Etihad Campus, Stadium and Collar Site Development Thread

[Centurions]

Ok so the club spends £50m building the new stand.

It sells 6000 tickets at £299.

That's revenue of £1,749,000 a season.

After V.A.T is deducted it's £1,435,200

So using a simple calculation, not allowing for inflation or interest, it would take 35 years before the club made a single penny from the investment.

It doesn't really sound like the deal of the century to me.

Forget how big Liverpool, Spurs, Chelsea and West Ham's stadiums are, let them worry about that. If theirs are 3 or 4 thousand seats bigger, is it going to make us slip behind in to oblivion? Of course not.

I'm sure we'll only expand when it makes viable commercial sense, and that's how it should be.

Surely it would affect commercial deals too? Not to mention matchday spending.

 

[Keeper!]

Ok so the club spends £50m building the new stand.

It sells 6000 tickets at £299.

That's revenue of £1,749,000 a season.

After V.A.T is deducted it's £1,435,200

So using a simple calculation, not allowing for inflation or interest, it would take 35 years before the club made a single penny from the investment.

It doesn't really sound like the deal of the century to me.

Forget how big Liverpool, Spurs, Chelsea and West Ham's stadiums are, let them worry about that. If theirs are 3 or 4 thousand seats bigger, is it going to make us slip behind in to oblivion? Of course not.

I'm sure we'll only expand when it makes viable commercial sense, and that's how it should be.

If you get 60,000 plus fans ever week , that attracts bigger and better sponsorships for one, regardless of what the additional fans buy on a match day.

If the plans for the leisure, retail and hotels do come to fruition add that aswell.

Our owners are in this not only as an investment, this is a PR exercise for Abu Dhabi. And as that alone it has been a incredible success story.

Abu Dhabi brought Formula 1 to it shores, it built a stunning track and facilities at enormous cost, cost that will never be returned from the race itself. But like City a financial return was not the intention, the promotion of Abu Dhabi was and it again has been an incredible success.

 

[Keeper!]

I am not in the least worried what are capacity is, but I think you will find our owners are.

 

[Shaelumstash]

Surely it would affect commercial deals too? Not to mention matchday spending.

I'm not too sure commercial deals would be too affected? The Etihad deal certainly wouldn't be. Are Nike going to increase their 12m a year to 15m because the capacity has increased a few thousand? Are Coco Joy going to give us 2m instead of 1m? I don't think they are.

I'm sure match day revenue from food and beverage would increase, but obviously other costs like extra staffing, policing, cleaning etc goes up too.

I think the last expansion made commercial sense because they could offer cheap tickets in the new stand, but vastly increase prices on the middle tier of the Colin Bell and East Stand to make them semi-corporate.

If we were to just build a new stand and fill it full of £299 season tickets, while not increasing prices elsewhere, while it's great for the fans, it doesn't really make financial sense for the club.

Our owner is the best thing that's ever happened to the club, but he's not out to run a charity for City fans to watch some of the best players in the world for peanuts. I don't actually think he'll ever take a penny out of the club, but he want it to be self sustainable and you can't fault him for that.

If we had a different ownership model, let's say the Barca model where the fans own the club. If the vote was put to the shareholders (fans) "Shall we spend £50m on this expansion? It will take 35 years to pay for itself, and will mean either we have to spend less on players and have a wose team, or the shareholders have to find the money themselves by donating it or havibg a large increase in their own ticket prices" how many would vote to build it? It's different when it's your own money.

 

[Keeper!]

I'm not too sure commercial deals would be too affected? The Etihad deal certainly wouldn't be. Are Nike going to increase their 12m a year to 15m because the capacity has increased a few thousand? Are Coco Joy going to give us 2m instead of 1m? I don't think they are.

I'm sure match day revenue from food and beverage would increase, but obviously other costs like extra staffing, policing, cleaning etc goes up too.

I think the last expansion made commercial sense because they could offer cheap tickets in the new stand, but vastly increase prices on the middle tier of the Colin Bell and East Stand to make them semi-corporate.

If we were to just build a new stand and fill it full of £299 season tickets, while not increasing prices elsewhere, while it's great for the fans, it doesn't really make financial sense for the club.

Our owner is the best thing that's ever happened to the club, but he's not out to run a charity for City fans to watch some of the best players in the world for peanuts. I don't actually think he'll ever take a penny out of the club, but he want it to be self sustainable and you can't fault him for that.

If we had a different ownership model, let's say the Barca model where the fans own the club. If the vote was put to the shareholders (fans) "Shall we spend £50m on this expansion? It will take 35 years to pay for itself, and will mean either we have to spend less on players and have a wose team, or the shareholders have to find the money themselves by donating it or havibg a large increase in their own ticket prices" how many would vote to build it? It's different when it's your own money.

Are Nike going to increase there deal with us due to increased capacity....yes

But as I said this is not an ordinary business model. If it was I would totally agree with you, further expansion could not be justified because of finances.

Manchester City represent Abu Dhabi, and they only want the best, the VERY best.

And Manchester City Football Club WILL get the best, whatever the cost.

 

[SilverFox2]

Are Nike going to increase there deal with us due to increased capacity....yes

But as I said this is not an ordinary business model. If it was I would totally agree with you, further expansion could not be justified because of finances.

Manchester City represent Abu Dhabi, and they only want the best, the VERY best.

And Manchester City Football Club WILL get the best, whatever the cost.

Maybe but when ?

