Centurions
Well-Known Member
Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?Mad Eyed Screamer said:
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Football League Clubs Vote 'YES' To Safe Standing
- Thread starter Mad Eyed Screamer
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Sigh
Well-Known Member
ColinLee said:Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?Mad Eyed Screamer said:http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/26079503
However, Margaret Aspinall of the Hillsborough Family Support Group, still opposes any plans to allow standing at football matches.
She told BBC Radio 5 live: "We have listened carefully to the arguments but, as far as the Hillsborough Family Support Group is concerned, we had a vote on this and it was a unanimous vote that there is no such thing as safe standing.
"I do not understand why people want to go backwards after so many steps forward."
"
Couldn't care less what they think. So what? I just had a unanimous vote (Soviet-style, naturally) and there is no such thing as safe-living, or safe-driving, or safe stays-in-the-hospital, or safe PE classes in school etc.
Centurions
Well-Known Member
I just wondered since I only ever see Margaret Aspinall's name associated with the group. I had a quick look at their website but there's no mention of it at all so I've no idea when this vote was or the actual numbers involved. Having had a look at rawk previously I'd say that a lot (most?) are in favour but seem reluctant to be seen to go against the HFSG.Sigh said:ColinLee said:Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?Mad Eyed Screamer said:http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/26079503
However, Margaret Aspinall of the Hillsborough Family Support Group, still opposes any plans to allow standing at football matches.
She told BBC Radio 5 live: "We have listened carefully to the arguments but, as far as the Hillsborough Family Support Group is concerned, we had a vote on this and it was a unanimous vote that there is no such thing as safe standing.
"I do not understand why people want to go backwards after so many steps forward."
"
Couldn't care less what they think. So what? I just had a unanimous vote (Soviet-style, naturally) and there is no such thing as safe-living, or safe-driving, or safe stays-in-the-hospital, or safe PE classes in school etc.
Mad Eyed Screamer
Moderator
Around 2002 I attended one of their meetings with Malcolm Clarke from the FSF at a hotel in Liverpool. There was no more than 8 members of the HFSG there, who were the committee.ColinLee said:Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?Mad Eyed Screamer said:http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/26079503
However, Margaret Aspinall of the Hillsborough Family Support Group, still opposes any plans to allow standing at football matches.
She told BBC Radio 5 live: "We have listened carefully to the arguments but, as far as the Hillsborough Family Support Group is concerned, we had a vote on this and it was a unanimous vote that there is no such thing as safe standing.
"I do not understand why people want to go backwards after so many steps forward."
"
What interested me was they all said no way immediately - and then we showed them German style pictures and one of them said ''Oh that looks good'' and we began to discuss it, when a few minutes later, the committee leader cuts the subject and says ''we are opposed to standing full stop'' and the one who was interested fell into line.
Mad Eyed Screamer
Moderator
Blue Maverick said:How does I work as a season ticket holder? At the moment you are allocated a seat so for Europeans I understand this bit for domestic is it just a free for all like the old days or do you still get allocated that spot, but I thought the idea would be more space for more people or is it one person per spot?
In Germany it is a free for all, personally the dibble wouldn't go for that here...... needing to know where everyone is etc. So you could be allocated a spot.
There would be more space for other people as currently your body uses two steps - the one your arse sits over and the one your feet are on. Guidelines state that for every 10 seats you can have 18 standing (apparently we take up more room when standing - that's why when ticket allocations are reduced for having fans persistently standing, they take off the end seats in each row)
So 1000 seats = 1800 standing.
3000 = 5800
5000 = 9000
No need to put an extra tier on top of the north and south stands. Just bring in rail seating behind both goals and shove the away fans up in the gods!
I'm no cynic but...
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That's how I see it too. If standing was dangerous, it would be banned from trams, trains and buses, all things that move around and sometimes at speed and with unforeseen hazards to the traveller. At least terracing, unlike transport, stays where it is built. I suppose though that the argument would go that transport is essential to the economy whereas football supporters are beer swilling louts just looking for trouble. That argument would kind of fight their own view that the fans that day were behaving impeccably. And maybe they were and that this tragedy was one of policing policy, as now widely accepted, rather than blocks of immovable concrete. Whatever, it would help their own cause if their own supporters did what all-seating areas were meant to do, that is to sit down in them.Sigh said:ColinLee said:Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?Mad Eyed Screamer said:http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/26079503
However, Margaret Aspinall of the Hillsborough Family Support Group, still opposes any plans to allow standing at football matches.
