Get behind Mark Hughes

I am.

I don't have a problem with managers, on occasion, stating that the players have let themsleves down in individual performances.

I've seen numerous managers do it, sometimes about more than one match, maybe a period of two or three and challenge them to put it right.

However, these occasions I've witnessed have only been over a very limited amount of time and have almost exclusively been done from a position of strength where the manager knows he has a rellationship with his squad, usually a long standing one, that should inspire them to pick up.

Maybe Keane at Sunderland might be an excpetion. He was prone to making these sorts of comments and it is now thought by many that he lost the dressing room. Thus, he left.

What I've never seen is a manager, over an extended period of time, a new manager who should be building a solid relationship with his squad at that, attempting to claim that the pathetic results he has produced over his whole period at the club are down to weak, pathetic son of a bitches who play for him.

We both know those words haven't left his mouth in that form but we also are bright enough to know that words suggesting towards that have. More importantly we also know that rumours and articles stating this have appeared regularly and the manager and club have taken not a single step to dispute them. Any denial of them have come from individual players.

I cannot stop returning to the overriding fact that it is the manager's responsibility to produce a successful environment. Not the players. He is the senior man, his judgements mould the environment and atmosphere.

To alienate or attempt to denegrate individual players, the so called bad apples, someoen like Bellamey or Dyer or Barton, might not be good but it may be understandable. To be in the same position with a majority of the squad, or to encourage suggestions of it, is not.

It is unforgivable. It fails in the basic responsibility of a manager.

So, whilst I will gladly hiold players responsible for their individual actions, people have all sorts of different drivers and emotions, the group dynamic is the sole responsibility of the manager.

No decent manager allows it to deteriorate in such a manner. And if they have they should shut up about it and try to hide it, not attempt to pass the buck for it.
 
My view is Hughes will remain until the end of the season.

The arabs seem to be be a patient people, and realise that you are not going to attract the right calibre of staff (management and playing) in the JANUARY window.

My opinion is that Hughes has been given the task of getting us into the EUFA cup next season, that is why he has been given a fairly low budget, and also why he is targetting "steady and reliable" instead of outright class.

IMO a high profile manager will come in in the summer with a whopping budget, and this fella will attract the calibre of players the arabs want.

Dont forget we were a poor team when the arabs bought us, and we are not much better now. Hughes was not their choice and i very much doubt the first half of the season has impressed them. They have not had time (yet) to fully assess things, but by summer they will have a much clearer idea. I strongly suspect the team that lines up on the last day of this season will bear very little resemblance to the one that starts the following season.

In the end, we should all be patient. Rome wasn't built in a day etc etc etc, but i think this is only the start of the ride. To use an analogy, Its a bit like the Pepsi-Max Big One at Blackpool, slow and tedious as it trundles up, your excitement/impatience building, but once its hits the top... Fucking Hell....
 
JohnMaddocksAxe said:
I am.

I don't have a problem with managers, on occasion, stating that the players have let themsleves down in individual performances.

I've seen numerous managers do it, sometimes about more than one match, maybe a period of two or three and challenge them to put it right.

However, these occasions I've witnessed have only been over a very limited amount of time and have almost exclusively been done from a position of strength where the manager knows he has a rellationship with his squad, usually a long standing one, that should inspire them to pick up.

Maybe Keane at Sunderland might be an excpetion. He was prone to making these sorts of comments and it is now thought by many that he lost the dressing room. Thus, he left.

What I've never seen is a manager, over an extended period of time, a new manager who should be building a solid relationship with his squad at that, attempting to claim that the pathetic results he has produced over his whole period at the club are down to weak, pathetic son of a bitches who play for him.

We both know those words haven't left his mouth in that form but we also are bright enough to know that words suggesting towards that have. More importantly we also know that rumours and articles stating this have appeared regularly and the manager and club have taken not a single step to dispute them. Any denial of them have come from individual players.

I cannot stop returning to the overriding fact that it is the manager's responsibility to produce a successful environment. Not the players. He is the senior man, his judgements mould the environment and atmosphere.

To alienate or attempt to denegrate individual players, the so called bad apples, someoen like Bellamey or Dyer or Barton, might not be good but it may be understandable. To be in the same position with a majority of the squad, or to encourage suggestions of it, is not.

It is unforgivable. It fails in the basic responsibility of a manager.

So, whilst I will gladly hiold players responsible for their individual actions, people have all sorts of different drivers and emotions, the group dynamic is the sole responsibility of the manager.

