Israel strikes again!!!

Prestwich_Blue said:
blueonblue said:
If a c*nt in a tank rolled up outside your house, and informed you this is now his country and you must leave, your house has been in your family since the year dot and their is no legal dispute this is your home..........they have a tank, thats it.........how long would you fight on to get it back?, would you expect your kids to do the same?.

For me the answer is easiy........YES, this nazi state was created by stealing the land and kicking the rightfull owners out, they have been made refugee`s, hearded into ghettos, and just plain murdered while the world just watches.
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What a complete load of fuckwittery. Do you even understand the history?

In 1948, the UN voted to partition the former British mandate. The Jews accepted and formed Israel whereas the Arabs didn't and attacked it. If they'd won, there's little doubt the Arabs would have massacred virtually every Jew they found. In that sort of environment it is quite understandable (although maybe not right) that there was a reaction. However, today there are many Israeli Arabs (Muslim & Christian) living quite happily in the borders of Israel.

Do you know that in 1948 and afterwards, over 750,000 Jews in Arab countries were forcibly kicked out of places like Morocco, Egypt, Syria, Yemen, Iraq & Iran where they had lived for hundreds or even thousands off years? Are they in refugee camps 60 years on?

There's a lot wrong with the situation in the Middle East on both sides. The settlements are illegal but so is firing rockets at civilians.
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Right,there's the Zionist propaganda from Prestwich (big surprise!),now here for the sake of balance is some more information.

In 1948,shortly after the embryonic UN gave 56% of Palestine to the largely immigrant Jewish population,the Zionist forces drove out most of the indigenous Palestinians and took 78% of the land!! They razed to the ground over 400 Palestinian villages,so the refugees could not return . In 1967 they occupied the rest of Palestine, including Gaza, and began to settle their citizens in these areas, in contravention of the Fourth Geneva Convention. In 2002 they began the construction of the 400-mile long barrier, largely on Palestinian land, using it to take land and water resources from what is left of the West Bank.

The centres of population in the West Bank have been isolated into ghetto-like enclaves, surrounded by the Israeli army and illegal settlements. Many methods are being used to drive Palestinians out of the their homes in East Jerusalem, which Israel has annexed, in contravention of international law.

Israel is in violation of over 60 UN Resolutions, which call for the return of refugees, withdrawal of the settlers, dismantling of the wall and a lifting of the siege on Gaza.

Prestwich is right when he says that Palestine didn't exist as a country or state as we know it when the Israel was formed,but the people still lived there,it was still their land!! Its just the same as the White invasion of Australia or America!

One last thing. The French resistance of the Second World War are regarded as heroes of a just and noble cause,what the hell is the difference between them and the Palestinian resistance!!
 
scottyboi said:
Can we not just take over it again I fancy getting dressed up.
Templars.jpg
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As far as i'm aware, there isnt any oil there so answer to your question...no...it will never happen.
 
pinkwheeltrim said:
Prestwich_Blue said:
What a complete load of fuckwittery. Do you even understand the history?

In 1948, the UN voted to partition the former British mandate. The Jews accepted and formed Israel whereas the Arabs didn't and attacked it. If they'd won, there's little doubt the Arabs would have massacred virtually every Jew they found. In that sort of environment it is quite understandable (although maybe not right) that there was a reaction. However, today there are many Israeli Arabs (Muslim & Christian) living quite happily in the borders of Israel.

Do you know that in 1948 and afterwards, over 750,000 Jews in Arab countries were forcibly kicked out of places like Morocco, Egypt, Syria, Yemen, Iraq & Iran where they had lived for hundreds or even thousands off years? Are they in refugee camps 60 years on?

There's a lot wrong with the situation in the Middle East on both sides. The settlements are illegal but so is firing rockets at civilians.
Click to expand...

Right,there's the Zionist propaganda from Prestwich (big surprise!),now here for the sake of balance is some more information.

In 1948,shortly after the embryonic UN gave 56% of Palestine to the largely immigrant Jewish population,the Zionist forces drove out most of the indigenous Palestinians and took 78% of the land!! They razed to the ground over 400 Palestinian villages,so the refugees could not return . In 1967 they occupied the rest of Palestine, including Gaza, and began to settle their citizens in these areas, in contravention of the Fourth Geneva Convention. In 2002 they began the construction of the 400-mile long barrier, largely on Palestinian land, using it to take land and water resources from what is left of the West Bank.

