EU referendum

EU referendum

  • In

    Votes: 503 47.9%
  • Out

    Votes: 547 52.1%

  • Total voters
    1,050
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Then there's the spectre of increased terrorism too, and I fear we have to unite with our European counterparts to better tackle that too.

Like we do in the 5 Eyes Union? Oh wait, it's not a political union.

Much easier for operatives (and arms) of terrorist networks to gallivant around europe and into the UK as it stands. You have to believe that groups like ISIL and sympathetic states only think short term to believe lack of borders and the existence of EU citizenship don't increase the terrorist threat.

Intelligence sharing is in mutual interest of all neighbouring (and non neighbouring) nations targeted by terrorists, regardless of political union.
 
So the our money gets spent inngermany or France etc... I'd rather we spent our own.

But... if you put your money in a bank, would you be happy if you got 0% interest? You put it there as in investment and then take more out - someone else's money ultimately. You benefit from how your money was pooled and invested and the improved economies of scale.

If a bottle of coke is 1.10 and you have a quid, you can't afford it.
If I have a quid too, I can't afford it either.

If we club together, we can get the two bottles for two quid deal!
 
All 3 on Remain side constantly attacking Boris, leaving Leadsom and Stuart to dominate the night.
Bit dumb.

All a bit depressing that the six focussed on immigration, personal attacks etc.

A lot of short terminal and little or no mention of growing our own workforces / skills development!
 
My honest opinion is that if you truly can't decide, then don't vote. Something feels wrong about voting for something you're not consciously 'for'. I know many people will say that if you don't exercise your vote, you can't complain about it later, but that's no reason to effectively toss a coin. At least by not voting, you're indirectly creating a statistic that you didn't vote which gives a more accurate national picture. If 40% vote yes, 40% vote no, and others don't vote. At least we as a country KNOW that 20% couldn't be bothered or couldn't decide. But that's a more accurate picture than adding a vote which isn't believed in.

Just my opinion!

And I will finalise my opinion on way or the other and vote.
 
I'm also fed up of the remain campaign calling the leave campaign liars over the £350 million a week figure without confirming what we actually give. Plus whatever the figure is the fact remains that we can't choose where we spend it which surely we should be able to do?

If you don't trust the remain campaign, how about the The UK Statistics Authority?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...mpaign-over-350m-a-week-eu-cost-a7051756.html

“The UK Statistics Authority is disappointed to note that there continue to be suggestions that the UK contributes £350 million to the EU each week, and that this full amount could be spent elsewhere,” it said in a statement.

“Given the high level of public interest in the European Union referendum debate, it is vital that official statistics are used accurately, with important caveats and limitations explained.”
 
But... if you put your money in a bank, would you be happy if you got 0% interest? You put it there as in investment and then take more out - someone else's money ultimately. You benefit from how your money was pooled and invested and the improved economies of scale.

If a bottle of coke is 1.10 and you have a quid, you can't afford it.
If I have a quid too, I can't afford it either.

If we club together, we can get the two bottles for two quid deal!
lol

If no one buys coke at 1.10 they bring the cost down until people can afford it or the go out of business.
You're assumption is that someone else wants the same drink as you. What if they want ice tea? Very popular on the continent ;-)
 
The employer exploits the open door policy. Any transient migrant workforce will increasingly exploit all available avenues afforded by the policy.

How transient are the workforce. At a local hospital Phillipino nurses have become an established and integral part of the Community.

Probably like yourself, a lot of the carers who come from outside the EU are very committed (like our own carers) and it's not just about low pay. This is certainly the case with the excellent carers who help my mum who includen English and Polish carers.
 