Next season the spend will be on the team and the manager, unless our owner sees infrastructure as a separate project. currently the stadium is not the biggest priority. for spend.
Our owner may want the AD reflection but would he really just throw money at it irrespective of cost and in a way confirm the fears that brought about FFP and the need to stop our owner?

Seem to remember that a new stadium on the same site was always a preferred route but the Council insisted it went the way how it is currently going.

 

[Shaelumstash]

Are Nike going to increase there deal with us due to increased capacity....yes

But as I said this is not an ordinary business model. If it was I would totally agree with you, further expansion could not be justified because of finances.

Manchester City represent Abu Dhabi, and they only want the best, the VERY best.

And Manchester City Football Club WILL get the best, whatever the cost.

So you think Nike will just donate us an extra few million because we've got a slightly bigger stadium? Or do you think it was written in to the original contract?

I appreciate the club is used as a marketing vehicle for Abu Dhabi and they want nothing but the best. The problem is mate, at the moment we have thousands of season ticket holders who don't bother to turn up to half a dozen games a season, leaving huge swathes of empty seats.

This gets widely reported in the press as our fans being apathetic and plastic. I'm sure that doesn't play too well in Abu Dhabi.

If we increased the capacity by a further 6k at current rates of demand it's likely that this problem will only increase further. So far from an expansion painting Abu Dhabi in a positive light, it could actually have the reverse affect.

I don't care how the press report on us personally. But I think looking objectively, the expansion doesn't make financial sense. It doesn't make PR sense. And the only reason people are calling for it is because they don't like the idea of Liverpool, West Ham, Spurs and Chelsea having a bigger stadium than us.

Now let's hope Guardiola completely re-invigorates the club, we play attacking, exciting football, score loads of goals, we become every kid's favourite team and we go on to win loads of trophies and we sell out every game. If that happens, it might be time to look at expanding, but personally I don't think now is the right time.

 

[worsleyweb]

So you think Nike will just donate us an extra few million because we've got a slightly bigger stadium? Or do you think it was written in to the original contract?

I appreciate the club is used as a marketing vehicle for Abu Dhabi and they want nothing but the best. The problem is mate, at the moment we have thousands of season ticket holders who don't bother to turn up to half a dozen games a season, leaving huge swathes of empty seats.

This gets widely reported in the press as our fans being apathetic and plastic. I'm sure that doesn't play too well in Abu Dhabi.

If we increased the capacity by a further 6k at current rates of demand it's likely that this problem will only increase further. So far from an expansion painting Abu Dhabi in a positive light, it could actually have the reverse affect.

I don't care how the press report on us personally. But I think looking objectively, the expansion doesn't make financial sense. It doesn't make PR sense. And the only reason people are calling for it is because they don't like the idea of Liverpool, West Ham, Spurs and Chelsea having a bigger stadium than us.

Now let's hope Guardiola completely re-invigorates the club, we play attacking, exciting football, score loads of goals, we become every kid's favourite team and we go on to win loads of trophies and we sell out every game. If that happens, it might be time to look at expanding, but personally I don't think now is the right time.

The lobsidedness and roof supports in the corner disturb me - I like Symmetry and balance in a stadium. That's why I loved Maine Road so much.

 

[Keeper!]

So you think Nike will just donate us an extra few million because we've got a slightly bigger stadium? Or do you think it was written in to the original contract?

I appreciate the club is used as a marketing vehicle for Abu Dhabi and they want nothing but the best. The problem is mate, at the moment we have thousands of season ticket holders who don't bother to turn up to half a dozen games a season, leaving huge swathes of empty seats.

This gets widely reported in the press as our fans being apathetic and plastic. I'm sure that doesn't play too well in Abu Dhabi.

If we increased the capacity by a further 6k at current rates of demand it's likely that this problem will only increase further. So far from an expansion painting Abu Dhabi in a positive light, it could actually have the reverse affect.

I don't care how the press report on us personally. But I think looking objectively, the expansion doesn't make financial sense. It doesn't make PR sense. And the only reason people are calling for it is because they don't like the idea of Liverpool, West Ham, Spurs and Chelsea having a bigger stadium than us.

Now let's hope Guardiola completely re-invigorates the club, we play attacking, exciting football, score loads of goals, we become every kid's favourite team and we go on to win loads of trophies and we sell out every game. If that happens, it might be time to look at expanding, but personally I don't think now is the right time.

Those fans that don't go.......I know of thousands of fans who can no longer go, due to the cost's and difficulty in getting tickets. This does not only apply to City I might add. There are a considerable number of fans who want to go.

What an incredible thing it would be for Sheik Mansour to complete a very high capacity stadium, that had incredible corporate facilities but also 10,000's seat available at reasonable cost to the fans who are now priced of watching the club they love.

On the Nike deal....how do you think Nike or any other manufacturer price up a sponsorship deal>? Units sold that's how, hence why are deal is considerably less than the rags, Liverpool and even Arsenal. You put an extra 10,000 people in the stadium each week, some of those fans are going to buy kit/merchandise, that's going to raise the income from Nike considerably.

Watch West Ham's next few sponsorship deals, they will be considerably higher than of recent, why, 60,000 punters every game and playing in the Olympic Stadium, not the sh1t hole that was Upton Park.

Re the Etihad deal, I think you will be shocked in a few weeks time, Etihad are utterly overjoyed with our deal and there will be a very serious increase in that deal pending.

 

[Keeper!]

The lobsidedness and roof supports in the corner disturb me - I like Symmetry and balance in a stadium. That's why I loved Maine Road so much.

LOl gone fishing!