No decent manager allows it to deteriorate in such a manner. And if they have they should shut up about it and try to hide it, not attempt to pass the buck for it.
Click to expand...

I concur.
 
Kris_Musampa said:
My view is Hughes will remain until the end of the season.

The arabs seem to be be a patient people, and realise that you are not going to attract the right calibre of staff (management and playing) in the JANUARY window.

My opinion is that Hughes has been given the task of getting us into the EUFA cup next season, that is why he has been given a fairly low budget, and also why he is targetting "steady and reliable" instead of outright class.

IMO a high profile manager will come in in the summer with a whopping budget, and this fella will attract the calibre of players the arabs want.

Dont forget we were a poor team when the arabs bought us, and we are not much better now. Hughes was not their choice and i very much doubt the first half of the season has impressed them. They have not had time (yet) to fully assess things, but by summer they will have a much clearer idea. I strongly suspect the team that lines up on the last day of this season will bear very little resemblance to the one that starts the following season.

In the end, we should all be patient. Rome wasn't built in a day etc etc etc, but i think this is only the start of the ride. To use an analogy, Its a bit like the Pepsi-Max Big One at Blackpool, slow and tedious as it trundles up, your excitement/impatience building, but once its hits the top... Fucking Hell....
Click to expand...

And thats possibly why hes ofski, although mathematically possible we wont get into Europe next season.
 
I see it bothers you quite a lot. Can't say it bothers me all that much at all. I really don't care one way or the other whether Hughes hangs players out to dry, or whether he takes the Wenger/Ferguson route of "not my kids...they're lovely...it's those bastards next door who done it..."

What I want is some stability at City, which we have not had for a very long time.

Now, believe it or not, and I say this with not a hint of joking, as fucked up as Hughes' style of management seems to be to the outside world...it's got to have some merit to it, otherwise he wouldn't have been employed by Wales, Blackburn, and then by us. Furthermore, he wouldn't STILL be manager after some of the results and performances he's produced. Based on that alone, and for the sake of some stability, I'd be relatively happy if the owners gave Hughes another 18 months to try and get it right.

Now, of course, I may have had a different attitude if we were still broke and being run like a chippy ala Lee, Wardle et al - but we're owned by people who will get success because they can afford to be patient and get things right. It's not like they're going to run out of money or simply give up. So, as I say, for the sake of some stability, I'm not going to rant and rave on a messageboard until such time as Hughes does something which really does get on my tits.

If you're wondering what that magical moment would be...well, I can give you one example of something which genuinely made me a loath a manager...derby day COMS near the end of the season...NOTHING to play for. Zip. Zilch. Zero. We have parked the bus. The rags go one up. We leave the bus parked. The game is an embarrassment. Deadly Darius even misses a penalty. Which is no more than we deserved because we were rank from back to back (we never went forward so there was no front).

I've digressed. Probably because I'm bored with "Hughes Out" "Hughes In"...good luck to all of you and I hope we all get what we want...a successful City...
 
rastus said:
Kris_Musampa said:
Dont forget we were a poor team when the arabs bought us, and we are not much better now. Hughes was not their choice and i very much doubt the first half of the season has impressed them. They have not had time (yet) to fully assess things, but by summer they will have a much clearer idea.
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And thats possibly why hes ofski, although mathematically possible we wont get into Europe next season.
Click to expand...

Great point from Kris Musampa- I think we are all expecting Mark Hughse to make a silk purse out of a sows ear - the reality is poor in the summer - poor now.

And I'd stick my neck out further than Rastus and say it's mathematically probable we wont get into Europe next year - we need to step up on recent performances and show some consistency before we can even think about that.
 
BillyShears said:
I see it bothers you quite a lot. Can't say it bothers me all that much at all. I really don't care one way or the other whether Hughes hangs players out to dry, or whether he takes the Wenger/Ferguson route of "not my kids...they're lovely...it's those bastards next door who done it..."

What I want is some stability at City, which we have not had for a very long time.

Now, believe it or not, and I say this with not a hint of joking, as fucked up as Hughes' style of management seems to be to the outside world...it's got to have some merit to it, otherwise he wouldn't have been employed by Wales, Blackburn, and then by us. Furthermore, he wouldn't STILL be manager after some of the results and performances he's produced. Based on that alone, and for the sake of some stability, I'd be relatively happy if the owners gave Hughes another 18 months to try and get it right.