I think both sides struggled tonight and it was clear they all knew what the questions would be, so could plan for them!...No one really sold their view very well and I can understand why people are getting fed up with the whole process......but I've got to say..... I really couldnt trust anyone that says "We should all pay for our NHS, then we might appreciate it better".....Are we really meant to believe people like Boris, who say things like that, are looking out for the best interests of the average working class person? ....Got fed up of him not answering a question directly, preferring to redirect away from himself......Yes, I would agree the "leaves" are trying to sell hope....hope for a better future....but unless they can tell me what, when and how that hope can be reached...its just empty promises, because in fact, they cant promise that hope will "ever" be reached if we leave.......The only question I had to ask myself is...would I risk what I had today......for a future that could get better or worse?....My answer is no....I dont think 50/50 odds(which is what the leaves are offering) are worth risking the economy for the next couple of years.....I'm disappointed by the question time tonight because I'm firmly in the "stay" camp but wanted the "leaves" to give me a reason to listen and consider what they had to say.....tonight only confirmed, they have as much of a clue as the average man on the street.....You asking me to back you and support you...I need alot more than that!
 
But... if you put your money in a bank, would you be happy if you got 0% interest? You put it there as in investment and then take more out - someone else's money ultimately. You benefit from how your money was pooled and invested and the improved economies of scale.

If a bottle of coke is 1.10 and you have a quid, you can't afford it.
If I have a quid too, I can't afford it either.

If we club together, we can get the two bottles for two quid deal!

But if everyone is putting in are you telling me ALL are getting back more than they do?
We both know they're not so someone is losing out, in fact by the time they've wasted billions we all are.
If you don't trust the out campaign, how about the The UK Statistics Authority?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...mpaign-over-350m-a-week-eu-cost-a7051756.html

I'd don't know who to believe in all honesty, what I know for a fact is that we have no say what it's spent on and I don't think that's right.

The question was asked earlier, if this vote was for us to join would you? I doubt many would so why remain then?

It's been tried, failed massively, will only get worse and time it was scrapped. I've said all along that if we want to be 'in' we should be in totally not just on the fringes, seems nobody has the stomach for that and I have to ask why?
 
Like we do in the 5 Eyes Union? Oh wait, it's not a political union.

Much easier for operatives (and arms) of terrorist networks to gallivant around europe and into the UK as it stands. You have to believe that groups like ISIL and sympathetic states only think short term to believe lack of borders and the existence of EU citizenship don't increase the terrorist threat.

Intelligence sharing is in mutual interest of all neighbouring (and non neighbouring) nations targeted by terrorists, regardless of political union.

I don't believe borders are much of a hindrance to terrorism.
lol

If no one buys coke at 1.10 they bring the cost down until people can afford it or the go out of business.
You're assumption is that someone else wants the same drink as you. What if they want ice tea? Very popular on the continent ;-)

Of course but that's business. If we need a part from Germany, we can always just hold out and the price will come down, in the meantime we're losing business while we are waiting.
Life's all about bargaining so it works for both sides - the example really was illustrating bulk buying, which is what the EU is offering (on theory) to sellers outside the EU, this we (in theory) benefit from the savings. It's a matter of if you believe that really is the case or not.

The bargaining thing just works on both sides. The garage owner in THIS case knows if you don't buy the coke, someone else will. In THAT case, club together and buy the bulk deal, or bugger off!
Iced Tea? Get out of my shop!!! now!!
 
I don't believe borders are much of a hindrance to terrorism.


Of course but that's business. If we need a part from Germany, we can always just hold out and the price will come down, in the meantime we're losing business while we are waiting.
Life's all about bargaining so it works for both sides - the example really was illustrating bulk buying, which is what the EU is offering (on theory) to sellers outside the EU, this we (in theory) benefit from the savings. It's a matter of if you believe that really is the case or not.

The bargaining thing just works on both sides. The garage owner in THIS case knows if you don't buy the coke, someone else will. In THAT case, club together and buy the bulk deal, or bugger off!
Iced Tea? Get out of my shop!!! now!!

Probably our biggest terrorist risk is homegrown extremism who have been brainwashed after becoming disillusioned that UK foreign policy is a poodle of the USA!
 
