How do we resolve the Brexit mess?

Octavian said:
Yeah completely agree with all that, we need globalisation for sure, I’m just not sure everyone thinks that way.

The big internal argument in Britain should have been an honest discussion about how much.
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An honest discussion with this 'government' involved??!
They lie, straightfaced, while we cry...
 
west didsblue said:
We’re not joining without the Euro and none of the opt outs we spent decades securing. I said years ago that the quickest way to closer integration was Brexit which would eventually be followed by rejoining. Can’t see it happening soon because as a country we’ve unsurprisingly managed to get ourselves a reputation as an untrustworthy negotiating partner thanks to Johnson and his band of talentless tossers.
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I believe that their is a way to rejoin.
It won't be straightforward.
It won't be easy.
It will be protracted.
The first step is to remove Boris along with most of the current cabinet, who broke the law in a 'limited and specific way' iirc.
 
searsleftpeg said:
No argument from me regarding the unelected second chamber. It should be reduced to a rump of say 35 all elected members and moved to meet in the North, perhaps Hull or Burnley. The House of Lords should be opened as a tourist attraction, and only used as a second chamber for state occasions. How on earth we have ended up with the second largest legislature in the world. China having the largest. We could then move on to doing something about the Commons
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Chinas' legislature has to deal with a vastly larger population than the U.K. has too.
 
Chris in London said:
It does.

That means we have to follow rules we have no say in making but there it is. At least we wouldn’t lose Ireland.
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Exactly. And a bit of harmonisation with Europe will be good for us after the shitshow that this government has created. You never know, it might even save the Union.

Putting Johnson aside, I'm not sure that the Tories are even capable of having a serious debate about what comes next as it would require them to face into the mess that they have created. They will have a sizeable wing crying foul every time anyone with a little common sense raises what the options are.
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Why not just join the single market instead? It seems the simplest solution to a lot of our woes.
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What woes ? We have just seen European harmony in all its glory re Ukraine.
Paris seems to be awash with violent, lawless gangs, on no wait the scousers are home skip that, but seriously, the E.U. is a basket case of broken ideas and self-serving countries
 
Blue Mist said:
What woes ? We have just seen European harmony in all its glory re Ukraine.
Paris seems to be awash with violent, lawless gangs, on no wait the scousers are home skip that, but seriously, the E.U. is a basket case of broken ideas and self-serving countries
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which are enjoying economic growth and FoM to name a couple of benefits they enjoy - meanwhile your description of a basket case that is self serving describes GB superbly
 
Fuck me this guy is stupid and insists on demonstrating it in public ...... his issue is the opposite of what he claims in that the EU is applying the agreement in full its the UK that is not hence the queue's at Dover for example. They are applying the agreement we are not, mainly because we failed to install the means at the border and recruit the necessary bodies to implement it. Even Johnson is on record that he agreed the protocol but he thought the EU would also sign but not apply it. Why would they do that? All Frost is doing is trying to disassociate himself and his name from the inevitable criticism that will be the historical fallout of his acts.

www.theguardian.com

‘Weakness’ of UK position shaped Northern Ireland protocol negotiations, David Frost says

Former Brexit negotiator criticises Irish government’s focus on ‘all-island’ economy
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
bluethrunthru said:
which are enjoying economic growth and FoM to name a couple of benefits they enjoy - meanwhile your description of a basket case that is self serving describes GB superbly
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Let's agree to disagree. What I will say is this. I voted out. I believe it is is the best but I was only thinking about the UK.
If I had considered the consequences for Northern Ireland more, I would have perhaps, voted differently. 30 years of 'war' cannot return. There are so many decent people who deserve far better than what everyone suffered during The Troubles.
 
bluethrunthru said:
Fuck me this guy is stupid and insists on demonstrating it in public ...... his issue is the opposite of what he claims in that the EU is applying the agreement in full its the UK that is not hence the queue's at Dover for example. They are applying the agreement we are not, mainly because we failed to install the means at the border and recruit the necessary bodies to implement it. Even Johnson is on record that he agreed the protocol but he thought the EU would also sign but not apply it. Why would they do that? All Frost is doing is trying to disassociate himself and his name from the inevitable criticism that will be the historical fallout of his acts.

www.theguardian.com

‘Weakness’ of UK position shaped Northern Ireland protocol negotiations, David Frost says

Former Brexit negotiator criticises Irish government’s focus on ‘all-island’ economy
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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Yep - its now far easietr to be based in the EU and export to the UK than it is to be here and export out. Outrageous would be the cry from the right wing press but for the fact that the reason it is like this is becuase we are not holding to our side of the deal. We are not putting the barriers up on trade that Brexit is built on. So its a massive gift to EU businesses and a kick in the balls for us.
 
Blue Mist said:
What woes ? We have just seen European harmony in all its glory re Ukraine.
Paris seems to be awash with violent, lawless gangs, on no wait the scousers are home skip that, but seriously, the E.U. is a basket case of broken ideas and self-serving countries
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Single market isn’t the EU. Basket case or not Europe is still our biggest and closest customer. We need to be able to trade with it without all the bloody nonsense and red tape that Brexit has imposed.
 
Blue Mist said:
Let's agree to disagree. What I will say is this. I voted out. I believe it is is the best but I was only thinking about the UK.
If I had considered the consequences for Northern Ireland more, I would have perhaps, voted differently. 30 years of 'war' cannot return. There are so many decent people who deserve far better than what everyone suffered during The Troubles.
Click to expand...
Only thinking of the UK but forgot one of the countries within it. Yep.
 
Blue Mist said:
What woes ? We have just seen European harmony in all its glory re Ukraine.
Paris seems to be awash with violent, lawless gangs, on no wait the scousers are home skip that, but seriously, the E.U. is a basket case of broken ideas and self-serving countries
Click to expand...
They belong to the EU when the chequebook is open but the borders are closed when they have to shell out! Too many of 'em want their chip muffin and still have hold of the ha'penny!
 
Saddleworth2 said:
Why not just join the single market instead? It seems the simplest solution to a lot of our woes.
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It's the obvious and easiest solution, and certainly the first step. It will happen, but unfortunately we have to wait to get rid of the current incumbents who refuse to be seen to back track on this. Whether it's a different Tory leader or after the next election and a different government remains to be seen. But at some point I'm sure we'll join the single market and customs union.
 
Blue Mist said:
Let's agree to disagree. What I will say is this. I voted out. I believe it is is the best but I was only thinking about the UK.
If I had considered the consequences for Northern Ireland more, I would have perhaps, voted differently. 30 years of 'war' cannot return. There are so many decent people who deserve far better than what everyone suffered during The Troubles.
Click to expand...
Don't fall for it. They are sick of the previous thread having the same six folk agreeing with each other and are trying to reignite the same bollocks here. @Moderating Team - can this be merged with the EU relations thread? Same shit, different shovel
 
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