Christ Almighty, I wanted Hughes to succeeed, I was all for him.
Has he created Stability? no way
He hasnt built or improved us, however it is all that little gits Elanos fault.
Hes blaming everybody except himself andd that is poor.

Now we have the money we can maybe expect a manager that has managed more than Wales and Blackburn.
He did well for Wales for 4 games then fucked it up, their best chance of qualifying. So he hasnt got a mass of experience. Its not his fault but a few years to early for him.

Now, of course, I may have had a different attitude if we were still broke and being run like a chippy ala Lee, Wardle et al - but we're owned by people who will get success because they can afford to be patient and get things right. It's not like they're going to run out of money or simply give up. So, as I say, for the sake of some stability, I'm not going to rant and rave on a messageboard until such time as Hughes does something which really does get on my tits.

If you're wondering what that magical moment would be...well, I can give you one example of something which genuinely made me a loath a manager...derby day COMS near the end of the season...NOTHING to play for. Zip. Zilch. Zero. We have parked the bus. The rags go one up. We leave the bus parked. The game is an embarrassment. Deadly Darius even misses a penalty. Which is no more than we deserved because we were rank from back to back (we never went forward so there was no front).

I've digressed. Probably because I'm bored with "Hughes Out" "Hughes In"...good luck to all of you and I hope we all get what we want...a successful City...
Click to expand...
Edited
I spent ages typing a response then my pc played up.

Please dont get me wrong, I was all for Hughes and want him to be sucessfull.
But results and ill feeling between MH and players which have hit the press makes me feel he is not upto the job. Time is right for him to go
 
JohnMaddocksAxe said:
spanishblue said:
Ime with you i too have slated Hughes on here but reading the papers today idont think it is all his fault.
Some of the players at OUR club should be ashamed if they had any shame
One way to not let them run our club [these 2 faced twats]is to get behinde Hughes and do what we do best as City supporters stick with the good things that are City
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It's as easy as that is it?

A couple of paper reports saying it's all the player's fault, nothing to do with the manager and suddenly we slaughter players who have served us well and absolve a manager who has prodcued nothing but shit?

Jeez, Pravda and Goebbels would be proud at the ease of it all.
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Volkischer Beobachter , Der Sturmer,...and Goebbels.

It's not helpful, you being so inflammatory.

Yesterday you said the same thing about Pravda and Goebels, or was it Iskra and Himmler, or Izvestiya and Heydrich? I can't imagine why you're citing organs and individuals from the second and third most repressive and murderous systems ever to disgrace humanity in threads discussing a Welsh football managers incompetence. Yesterday you also used an extended metaphor involving Douglas Haig (the unthinking mans poster-child for incompetent callousness) and the greatest losses suffered by H.M. Land Forces in our history.

Yet you accuse me of sixth-form scribblings.
 
I would contend that this public buck passing aspect of his managerial style, well, his personality really, hasn't manifested itself in such a way at Blackburn or Wales. Results haven't required it and no doubt the group dynamic, containing many different individuals was not the same. I'm quite willing to believe this group dynamic may be more challenging.

Now it has manifested itself though and we are delaing with his situation here, not his prior positions.

With regard to the owners feeling it will be successful, I am convinced, and have been for a long time that these are proud and dignified people who are well aware, far too aware in my opinion, of the shithouse media, ex pros and mates or mates with a loud voice, that are destined to shout to all about these 'non football men' who are ruining the game with their money and lack of knowledge.

I am convinced this is utmost in their minds. Their superbly crafted and brilliant letter of introduction convinced me of this. It is this that convinces me that he will be here until the end of the season and they will go out of their way to avoid being the butt of critcism by the old boys network

Anyway, goodnight all.
 
JohnMaddocksAxe said:
I would contend that this public buck passing aspect of his managerial style, well, his personality really, hasn't manifested itself in such a way at Blackburn or Wales. Results haven't required it and no doubt the group dynamic, containing many different individuals was not the same. I'm quite willing to believe this group dynamic may be more challenging.

Now it has manifested itself though and we are delaing with his situation here, not his prior positions.

With regard to the owners feeling it will be successful, I am convinced, and have been for a long time that these are proud and dignified people who are well aware, far too aware in my opinion, of the shithouse media, ex pros and mates or mates with a loud voice, that are destined to shout to all about these 'non football men' who are ruining the game with their money and lack of knowledge.