I think both sides struggled tonight and it was clear they all knew what the questions would be, so could plan for them!...No one really sold their view very well and I can understand why people are getting fed up with the whole process......but I've got to say..... I really couldnt trust anyone that says "We should all pay for our NHS, then we might appreciate it better".....Are we really meant to believe people like Boris, who say things like that, are looking out for the best interests of the average working class person? ....Got fed up of him not answering a question directly, preferring to redirect away from himself......Yes, I would agree the "leaves" are trying to sell hope....hope for a better future....but unless they can tell me what, when and how that hope can be reached...its just empty promises, because in fact, they cant promise that hope will "ever" be reached if we leave.......The only question I had to ask myself is...would I risk what I had today......for a future that could get better or worse?....My answer is no....I dont think 50/50 odds(which is what the leaves are offering) are worth risking the economy for the next couple of years.....I'm disappointed by the question time tonight because I'm firmly in the "stay" camp but wanted the "leaves" to give me a reason to listen and consider what they had to say.....tonight only confirmed, they have as much of a clue as the average man on the street.....You asking me to back you and support you...I need alot more than that!

Yep, same as us really. No better insight. I think I might have preferred to hear from 6 business leaders, both multinationals and a few smaller businesses (say a business in Kent that does a bit of business in France, and has a website to sell across Europe). Normal businesses. Would be nice to hear the real world examples of day to day hurdles they face.
 
One concern I had was leaving our employment rights in the hands of the Tort Party - that's MY concern, I don't expect the 'Remai' policititians to share it! I expect them to argue/debate in the House of Commons or create a credible Opposition. I don't expect them to give it as a reason to stay in, basically passing the book the EU
 
But if everyone is putting in are you telling me ALL are getting back more than they do?
We both know they're not so someone is losing out, in fact by the time they've wasted billions we all are.


I'd don't know who to believe in all honesty, what I know for a fact is that we have no say what it's spent on and I don't think that's right.

The question was asked earlier, if this vote was for us to join would you? I doubt many would so why remain then?

It's been tried, failed massively, will only get worse and time it was scrapped. I've said all along that if we want to be 'in' we should be in totally not just on the fringes, seems nobody has the stomach for that and I have to ask why?

Top part: everyone pays in and the money is dished out to the places where the money is needed to promote growth ( look at Liverpool and Glasgow for examples ) and to build better economies, the weaker a counties economy the more ( in theory ) they get, the entire point of the system is to build the EU economy.

Bottom part:
The problem with it is the figure changes year on year, the figure we give is based on how well our economy progressed, and the rebate is based on the previous years contribution. you can easily find the historical data for how much we sent and got back but you won't find up to date figures.

Out of curiosity why do you say it's failed massively? What's failed exactly?
 
Top part: everyone pays in and the money is dished out to the places where the money is needed to promote growth ( look at Liverpool and Glasgow for examples ) and to build better economies, the weaker a counties economy the more ( in theory ) they get, the entire point of the system is to build the EU economy.

Bottom part:
The problem with it is the figure changes year on year, the figure we give is based on how well our economy progressed, and the rebate is based on the previous years contribution. you can easily find the historical data for how much we sent and got back but you won't find up to date figures.

Out of curiosity why do you say it's failed massively? What's failed exactly?

Top part; they're certainly failing with the weaker countries economical situation as Greece, Portugal, Spain etc. have shown/showing.

It looks to me like it's all falling apart and only us plus Germany are keeping it afloat.

Once we walk the rest will collapse like a house of cards imo.
 
But if everyone is putting in are you telling me ALL are getting back more than they do?

Well - I'm not saying that is ACTUALLY happening, just that the economic theory of that is correct, and perfectly possible. Everybody is taking out more than they put in because we are making the money not from each other, but from the external countries - like China, or USA etc. We're bulk buying and sharing the benefit of an overall lower cost, and we are fixing our prices between us so that the Americans can't play off one country against another and drive down our export prices.

Of course someone else is losing out - just not us in the EU.

That's the 'theory' or whole premise of the EU single market. It's another matter whether it's actually working or not!

Note:
'Price fixing' is illegal - I only used that term loosely, but we are essentially 'controlling' the EU market as one entity to stop ourselves being bullied individually - once again though - in theory!
 
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