Electric cars

[Gaz in Zurich]

The batteries are only half the problem though. The other half is what do you fill them with? Electricity generated by burning fossil fuels? What's the point. We have fleetingly managed to produce 50% of our *electricity* (not total energy) needs from renewables. That's when it's windy and the skies are bright. We have no chance of producing enough when it's night time and cloudy, let alone if/when we have 50x the numbers of electric cars to power. And from memory I think electricity is less than half our energy needs - about 25% to 30% IIRC. So we've managed - fleetingly - to generate half of 30% of our required energy to run the country. It's pitiful.

So unless/until we develop some step-change capability in renewable energy generation and storage, or we get nuclear fusion up and running, or we just bite the bullet and build a load more conventional nuclear power stations... then the harsh reality is we are going to be relying on burning fossil fuels in vast quantities. I cannot see how this can be avoided in the next 30 to 50 years.

Why can't it be solar who takes up a lot of the slack? Tesla are now selling solar roofs that look like a normal roof and cost the same as a normal roof, so in future most peoples house's will have a solar roof.More than enough to power a car.
Also they are now building Mega Batteries, one in Texas is currently being built after the power outage and one in Australia. These can be built very quickly just outside major cities and scaled as and when needed to provide extra a lot of extra power. I don't think its as big a problem as you think it is. here in Switzerland most of the power we consume is Hydro and i'm sure many other countries also don't solely rely on burning fossil fuels.
If I get the chance I'll be whacking up some solar panels as well to charge my car and earn cash by selling back to the grid.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Why can't it be solar who takes up a lot of the slack? Tesla are now selling solar roofs that look like a normal roof and cost the same as a normal roof, so in future most peoples house's will have a solar roof.More than enough to power a car.
Also they are now building Mega Batteries, one in Texas is currently being built after the power outage and one in Australia. These can be built very quickly just outside major cities and scaled as and when needed to provide extra a lot of extra power. I don't think its as big a problem as you think it is. here in Switzerland most of the power we consume is Hydro and i'm sure many other countries also don't solely rely on burning fossil fuels.
If I get the chance I'll be whacking up some solar panels as well to charge my car and earn cash by selling back to the grid.

I suppose this is an electric car thread, and I suppose it is conceivable we could power cars from solar, although I think that's a stretch given the very small numbers of electric cars at the moment. And I take your point about house roofs. A car's roof is nothing like big enough - the ones that have them are vanity projects of no real use.

The most efficient solar panels you can get, generate about 200w per square meter. So let's say you had 2.5 sq m. on your roof, that's half a KW. At 3KW, it takes about 36 hours to charge a Tesla model 3. So 6 times that long at only 0.5KW charging rate. That's about 2 weeks to charge it up during daylight hours. i.e. a bit of a waste of time.

But OT, your comment "here in Switzerland most of the power we consume is Hydro"? That's not true.

Energy – Facts and Figures

The types of energy most used in Switzerland are oil, electricity and natural gas. Private households and the transport sector use the most energy.

www.eda.admin.ch

It seems you get about 12% of your energy from Hydro, and 13% from "Other" - whatever that means. 40% is from petrol, 24% from nuclear and 11% from gas. Take that 75% away and there is no chance you can (any time soon) generate the rest from Hydro and "Other".

 

[Airbags Optional]

The new electric Golf has cheaper running costs over it's 160000k/ 8 year warranty life than the petrol version. Less parts, less service costs, faster, decent range...etc etc

Price is comparable as well.

Thumbs up all round.

Fuck the mining, the excessive travel to get the parts to assembly lines, the generation of the extra electricity, the wonder of what happens after the 8 years or so battery life is up, the lack of charger access for a lot of people...

We are supposedly trying to save this planet we live on not add to the pile of crap that won't degrade for hundreds of years.

Then there's the local cost. 50-60% of all cobalt comes from the Congo. Where they use kids to get it out.

In China they pour ammonium sulfate into an ever expanding hole before acid bathing the lot. 0.2% of the end process is kept the other 99.8% of toxic waste is chucked back into the earth.

I agree that fossil fuel is not the way forward, but neither is the electric vehicle. Not with current battery technology. It's just another rape of the planet.

The same does have to be said about modern electronics. Replacing phones every 2 years, buying a new TV every year just because, filling your house with them...it all adds up.

I understand that, as with most things in life, man wants new shiny thing. It's in our nature. But there are huge cons with buying an ev and as far as the planet goes they outweigh the pros.