She told BBC Radio 5 live: "We have listened carefully to the arguments but, as far as the Hillsborough Family Support Group is concerned, we had a vote on this and it was a unanimous vote that there is no such thing as safe standing.
"I do not understand why people want to go backwards after so many steps forward."
"
Couldn't care less what they think. So what? I just had a unanimous vote (Soviet-style, naturally) and there is no such thing as safe-living, or safe-driving, or safe stays-in-the-hospital, or safe PE classes in school etc.
Helmet Cole
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Abolishing standing, just like making miners unemployed was just part of thatchers plan to abolish the working class. Heysel Bradford, and Hillsborough just played into the hands of this agenda. Now is not the time to campaign for 'safe standing' as the tory govt still owes S Yorks police a favor for kicking fuck out of the miners and will not undermine the initial findings post Hillsborough by allowing standing.
Centurions
Well-Known Member
If you want safe standing then you have to campaign constantly otherwise you'll never get it back.<br /><br />-- Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:29 pm --<br /><br />Helmet Cole said:Abolishing standing, just like making miners unemployed was just part of thatchers plan to abolish the working class. Heysel Bradford, and Hillsborough just played into the hands of this agenda. Now is not the time to campaign for 'safe standing' as the tory govt still owes S Yorks police a favor for kicking fuck out of the miners and will not undermine the initial findings post Hillsborough by allowing standing.
Cheers for that, it's good to have someone with actual experience rather than just dredging the internet for 'facts'.Mad Eyed Screamer said:Around 2002 I attended one of their meetings with Malcolm Clarke from the FSF at a hotel in Liverpool. There was no more than 8 members of the HFSG there, who were the committee.ColinLee said:Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?Mad Eyed Screamer said:http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/26079503
However, Margaret Aspinall of the Hillsborough Family Support Group, still opposes any plans to allow standing at football matches.
She told BBC Radio 5 live: "We have listened carefully to the arguments but, as far as the Hillsborough Family Support Group is concerned, we had a vote on this and it was a unanimous vote that there is no such thing as safe standing.
"I do not understand why people want to go backwards after so many steps forward."
"
What interested me was they all said no way immediately - and then we showed them German style pictures and one of them said ''Oh that looks good'' and we began to discuss it, when a few minutes later, the committee leader cuts the subject and says ''we are opposed to standing full stop'' and the one who was interested fell into line.
It sounds exactly how I'd imagined it would be even back in 2002. Was the committee leader Margaret Aspinall by any chance or was someone else bossing the show back then?
Mad Eyed Screamer
Moderator
ColinLee said:If you want safe standing then you have to campaign constantly otherwise you'll never get it back.Helmet Cole said:Abolishing standing, just like making miners unemployed was just part of thatchers plan to abolish the working class. Heysel Bradford, and Hillsborough just played into the hands of this agenda. Now is not the time to campaign for 'safe standing' as the tory govt still owes S Yorks police a favor for kicking fuck out of the miners and will not undermine the initial findings post Hillsborough by allowing standing.
-- Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:29 pm --
Cheers for that, it's good to have someone with actual experience rather than just dredging the internet for 'facts'.Mad Eyed Screamer said:Around 2002 I attended one of their meetings with Malcolm Clarke from the FSF at a hotel in Liverpool. There was no more than 8 members of the HFSG there, who were the committee.ColinLee said:Just out of interest does anyone know the actual figures for this unanimous vote? Have they ever been published anywhere?
What interested me was they all said no way immediately - and then we showed them German style pictures and one of them said ''Oh that looks good'' and we began to discuss it, when a few minutes later, the committee leader cuts the subject and says ''we are opposed to standing full stop'' and the one who was interested fell into line.
It sounds exactly how I'd imagined it would be even back in 2002. Was the committee leader Margaret Aspinall by any chance or was someone else bossing the show back then?
No, it was Trevor Hicks (he lost his two daughters). His wife (or ex wife by then I think) was there too. The bloke who was interested in the German design was Phil Hammond who then took over from Hicks. There was four or 5 others there, all female so imagine Margaret was there.
It started off quite pally pally, but got.... not heated, but tense.
Saturdays game at Anfield v Arsenal,lots of close up pictures of the supporters for both sides,now I know viewing a game there is poor,but vast majority were standing.Perhaps the Hillsborough familes should make their own supporters sit,and not lecture others.