I am convinced this is utmost in their minds. Their superbly crafted and brilliant letter of introduction convinced me of this. It is this that convinces me that he will be here until the end of the season and they will go out of their way to avoid being the butt of critcism by the old boys network

Anyway, goodnight all.
Click to expand...

LOL. The pompous organ grinder speaks. Cue the monkeys.
 
There is I would suggest further evidence that he was unable to alter the attitude of another player whose ego got the better of him in Benni Mccarthy. He came to us with a reputation and he sulked when dropped for us by Hughes, yet Hughes never managed to get him right again and ended up long term benching a fan favourite who many of us felt never got a real chance again under Hughes.

If more of your players are being blamed for their egos (I'm not too sure who the rumoured ones are?) then I wonder if he might opt to bench and sell them rather than work with them? I do find it odd as he had a repuation around here from gaining a lot of respect from players through his motivation? Once you can see that players aren't playing at 100% for your team, it becomes worrying that the motivation and then the lack of respect might have gone. It wa totally obvious in the situation with Ince was at the Wigan game, the heads were down, the performance was awful and even after the rhetoric and give us time plea's, there was no fight.

if you get in that position its going to stretch your fans a lot, it did ours. I personally was on the give him more side for Ince and would be the same for Hughes in this situation I think? But I also know how you're all feeling, gotta cross your fingers.

I think your squad even playing badly will be too strong to go down, you have that touch of quality to get something out of nothing but with Hughes...? Not if he doesnt have the fans behind him and poor results.
 
Cheers Phyco,
Just think its a different dynamic now at City with all this cash, expectation and star players.
Just don't think he has the personality to handle it.
Need someone who has worked at the very top (no disrespect to Blackburn!!)
 
Brucie Bonus said:
JohnMaddocksAxe said:
I would contend that this public buck passing aspect of his managerial style, well, his personality really, hasn't manifested itself in such a way at Blackburn or Wales. Results haven't required it and no doubt the group dynamic, containing many different individuals was not the same. I'm quite willing to believe this group dynamic may be more challenging.

Now it has manifested itself though and we are delaing with his situation here, not his prior positions.

With regard to the owners feeling it will be successful, I am convinced, and have been for a long time that these are proud and dignified people who are well aware, far too aware in my opinion, of the shithouse media, ex pros and mates or mates with a loud voice, that are destined to shout to all about these 'non football men' who are ruining the game with their money and lack of knowledge.

I am convinced this is utmost in their minds. Their superbly crafted and brilliant letter of introduction convinced me of this. It is this that convinces me that he will be here until the end of the season and they will go out of their way to avoid being the butt of critcism by the old boys network

Anyway, goodnight all.
Click to expand...

LOL. The pompous organ grinder speaks. Cue the monkeys.
Click to expand...

Speaks a lot of sense though, whats your view? give him till 2020 (Hughes i mean)
 
rastus said:
Brucie Bonus said:
LOL. The pompous organ grinder speaks. Cue the monkeys.
Click to expand...

Speaks a lot of sense though, whats your view? give him till 2020 (Hughes i mean)
Click to expand...

Wit. Try it. Change is as good as a rest.

My view has remain unchanged since Frank bought the club. It was the same before he hired Sven. It was the same whilst Sven was here. It was the same when Sven was fired. It was the same before Mark Hughes was hired. It was the same when the Arabs bought the club. It was the same when the first poll was put on here. It was the same when the second poll was put on here. It was the same last month, last week, yesterday and today and unless Jose Mourinho is appointed manager on Wednesday, I doubt it will change.

I have been ambivalent about Hughes from the beginning. He's like a decent family saloon: I'm not going to bitch just because he's not the Bentley Continental GTC I've always dreamed about.

I have said I want Jose as manager a number of times. When I have mentioned Jose, I've tried to be brief and stay within the limits implied by any OP. I haven't bullied anyone who would rather have Backyard, or Mancini (who would be my third choice, behind Zico) or Van Gaal or Hughes. I haven't posted a thread about Jose. I haven't hijacked threads. I haven't spammed the forum with posts and threads about Jose. I haven't tried to elevate Jose by denigrating Hughes.

I haven't made a saint out of Sven in order to make a sinner out of Hughes. I haven't wilfully exaggerated Hughes' faults, nor turned a blind eye. Neither have I made a conscious choice to minimize the problems City face due to our mediocre squad, whose greatest talent is making millions by recycling old rope and passing it off as cloth of gold.

