Grenfell Tower block disaster

Ifwecouldjust....... said:
Errrrr totally disagree with this because rural is not where people want to be (and the infrastructure isn't there to support buses / schools / GP's etc.) My suggest would be

1) Compulsory purchase all unoccupied property (unoccupied for two years or more) and refurbish if necessary.
2) Inner city developments warehouse conversions etc (similar to whats happening in Manchester / Liverpool)
3) Develop Brownfield sites


then look at outward expansion into the countryside.
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Couldn't agree more.
The number of empty, dilapidated and falling apart buildings either in or around cities is shocking.
 
squirtyflower said:
Couldn't agree more.
The number of empty, dilapidated and falling apart buildings either in or around cities is shocking.
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Liverpool Council has just sold whole streets of empty terraced housing in Wallasey (I think) for £1 each. On the proviso that the purchaser has to pay for refurbishment and then after they have moved in must live in the property for 5 years.

sounds like a good plan
 
The new Kensington and Chelsea Council leader just said on the news that she has been a councillor for 11 years and has been in numerus peoples houses there - just none of them happened to live in a tower block..... csan guess which end of the borough she represents then
 
bluethrunthru said:
The new Kensington and Chelsea Council leader just said on the news that she has been a councillor for 11 years and has been in numerus peoples houses there - just none of them happened to live in a tower block..... csan guess which end of the borough she represents then
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I doubt she's been in charge of housing though. In which case, why would she go in a tower block?
 
BimboBob said:
I doubt she's been in charge of housing though. In which case, why would she go in a tower block?
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Childrens services and care - says she has visited many who lead troubled lives............... funny how none in that borough live in tower blocks
 
bluethrunthru said:
Childrens services and care - says she has visited many who lead troubled lives............... funny how none in that borough live in tower blocks
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If I was a posh bird from the other side of the tracks and in charge of stuff I'd stay clear of the type of tower block she hasn't visited and send a minion. I can see where you are coming from mate but this really is a non story. It doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.
 
BlueAnorak said:
The Grenfell Tower fire truly is scandal upon scandal. The certificate for the instlation said it could only be used with fire-retardant (mineral) outer skin
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ng-control-warned-about-refit-insulation-plan
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Thanks BA, lets hope that ALL who should have ensured the correct plan was used are prosecuted.
If the massive loss of life that fire has caused is allowed to be just a lesson we have to learn it will be tantamount to condoning collective ignoring of fire risk.
 
Saw something on the news the other day saying the reports of 40 people being found in one flat were untrue. At the time it was first mentioned, it made sense to me as people would have grouped togethe in such an emergency, trying to found a way out or wait for help.

I know that the poster who mentioned it is in the brigade and got it on good authority from a colleague in London. Anyone heard anything further?
 
Mike N said:
Saw something on the news the other day saying the reports of 40 people being found in one flat were untrue. At the time it was first mentioned, it made sense to me as people would have grouped togethe in such an emergency, trying to found a way out or wait for help.

I know that the poster who mentioned it is in the brigade and got it on good authority from a colleague in London. Anyone heard anything further?
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David Lammy MP mentioned it, although he said it was "believed" that they were in the one flat as they were breaking their Ramadan fast together. It seemed implausible, its helluva lot of people to congregate in one flat for a meal at that time of night. And if they were there surely they would have been among the first to notice the fire and at least some of them would have escaped.

He also referred to the rumour that "dozens" of people had died jumping from the tower block. Again, it seemed unlikely. It would be very difficult to cover up the presence of dozens of bodies scattered around the bottom of the tower block and the subsequent removal of those bodies.

Has it ever been established whether the account of the child being caught after being dropped from the 9th/10th floor was true?
 
cibaman said:
David Lammy MP mentioned it, although he said it was "believed" that they were in the one flat as they were breaking their Ramadan fast together. It seemed implausible, its helluva lot of people to congregate in one flat for a meal at that time of night. And if they were there surely they would have been among the first to notice the fire and at least some of them would have escaped.

