Donald Trump

[Chris in London]

Everywhere he goes like onto a plane or through a door, he waves to non existent supporters.

A friend of mine does this, largely to annoy his partner.

It works.

 

[SkyBlueFlux]

I see why Trump picked him…

Such a weird guy. Who the hell talks like this? It’s like he’s attempting to study humans from the perspective of somebody who has only read about them in books.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

Such a weird guy. Who the hell talks like this? It’s like he’s attempting to study humans from the perspective of somebody who has only read about them in books.

The 'answer' just after 1:45 of that video sounds like gibberish. I have no idea what it means - "abandonment of Aristotelian virtue politics"??

(at least I assume that's what he said)

 

[SkyBlueFlux]

The 'answer' just after 1:45 of that video sounds like gibberish. I have no idea what it means - "abandonment of Aristotelian virtue politics"??

(at least I assume that's what he said)

I think that’s what he said, though I think in the UK we would pronounce Aristotelian very different which is why it sounds weird.

Somebody has read Aristotle’s Politics, he did go to Yale I guess.

To oversimplify (as his views are more problematic to a modern reader) Aristotle felt the objective of a household should be the good virtues of the family and not the acquisition of property and possessions. At least I think that’s what he’s getting at.

Edit: I said above that some of Aristotle’s views are problematic to the modern reader, but I get the vibe JD would feel they are in no need of further development. Despite being… 2400 years old.

 

[lancs blue]

I think that’s what he said, though I think in the UK we would pronounce Aristotelian very different which is why it sounds weird.

Somebody has read Aristotle’s Politics, he did go to Yale I guess.

To oversimplify (as his views are more problematic to a modern reader) Aristotle felt the objective of a household should be the good virtues of the family and not the acquisition of property and possessions. At least I think that’s what he’s getting at.

He could have said "greed is good" and left it at that instead of the pretentious bullshit.

 

[MillionMilesAway]

I think that’s what he said, though I think in the UK we would pronounce Aristotelian very different which is why it sounds weird.

Somebody has read Aristotle’s Politics, he did go to Yale I guess.

To oversimplify (as his views are more problematic to a modern reader) Aristotle felt the objective of a household should be the good virtues of the family and not the acquisition of property and possessions. At least I think that’s what he’s getting at.

Edit: I said above that some of Aristotle’s views are problematic to the modern reader, but I get the vibe JD would feel they are in no need of further development. Despite being… 2400 years old.

Thanks - I now feel my lack of Greek philosophy knowledge has been holding me back!

It seems a bit weird to me that Vance appears to be arguing that income/GDP is not the most important thing. It's in a sentence that has been tortured badly in its construction.

 

[Kippaxpete]

I think that’s what he said, though I think in the UK we would pronounce Aristotelian very different which is why it sounds weird.

Somebody has read Aristotle’s Politics, he did go to Yale I guess.

To oversimplify (as his views are more problematic to a modern reader) Aristotle felt the objective of a household should be the good virtues of the family and not the acquisition of property and possessions. At least I think that’s what he’s getting at.

Edit: I said above that some of Aristotle’s views are problematic to the modern reader, but I get the vibe JD would feel they are in no need of further development. Despite being… 2400 years old.

So, in terms of placing family before 'the acquisition of property and possessions', Trump's VC pick is advocating a societal system that is somewhat at odds with the unfettered free market economic model so favoured by this lunatic's acolytes whereby the pursuit of material wealth appears to be an aim in itself. Just remind me, what exactly does Vance stand for?

 

[Johnny Mars Bar]

I see why Trump picked him…

That’s obviously a sexist view, there’s no denying that.

But maybe we can give him a sliver of understanding in that he was raised by his grandmother as his own mother was an abusive violent drug addict.

I said earlier in this thread I’m reading his book. There’s some waffle and generalisations in it but the personal accounts of growing up are interesting.

One of the main threads is how much he loved his grandparents and how his grandmother was more of a mum to him than his actual mum.

Maybe his comments here stem from that personal experience, I dunno.

He is still a very strange guy though, I struggle to square how someone who’s clearly well read, intelligent and articulate can come out with some of the mental stuff he has in recent years with a straight face.

 

[Johnny Mars Bar]

So, in terms of placing family before 'the acquisition of property and possessions', Trump's VC pick is advocating a societal system that is completely at odds with the unfettered free market economic model so favoured by this lunatic's acolytes whereby the pursuit of material wealth appears to be an aim in itself.

I disagree.

The old Friedman / Reganomics free market capitalist model went out of the window years ago. This is a new social conservatism that’s built on inward facing dogmatic protectionism rather than liberal economics.

In a weird way Trump’s economic policy has got more in common with the old Soviet state capitalism model than it does with the traditional American free market, free trade globalisation model.

Whacking 100% tariffs on Chinese EVs is a great example.

 

[SkyBlueFlux]

Thanks - I now feel my lack of Greek philosophy knowledge has been holding me back!

It seems a bit weird to me that Vance appears to be arguing that income/GDP is not the most important thing. It's in a sentence that has been tortured badly in its construction.

My best attempt to translate from Vance’s warped mind palace is that you should take his statements about what he prioritises with a huge pinch of salt.

What he is trying to project here is that modern America is losing its grip on the “traditional family household”. That being man in charge. Wife and child may have a very different sense of “virtue” but they are ultimately subordinate to the virtuous man who heads the household. That structure is engrained within the virtue of the household. We’ll ignore the bit where Aristotle talks about how you should treat slaves.

What he’s saying is acquiring assets is still important - but this structure is more important and underpins everything.

He has a way of looking at the world which wouldn’t look out of place in Victorian Britain.