I haven't spent weeks arguing Hughes has three sixes on his scalp partly out of respect for our owners, and partly because I retain the use of my neocortex. Although the Arabs did not hire him, they adopted and endorsed him.

I have not spent my time (and wasted others) by repeating the same thing moment by moment for weeks, boring folks to tears and driving them off, gasping.

If I were broadminded and wiser than tender years allow, if I were not in my salad days, still green in judgement, I too might have scaled the heights of Mount Athos. As it is, I, like you, can only be the man that I am.
 
I'm in.

Hughes isn't trying to destroy the club, he's trying to build it.

It has seemed odd to me for a while how so called professional footballers can put in performances like they have been.

The reasons for this are now becoming clear.

Hughes is one of the most highly rated and respected managers there are. No arguments.

He's been undermined by players at MCFC.

These bastards should be punished.
 
Evil Roy Slade said:
I'm in.

Hughes isn't trying to destroy the club, he's trying to build it.

It has seemed odd to me for a while how so called professional footballers can put in performances like they have been.

The reasons for this are now becoming clear.

Hughes is one of the most highly rated and respected managers there are. No arguments.

He's been undermined by players at MCFC.

These bastards should be punished.
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Count me in too.

I have my reservations about Hughes and ultimately I dont think he is our long term solution. However, I do think he has the guile and determination to transition us into a perennial top 6 team until such time that a new manager can be brought in to take the final step to winning something and finishing top 4.
It is my opinion that you can tell the players who try and are willing to buy in to Hughes vision/style and it is clear as day to see the slackers who dont. Give Hughes the chance to weed the unwilling element out and replace them with players he thinks can help us progress.
Ideally I would give Hughes teh seaon at a minimum whilst hoping that Jose makes himself available to us in the summer. if Jose doesnt want us then depending on how we finish (top half showing signs of progress)I'd let Hughes keep the reigns.
 
Count me in, i'm not a massive Hughes fan but even i can see he needs more time.
He's made mistakes & he'll continue to do so but our biggest problem imo are some of the players.
We hear a lot from City fans about how it's his job to motivate etc etc but in the modern game it's the players that have all the power. If a player decides he's going to down tools & not bother then there isn't much a manager can do apart from ship them out & bring in his own men.
Hughes needs time for this to happen, the sudden influx of wealth to our club has given some fans a ridiculous idea of who we should be signing.
The top players will have reservations about joining us at this moment in time & don't forget, even Chelsea had problems in attracting the very top players in the beginning & they were a top 4 side before the Russian even took over.
I know we signed Robinho but that was as much to do with the fact he hated it at Real as anything else.
We need a bit of stability at the club & i think Hughes will end up doing a good job for us........if given time.
Don't forget, it's not as if we only need 1 or 2 new signings, we need to dismantle this side & start again.
Out of our present squad i'd only make an effort to keep...
Hart
Zabs
Bridge
Ireland
Robinho
Swp
Kompany
Petrov
Bojinov
Sturridge
Quite a few of them are injured at the moment, if we can bring in 5 or 6 players & ship some of the rest out, then i think we'll then have a pretty good squad.
Then over the next couple of years we can add more class & hopefully attract a few of the 'marquee' signings people bang on about.
This is all just my opinion though & i'll probably be shot down for it ;-P
 
Brucie Bonus said:
Volkischer Beobachter , Der Sturmer,...and Goebbels.

It's not helpful, you being so inflammatory.

Yesterday you said the same thing about Pravda and Goebels, or was it Iskra and Himmler, or Izvestiya and Heydrich? I can't imagine why you're citing organs and individuals from the second and third most repressive and murderous systems ever to disgrace humanity in threads discussing a Welsh football managers incompetence. Yesterday you also used an extended metaphor involving Douglas Haig (the unthinking mans poster-child for incompetent callousness) and the greatest losses suffered by H.M. Land Forces in our history.

Yet you accuse me of sixth-form scribblings.
Click to expand...


Edit: Actually, I can't be arsed with all this.

I am willing to forget the whole little episode and scrub any preconceptions or ideas about individual posters.

If that's not an option then let's just ignore each other unless a proper debate breaks out on a thread we are both on.

I haven't got the inclination to go further down this route.
 
well i did think he should go in may but my mind is now set on him leaving. if we have to get a caretaker then jim cassell can do the job
 
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