Battery technology is moving on quickly though, very quickly, so in a few years this all might change.

Until then I'll continue to run my old car. It starts, it stops. No need for new shiny thing.

For me you have hit the nail on the head. Society is so materialistic, everyone wants the latest phone, tv, trainers, clothes etc.. but think that they are green by buying an electric car! We should all look at everything we do day to day to help protect the planet. Small changes, stop spoiling kids with needless 3rd birthday parties, stop wasting money on stuff like Halloween or Easter hunts, stop throwing away food due to fussy eaters and stop replacing perfectly good machines for the next latest and greatest - the list is almost endless on how we could all make small changes and help save this world we live in.

 

[Chippy_boy]

For me you have hit the nail on the head. Society is so materialistic, everyone wants the latest phone, tv, trainers, clothes etc.. but think that they are green by buying an electric car! We should all look at everything we do day to day to help protect the planet. Small changes, stop spoiling kids with needless 3rd birthday parties, stop wasting money on stuff like Halloween or Easter hunts, stop throwing away food due to fussy eaters and stop replacing perfectly good machines for the next latest and greatest - the list is almost endless on how we could all make small changes and help save this world we live in.

I'm amazed you managed to type all that on your Amstrad.

 

[bugsyblue]

The new electric Golf has cheaper running costs over it's 160000k/ 8 year warranty life than the petrol version. Less parts, less service costs, faster, decent range...etc etc

Price is comparable as well.

Thumbs up all round.

Fuck the mining, the excessive travel to get the parts to assembly lines, the generation of the extra electricity, the wonder of what happens after the 8 years or so battery life is up, the lack of charger access for a lot of people...

We are supposedly trying to save this planet we live on not add to the pile of crap that won't degrade for hundreds of years.

Then there's the local cost. 50-60% of all cobalt comes from the Congo. Where they use kids to get it out.

In China they pour ammonium sulfate into an ever expanding hole before acid bathing the lot. 0.2% of the end process is kept the other 99.8% of toxic waste is chucked back into the earth.

I agree that fossil fuel is not the way forward, but neither is the electric vehicle. Not with current battery technology. It's just another rape of the planet.

The same does have to be said about modern electronics. Replacing phones every 2 years, buying a new TV every year just because, filling your house with them...it all adds up.

I understand that, as with most things in life, man wants new shiny thing. It's in our nature. But there are huge cons with buying an ev and as far as the planet goes they outweigh the pros.

Battery technology is moving on quickly though, very quickly, so in a few years this all might change.

Until then I'll continue to run my old car. It starts, it stops. No need for new shiny thing.

Okay but if your car does breakdown are you going to buy another? And if so, why not go electric over petrol as overall it’s still better for the environment never mind us humans don’t have to walk down the street breathing in toxic fumes (if everyone went electric).

 

[kinkyblue]

Okay but if your car doesn’t breakdown are you going to buy another? And if so, why not go electric over petrol as overall it’s still better for the environment never mind us humans don’t have to walk down the street breathing in toxic fumes (if everyone went electric).

Don’t forget the brake dust! Hardly use your brakes in an electric car!

 

[Two Gun Bob]

And those smogs that killed tens of thousands every year.
Why can’t we have them back too.

Character building.

 

[Two Gun Bob]

it’s still better for the environment never mind us humans don’t have to walk down the street breathing in toxic fumes (if everyone went electric).

Its not just toxins that take out Joe public but more the danger of Silent Running's.

Should Electric Vehicles Have Manufactured Noise?

A problem facing electric vehicles has been the quietness of the engines, with a fear of pedestrians being unable to hear approaching vehicles. The EU has created an electric car noise law to countermand this...

www.rivervaleleasing.co.uk

 

[BimboBob]

Okay but if your car does breakdown are you going to buy another? And if so, why not go electric over petrol as overall it’s still better for the environment never mind us humans don’t have to walk down the street breathing in toxic fumes (if everyone went electric).

It's no better for the environment. That's the point. And ask all the kids down the mines in the Sudan, or the slave labour in China if it's better for them.

 

[bugsyblue]

It's no better for the environment. That's the point. And ask all the kids down the mines in the Sudan, or the slave labour in China if it's better for them.

Yes it is. There's evidence that it's not clean but there's still a shit load of evidence that overall it's still better than petrol. You think the petrol industry is without scandals? Ha.