He also referred to the rumour that "dozens" of people had died jumping from the tower block. Again, it seemed unlikely. It would be very difficult to cover up the presence of dozens of bodies scattered around the bottom of the tower block and the subsequent removal of those bodies.

Has it ever been established whether the account of the child being caught after being dropped from the 9th/10th floor was true?
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Cheers mate. I know lots of stuff would have been said immediately after the tragedy that simply wasn't true. I just felt that the story about the 40 bodies may have been. Rather than breaking the fast, I thought it possible, given the panic in the building, that people could have congregated together?
 
Mike N said:
Cheers mate. I know lots of stuff would have been said immediately after the tragedy that simply wasn't true. I just felt that the story about the 40 bodies may have been. Rather than breaking the fast, I thought it possible, given the panic in the building, that people could have congregated together?
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I was told that the 42 people had gone to one flat as they made there way down, I'm assuming it was on the 21-24 floors as that's were the majority died. If this was a room furthest from the fire and they had no means of escape it's highly plausible this happened and with the cyanide in the smoke I'm just speculating that many will have died from the smoke and if there is nowhere to go then this is a possibility. My contact in LFB has no reason to lie and is pretty straight with the facts.
 
Blue Maverick said:
I was told that the 42 people had gone to one flat as they made there way down, I'm assuming it was on the 21-24 floors as that's were the majority died. If this was a room furthest from the fire and they had no means of escape it's highly plausible this happened and with the cyanide in the smoke I'm just speculating that many will have died from the smoke and if there is nowhere to go then this is a possibility. My contact in LFB has no reason to lie and is pretty straight with the facts.
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Cheers pal.
 
So now it seems not only the cladding was flammable but the fire doors were only 50 per cent fire retardant. There are some huge issues ahead re building standards and regulations in this country.
 
nmc said:
So now it seems not only the cladding was flammable but the fire doors were only 50 per cent fire retardant. There are some huge issues ahead re building standards and regulations in this country.
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Sajid Javid’s comments in the Commons were shameful I thought. “No evidence” of a systemic issue, my arse.
 
Ric said:
Sajid Javid’s comments in the Commons were shameful I thought. “No evidence” of a systemic issue, my arse.
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I thought that too - those doors won’t be one offs - there’s thousands of them across the U.K. The question is - was the test faulty that certificated them or are those in production not the same as the ones tested. A few Tory MPs who publicly declared war on red tape over the last 10 or so years and who oversaw the shredding of standards in many areas are going to have a lot of difficult questions to answer.
 
nmc said:
I thought that too - those doors won’t be one offs - there’s thousands of them across the U.K. The question is - was the test faulty that certificated them or are those in production not the same as the ones tested. A few Tory MPs who publicly declared war on red tape over the last 10 or so years and who oversaw the shredding of standards in many areas are going to have a lot of difficult questions to answer.
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Yep, all that Cameron nonsense about “red tape” hasn’t aged too well. Who’d have thought it?
 
Ric said:
Yep, all that Cameron nonsense about “red tape” hasn’t aged too well. Who’d have thought it?
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This is people intentionally misinterpreting new or relaxed regulations for their own financial gain. I dislike the idea red tape and regulation are married. There is much red tape in business that could really do with streamlining or replacing for a more coherent and sensible operation.

Let us say i am the owner of the communal area fire doors sales company. I have sold these doors as fireproof to xyz standard and asking that price. However the reality is the doors are only good to a level or two below. I am not saying anyone here has done that either, it is simply a good example. Now i could not live with myself if a fire raged through a building with my doors that were properly used and people died. There are a lot that can seemingly get along just fine if they get paid enough.

"It's just business" well no it's not, you can't arbitrarily make a moral division in your actions on such a nonsensical basis. It is a cop out term for heartless fuckers to make a load of cash usually at every other buggers expense. I'll just kill the wife, it is a financially prudent life path decision, it's just business :-D

Sorry for that rant at the end, i detest that term.
 
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