Grenfell Tower block disaster

[franksinatra]

I live in a Multi and it's brick...they were going to clad it. My flat is roasting in mid winter. Absolutely no need for cladding.

Mate im guessing your walls are built differently are you are benefitting from the heating from properties below.

Properties of 'typical' cavity wall construction without insulation can be pretty cold and cost a lot more in heating.

 

[i kne albert davy]

I live in a Multi and it's brick...they were going to clad it. My flat is roasting in mid winter. Absolutely no need for cladding.

Some of them can be pretty cold in winter, if yours is modern or been renovated and built from brick chances are the cavities insulated. System built blocks can be internal or external clad.

 

[Blue Maverick]

What happened, 42 people stayed in one flat having been told to stay put?

ALL I can't think is that people trying to get out found there way to one place thinking it safe but unfortunately not

 

[mancityvstoke]

Some of them can be pretty cold in winter, if yours is modern or been renovated and built from brick chances are the cavities insulated. System built blocks can be internal or external clad.

The cavities were filled in 2003..........Been lovely ever since. Built in the 60's Charlestown multis.

 

[BlueAnorak]

Going back to the fire safety building standards:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...chment_data/file/441669/BR_PDF_AD_B2_2013.pdf (regs for buildings other than houses - e.g. blocks of flats)
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...chment_data/file/485420/BR_PDF_AD_B1_2013.pdf (regs for houses)
The combustibility test that has to be passed for class 0 cladding (insulation and composite materials) is mandated as BS EN ISO 1182:2010 - sadly you have to buy it if you want to read it: https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:std:iso:1182:ed-5:v1:en
That said, if the tests specified in the last document are the ones that these 60 blocks of flats have failed then I think quite a number of people will be going to jail.

 

[i kne albert davy]

The cavities were filled in 2003..........Been lovely ever since. Built in the 60's Charlestown multis.

Yep it does work in the right properties and without fire risk, the system built ones are harder to treat.

 

[franksinatra]

Going back to the fire safety building standards: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...chment_data/file/485420/BR_PDF_AD_B1_2013.pdf
The combustibility test that has to be passed for class 0 cladding (insulation and composite materials) is mandated as BS EN ISO 1182:2010: https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:std:iso:1182:ed-5:v1:en
If the tests specified in the last document are the ones that these 60 blocks of flats have failed then I think quite a number of people will be going to jail.

Those are not the correct Building Regulations. Its ADB2

 

[Blue Hefner]

Is this cladding illegal? Have builders bent/broken the rules? Who signed the work of on completion and how come non of this has come to light with subsequent fire safety checks?

 

[BlueAnorak]

Those are not the correct Building Regulations. Its ADB2

I stand corrected. I picked the wrong PDF from the list of links I saved when I wrote the post. I will correct it. Pretty much the same combustibility test applies - but slightly stricter for high rise buildings.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...chment_data/file/441669/BR_PDF_AD_B2_2013.pdf

 

[Millwallawayveteran1988]

Austerity gone out the window for the councils with this one! What a cost this must be. It's remarkable they didn't fully test them before putting them up.

 

[mancityvstoke]

All that money wasted ffs With Care for the elderly etc being shit this really is a scandal as well as a terrible horrific tragedy

 

[geoff clipp]

https://i-d.vice.com/en_gb/article/grenfell-tower-simon-cowell-charity-single

This makes pretty difficult reading but is a compelling account of the frustrations those affected by the tragedy continue to face.

 

[SilverFox2]

Going back to the fire safety building standards:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...chment_data/file/441669/BR_PDF_AD_B2_2013.pdf (correct document)
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...chment_data/file/485420/BR_PDF_AD_B1_2013.pdf (regs for houses)
The combustibility test that has to be passed for class 0 cladding (insulation and composite materials) is mandated as BS EN ISO 1182:2010 - sadly you have to buy it if you want to read it: https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:std:iso:1182:ed-5:v1:en
That said, if the tests specified in the last document are the ones that these 60 blocks of flats have failed then I think quite a number of people will be going to jail.

Thanks BA.

Seems the standards are there it now remains to be seen if the reason for failure of the samples was the cladding itself or the way in which it was used in high rise flats.

 

[franksinatra]

Austerity gone out the window for the councils with this one! What a cost this must be. It's remarkable they didn't fully test them before putting them up.

Who had at a council would have the equipment, test room, heating appliance to undertake these tests? Its not something you do in a storage room.

The suppliers submit their products to Warrington for testing and they then get tested to BS476 and the results listed on a British Board Agrement Certificate. Its not something a council is able to undertake.

 

[Millwallawayveteran1988]

Who had at a council would have the equipment, test room, heating appliance to undertake these tests? Its not something you do in a storage room.

The suppliers submit their products to Warrington for testing and they then get tested to BS476 and the results listed on a British Board Agrement Certificate. Its not something a council is able to undertake.

Oh I know they wouldn't do it but Christ someone has got to be culpable for this. Who are the testers in Warrington?

 

[mancityvstoke]

Oh I know they wouldn't do it but Christ someone has got to be culpable for this. Who are the testers in Warrington?

Dunno but they have shit lighters

 

[franksinatra]

Oh I know they wouldn't do it but Christ someone has got to be culpable for this. Who are the testers in Warrington?

To be honest their based around the world with numerous testing centres I believe.

 

[SilverFox2]

Who had at a council would have the equipment, test room, heating appliance to undertake these tests? Its not something you do in a storage room.

The suppliers submit their products to Warrington for testing and they then get tested to BS476 and the results listed on a British Board Agrement Certificate. Its not something a council is able to undertake.

If the current samples are also tested at Warrington and fail compared with original ones that passed and got certification what conclusions can we draw _?
If both samples have had identical testing then there must be a difference in the two samples.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

If the current samples are also tested at Warrington and fail compared with original ones that passed and got certification what conclusions can we draw _?
If both samples have had identical testing then there must be a difference in the two samples.

The testing agency who issued the original certification did something wrong. But that will only apply if the current tests are the same. There is normally an acceptable means of compliance (AMC) for testing and the AMC may change even if the regulation doesn't. It's not black and white but it is fucking tragic.

 

[franksinatra]

If the current samples are also tested at Warrington and fail compared with original ones that passed and got certification what conclusions can we draw _?
If both samples have had identical testing then there must be a difference in the two samples.

That is a good question Silver Fox. Read. Products tested and passed have been used in this block and are now being withdrawn (That is not to
suggest anything untoward as it is very early days and a sensible precaution) . Statements in the media have suggested the composite panels and insulation both failed the tests. Its going to be a long drawn out process until full understanding of what has happened.