Whilst my evidence is 5 years old it was a fact that the number of people brought into custody for possession of blades articles or more concerning for staff searching them, secreting knives on their person, particularly younger males, rose dramatically over the course of a couple of years.This is what's wrong with our politics.
Don't like reality?
No problem.
There are lots of reasons why those statistics could be wrong. Incompetence, corruption, incorrect information being fed in, or key information not being fed in. Statistics are frequently subject to correction. To suggest statistics are infallible is absurd.This is what's wrong with our politics.
Don't like reality?
No problem.
I do express surprise at your stance on this subject gdm.You have yourself just posted a distinction ffs! One is concomitant of the other. And they are therefore wholly distinct.
Stats are mere numbers that are prone to manipulation. A fact is not a fact if the numbers being fed to it are misleading.
I choose not to believe these statistics as representing the picture as I see it. Don’t do this often, but I’m doing it here. There is absolutely no way knife crime isn’t more significantly on the rise than in that graph. The numbers are wrong.
Two British nationals arrested but that's only been confirmed after 12 hours of wanton racist speculation about it being from "small boat people", all from the usual suspects on the usual websites. Even now it's been confirmed that the two attackers were British nationals, Tommy Robinson is sharing content that suggests he "refuses to believe the lies".
All last night you had blue-ticked right-wing accounts on Twitter, screaming in capital letters that the stabbing had been "confirmed as a terrorist incident" and that "the attackers were shouting Allahu Akbar". Now it turns out there was no terrorist element (within legal definitions) and that the attackers aren't asylum seekers from small boats.
We are living in dangerous, dangerous times. It was the same after the Southport attack, when a fake Asian/Muslim name was leaked to the press by a website in Pakistan, and nobody knows who did it - only the website it came from. A nationwide riot in the UK, all caused by somebody making a stupid online comment 3,000 miles away.
Social media is a cancer. The police and authorities need to be allowed to do their jobs, but we have online vigilantes flooding the zone with speculation and misinformation about ongoing, developing incidents. If they name the attacker quickly, it's a conspiracy to harm whites; if they don't name the attacker quickly, it's a conspiracy to protect Asians.
And there will be people on the left reveling in the fact that it's a British national, too. It's one thing to feel relieved that it's not an asylum seeker - for fear of more mass violence on our streets and more angry protests at hotels - but it's another thing to point and laugh and tease at the other side. All of it is in bad faith and it's getting us nowhere.
I can’t go into it for lots of reasons, and I recognise that puts me at a serious disadvantage in this debate, but I stand by what I say: there is no way it hasn’t increased sharply since Covid and I’ll leave it there. And tbf in that graph it has increased, but I’d say by a lot more than that.I do express surprise at your stance on this subject gdm.
Whilst you are correct that statistical analysis can be misproduced, misleading, misinterpreted or manipulated the figures you are disputing here are almost certainly derived from individual facts that can be individually proven. The source of these charts are probably the best we have and to support that opinion the Ben Kinsella Knife Crime charity choose to accept them enough to use them on their website.
Maybe rather than just dismiss what analysis there is you provide something better than unverifiable say-so. That’s not a personal attack, your experience is valuable on here and people will trust your opinions. I just find it dangerous that data analysis is being dismissed as not being facts, that’s what a lot of people are doing these days. It’s my career at stake!
Different scenario I know but I was coming back from Wigan once guard maybe 60 ish was attacked quite severely on the train no one intervened despite it being full, I jumped up restrained the perpetrator until we arrived at Salford crescent where he was arrested, it turned out the guard called Steve had a broken collarbone and a few other injuries.Sounds like this train worker (not sure what his job title is) was an absolute fucking hero.
None of us can know what’s round the corner in life, and we all wonder how we’d cope in a situation like that, but this bloke really delivered when things took an unexpected turn.
Mental illness, known to the health workers, friends police etc......It's perhaps another case of serious mental illness who knows. Although obviously this will be met with rolling eyes.
Just to address your last paragraph...Two British nationals arrested but that's only been confirmed after 12 hours of wanton racist speculation about it being from "small boat people", all from the usual suspects on the usual websites. Even now it's been confirmed that the two attackers were British nationals, Tommy Robinson is sharing content that suggests he "refuses to believe the lies".
All last night you had blue-ticked right-wing accounts on Twitter, screaming in capital letters that the stabbing had been "confirmed as a terrorist incident" and that "the attackers were shouting Allahu Akbar". Now it turns out there was no terrorist element (within legal definitions) and that the attackers aren't asylum seekers from small boats.
We are living in dangerous, dangerous times. It was the same after the Southport attack, when a fake Asian/Muslim name was leaked to the press by a website in Pakistan, and nobody knows who did it - only the website it came from. A nationwide riot in the UK, all caused by somebody making a stupid online comment 3,000 miles away.
