NOT national defence.

 

[west didsblue]

The above chart (by the anti Trump CNN) shows America's contribution to NATO, it is 3.61%, a higher contribution (percentage wise) than any other country

What dont you understand about that ? These are solely contributions to NATO, NOT national defence.

FFS I’ve explained it twice now and you’re still not getting it.
That chart is defence budgets not contributions to NATO.

 

[Bill Walker]

Im done with this thread
Too many America Trump haters who are quite happy to call black white if it fits their agenda.

No matter what Trump or America does they will always be cunts, even if America gives a ton more aid to poor countries they are still cunts.

 

[Bill Walker]

FFS I’ve explained it twice now and you’re still not getting it.
That chart is defence budgets not contributions to NATO.

You are utterly and completely wrong, have a look.

http://money.cnn.com/2017/03/20/news/nato-funding-explained/index.html

 

[Vic]

Exactly right and the US pays the highest proportion of GDP towards NATO
There is an agreement where each country will pay 2% of its GDP
All the countries I quoted pay less than 2%
You can see from the chart below Canada pay a measly 1.02% towards NATO

Personally I dont blame Trump for not being overwhelmed with this situation.

This is not money paid to NATO. The US figure is high because they have bases everywhere because they want to have bases everywhere. The NATO 2% guideline is what NATO countries should spend on defence even when they see no need. It's an arbitrary figure which means countries spend money on defence that is not needed for their defence. It means the Russians spend more on their defence. Officials move from NATO and the armed forces into the armaments industry. And so it goes. Trump doesn't understand how it works either (or does and is lying about it).

First of all, the agreement is to get to 2 pct by 2024 which, last I checked, isn’t now. NATO’s 2017 report notes that a number of these countries who are short have stepped up spending since the Wales accord, some growing defense spending 5 pct plus, and overall NATO defense spending is up since 2014, coinciding with global economic recovery.

I’d assume the Greeks are where they are given a weak GDP level. I note Trump has lambasted all those in red save Italy (it’s not clear who’s in charge to lambast) and Turkey, which I assume is because Erdogan is Trump’s kind of guy.

Of course we also don’t know if Trump is looking to stir up populist anger at allies and then went and found this “evidence” to support the feelings he wanted to incite, or read this first and said, “Hmmm. That’s not right” and didn’t bother to look through the accord. Either is possible.

But no one knows. That’s kind of, you know, the problem, as many of us have said about 8,000 times to little avail.

The Greek spending is high because they don't trust their NATO "ally" Turkey. If Trump does get friendly with Erdogan (quite possible as he must like the idea of getting rid of judges appointed by his predecessor) there would be a lot of angst in Athens.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

You are utterly and completely wrong, have a look.

http://money.cnn.com/2017/03/20/news/nato-funding-explained/index.html

From that very article: "The money they send to NATO directly accounts for less than 1% of overall defense spending by members of the alliance." And the chart shows defense spending as a percent of GDP. OVERALL defense spending.

And as I already pointed out, the 2% target is a 2024 goal; it's not a mandate for now.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

The Greek spending is high because they don't trust their NATO "ally" Turkey. If Trump does get friendly with Erdogan (quite possible as he must like the idea of getting rid of judges appointeed by his predecessor) there would be a lot of angst in Athens.

That makes sense -- thanks for clarifying.

 

[west didsblue]

You are utterly and completely wrong, have a look.

http://money.cnn.com/2017/03/20/news/nato-funding-explained/index.html

You should read the article and not just look at the pictures and you would find out I’m right.

 

[FogBlueInSanFran]

You are utterly and completely wrong, have a look.

http://money.cnn.com/2017/03/20/news/nato-funding-explained/index.html

So mate, look: the proper thing to do now is simply say, "I'm sorry -- I misunderstood" and we can all move on to discussing who my country should attack next and what is to be done about the sunburnt tangerine posing as my President.

 

[basokla]

No gun culture
Free health system
Less polluted

Not bad for a start

1. Still in top 10 per capita in the world
2. If you like to wait 1/2 a year for a Dr. appointment
3. Roughly the same size with about 1/10th the population will do that