George Floyd murder / Derek Chauvin guilty of murder

[The perfect fumble]

So... What do war vets mean when they say they 'fought for the right for people to be free'...?

Freedom from a foreign invader? in some circumstances yes, for self determination? Yes, sometimes.

But for this.....

I think we can love our countries, the flags and many aspects of our past but we must respect the right to yes criticise it but also to love it. In previous wars people died for that right, they didn't die for any narrow view of what that flag means or some hopelessness of being bogged down by it's past. Many minorities (Indians, black people and even Muslims) also died fighting for that.

No.

 

[Bigga]

Freedom from a foreign invader? in some circumstances yes, for self determination? Yes, sometimes.

But for this.....


No.

Unless you're a vet with a personal point of view, I think you have no clue what you're talking about.

Vets use the term "free" to suit whatever narrative they see fit. Free "from foreign invader" is a given, but free 'to be yourself' is what they would typify as their meaning overall even if they may not agree with it.

 

[lazerblue]

i dont know why anyone gives a fuck about what happens in America, the country's a total fuckin basket case, what the fuck do you expect to happen when you put a gun in every fuckers hand

 

[The perfect fumble]

Unless you're a vet with a personal point of view, I think you have no clue what you're talking about.

Vets use the term "free" to suit whatever narrative they see fit. Free "from foreign invader" is a given, but free 'to be yourself' is what they would typify as their meaning overall even if they may not agree with it.

Then they're kidding themselves.

No war has ever been fought for those principles, what veterans tell themselves has no bearing on the real motivations for war.

In fact, many of the problems associated with veterans is a consequence of their realisation, after the fact, that they weren't fighting for any of that stuff.

 

[Bigga]

Then they're kidding themselves.

No war has ever been fought for those principles, what veterans tell themselves has no bearing on the real motivations for war.

In fact, many of the problems associated with veterans is a consequence of their realisation, after the fact, that they weren't fighting for any of that stuff.

Whilst I get that and Vets aren't dummies, they know most of the time their Govs are using them, BUT they have their own sense of achievement coming home and that's good enough for me.

 

[MeatnSpudsMCFC]

i dont know why anyone gives a fuck about what happens in America, the country's a total fuckin basket case, what the fuck do you expect to happen when you put a gun in every fuckers hand

Their decisions do seem to have a knock-on effect for the rest of the world. It happened with the decision with Huawei - whether it was right or wrong I’m not going to delve into as I’m not fully up-to-date with it, but it’s just one example where the US and it’s influence carries weight.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Whilst I get that and Vets aren't dummies, they know most of the time their Govs are using them, BUT they have their own sense of achievement coming home and that's good enough for me.

That's fine, what people tell themselves in order to reconcile the things that they do, sometimes tally with reality, and sometimes they don't, for the most part the consequences are limited to the individual, but when it comes to the justification for war, it's important to realise, for all of us, that noble causes are for the most part a load of bollocks.

 

[Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese]

Their decisions do seem to have a knock-on effect for the rest of the world. It happened with the decision with Huawei - whether it was right or wrong I’m not going to delve into as I’m not fully up-to-date with it, but it’s just one example where the US and it’s influence carries weight.

Huawei was about to install /run the world's 5g communication network so it,was very much a global issue. Racist policemen murdering black people in America is an American issue. The desperation to import it here and look for equivalence within our own society to justify whipping up a shit storm goes beyond empathy and solidarity and has become a bit sinister. We have protested American issues before - notably Vietnam in the 60's, but the difference now is that the actions of policemen in America have been transposed to our own police force.

 

[lazerblue]

Huawei was about to install /run the world's 5g communication network so it,was very much a global issue. Racist policemen murdering black people in America is an American issue. The desperation to import it here and look for equivalence within our own society to justify whipping up a shit storm goes beyond empathy and solidarity and has become a bit sinister. We have protested American issues before - notably Vietnam in the 60's, but the difference now is that the actions of policemen in America have been transposed to our own police force.

exactly,i'm sick of people tarring our policemen with the same brush as american cops, when was the last time anybody was shot in the back 7 times at point blank range by a copper over here, half of em don't even know what they're protesting for!

 

[Bigga]

That's fine, what people tell themselves in order to reconcile the things that they do, sometimes tally with reality, and sometimes they don't, for the most part the consequences are limited to the individual, but when it comes to the justification for war, it's important to realise, for all of us, that noble causes are for the most part a load of bollocks.

I totally agree with this.

But the Gulf wars, Vietnam and Falklands are all examples of deep lies, we the people and our soldiers, are told.

The World Wars were not and thus, when one of those Vets speak to say about being "free" I will gladly listen, knowing the untold weight of loss they endured and life they gave up for me to fuck around on the net and have an unbridled opinion.