Social media is a cancer. The police and authorities need to be allowed to do their jobs, but we have online vigilantes flooding the zone with speculation and misinformation about ongoing, developing incidents. If they name the attacker quickly, it's a conspiracy to harm whites; if they don't name the attacker quickly, it's a conspiracy to protect Asians.
And there will be people on the left reveling in the fact that it's a British national, too. It's one thing to feel relieved that it's not an asylum seeker - for fear of more mass violence on our streets and more angry protests at hotels - but it's another thing to point and laugh and tease at the other side. All of it is in bad faith and it's getting us nowhere.
You and those close to you know you did the right thing.Different scenario I know but I was coming back from Wigan once guard maybe 60 ish was attacked quite severely on the train no one intervened despite it being full, I jumped up restrained the perpetrator until we arrived at Salford crescent where he was arrested, it turned out the guard called Steve had a broken collarbone and a few other injuries.
Despite all the applause and kind words of the station staff I never even received a free train ticket not that I wanted one but no thanks of hierarchy what so ever despite having to go to court to testify and potentially saving him from more severe injuries. The guard himself called round maybe 2 months later to thank me in person
we exchanged numbers but that was about it but I’d do it again should the situation arise
Okay, that’s fair enough if you’re involved in something that might override, correct or improve the analysis. Re-reading your earlier posts and I perhaps do now see your point a little. Whilst the analysis is hopefully the best it should be, the final stage of any data analysis is continual challenge of the results. An example would be when NASA recently discovered some weather data collected in the Rockies back in the 1930s was not reliable (the equipment used wasn’t calibrated correctly) and when the data was removed caused a more serious temperature increase in temperature charts for North America. Sadly though, this doesn’t compute with some ordinary folk who just dismiss everything that doesn’t fit their opinion.I can’t go into it for lots of reasons, and I recognise that puts me at a serious disadvantage in this debate, but I stand by what I say: there is no way it hasn’t increased sharply since Covid and I’ll leave it there. And tbf in that graph it has increased, but I’d say by a lot more than that.
Good post. It clearly has more of an affect on you personally than others.Just to address your last paragraph...
I'm a socialist and an Asian man. The reason I breathe a sigh of relief when it's a white person or British national as you say is cuz there will be way less heat on us. If you didn't catch that, there will be less chance of being racially or physically abused. Nothing to do with my politics at all!
I agree mate! Should come out instantly. But the legal process should not bend to suit the needs of 'trial by social media' or just to combat misinformation. The authorities have a protocol for releasing info for a reason. I guess the government needs to come down much harder on social media misinformation...Good post. It clearly has more of an affect on you personally than others.
What angers me is, the Authorities knew within minutes, by interviewing the guy with him and other witnesses,that he was “doing the devils work” and had mental issues so why the fuck do they leave it so long to tell the public that it was likely to be a one off isolated incident.
There is covering one’s arse and reassuring the public, which then avoids all the speculation that inevitably follows.
I don’t do that, and agree that people deploy that approach too readily, and as I said I rarely do it, but when presented with a statistic that is contrary to your lived experience it’s perfectly normal to question it.Okay, that’s fair enough if you’re involved in something that might override, correct or improve the analysis. Re-reading your earlier posts and I perhaps do now see your point a little. Whilst the analysis is hopefully the best it should be, the final stage of any data analysis is continual challenge of the results. An example would be when NASA recently discovered some weather data collected in the Rockies back in the 1930s was not reliable (the equipment used wasn’t calibrated correctly) and when the data was removed caused a more serious temperature increase in temperature charts for North America. Sadly though, this doesn’t compute with some ordinary folk who just dismiss everything that doesn’t fit their opinion.
Why make the odds even or require close proximity? They say “Don’t bring a knife to a gun fight” for a reason, and it’s not to compare close combat knife fighting skills!
What does being British prove or not prove though?It follow on from your point - Before it was said the suspects were British nationals, Lee Crooks(ex city right back) was on Facebook calling for the borders to be closed and for mass deportations
Do you think he reflects on the error of his post? Probably not, probably waiting for the next tragedy so he and the likes of him can spout the same rubbish
NB - these close the border people never explain how we would get food into the country or people back from holiday etc
Hmm it’s hard to control Social Media particularly when posts can be sent from anywhere around the world. I am as guilty as the next person for scrolling through the internet when I have seen a report on TV who are holding back on showing film or not naming someone. They even say “reports on social media but we are not repeating them here”. My issue with the legal process is politicians of all persuasion hide behind it and bat the problem in to the long grass so when the truth eventually comes out most of us had forgotten about it.I agree mate! Should come out instantly. But the legal process should not bend to suit the needs of 'trial by social media' or just to combat misinformation. The authorities have a protocol for releasing info for a reason. I guess the government needs to come down much harder on social media misinformation...
I don’t do that, and agree that people deploy that approach too readily, and as I said I rarely do it, but when presented with a statistic that is contrary to your lived experience it’s perfectly normal to question it.