The centres of population in the West Bank have been isolated into ghetto-like enclaves, surrounded by the Israeli army and illegal settlements. Many methods are being used to drive Palestinians out of the their homes in East Jerusalem, which Israel has annexed, in contravention of international law.

Israel is in violation of over 60 UN Resolutions, which call for the return of refugees, withdrawal of the settlers, dismantling of the wall and a lifting of the siege on Gaza.

Prestwich is right when he says that Palestine didn't exist as a country or state as we know it when the Israel was formed,but the people still lived there,it was still their land!! Its just the same as the White invasion of Australia or America!

One last thing. The French resistance of the Second World War are regarded as heroes of a just and noble cause,what the hell is the difference between them and the Palestinian resistance!!
Click to expand...

One last thing. The French resistance of the Second World War are regarded as heroes of a just and noble cause,what the hell is the difference between them and the Palestinian resistance
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The main difference is the French resistance wasn't funded by Germany or Japan,the Vichy regime would have been a far better comparison seeing as the "Palestinian resistance"is really just a tool used by Syria, Iran etc.
I wonder which fuckin idiot will be the 1st to mention oil ?this thread seems to be going that way.
 
So your trying to say Isreal=good, Palestine=bad. Thanks for clearing that up. Poor little Isreal, and heres me thinking both Isreal & Palestine were full of c*nts - how wrong I was.<br /><br />-- Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:27 pm --<br /><br />So your trying to say Isreal=good, Palestine=bad. Thanks for clearing that up. Poor little Isreal, and heres me thinking both Isreal & Palestine were full of c*nts - how wrong I was.
 
Helmet Cole said:
So your trying to say Isreal=good, Palestine=bad. Thanks for clearing that up. Poor little Isreal, and heres me thinking both Isreal & Palestine were full of c*nts - how wrong I was.

-- Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:27 pm --

So your trying to say Isreal=good, Palestine=bad. Thanks for clearing that up. Poor little Isreal, and heres me thinking both Isreal & Palestine were full of c*nts - how wrong I was.
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Helmut! sort your fookin quoting out,it makes even less sense than your posts usually do:)
 
Cheesy said:
Terrible.

However, I have to wonder why there isn't the same outrage from some when Hamas fires rockets in to Israel (this strike was in response to just such an action).
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Agent provocateur perhaps?<br /><br />-- Fri Apr 02, 2010 7:37 pm --<br /><br />.[/quote]

Right,there's the Zionist propaganda from Prestwich (big surprise!),now here for the sake of balance is some more information.

In 1948,shortly after the embryonic UN gave 56% of Palestine to the largely immigrant Jewish population,the Zionist forces drove out most of the indigenous Palestinians and took 78% of the land!! They razed to the ground over 400 Palestinian villages,so the refugees could not return . In 1967 they occupied the rest of Palestine, including Gaza, and began to settle their citizens in these areas, in contravention of the Fourth Geneva Convention. In 2002 they began the construction of the 400-mile long barrier, largely on Palestinian land, using it to take land and water resources from what is left of the West Bank.

The centres of population in the West Bank have been isolated into ghetto-like enclaves, surrounded by the Israeli army and illegal settlements. Many methods are being used to drive Palestinians out of the their homes in East Jerusalem, which Israel has annexed, in contravention of international law.

Israel is in violation of over 60 UN Resolutions, which call for the return of refugees, withdrawal of the settlers, dismantling of the wall and a lifting of the siege on Gaza.

Prestwich is right when he says that Palestine didn't exist as a country or state as we know it when the Israel was formed,but the people still lived there,it was still their land!! Its just the same as the White invasion of Australia or America!

Bravo Wheeltrim, well said mate.
 
pinkwheeltrim said:
Prestwich_Blue said:
What a complete load of fuckwittery. Do you even understand the history?

In 1948, the UN voted to partition the former British mandate. The Jews accepted and formed Israel whereas the Arabs didn't and attacked it. If they'd won, there's little doubt the Arabs would have massacred virtually every Jew they found. In that sort of environment it is quite understandable (although maybe not right) that there was a reaction. However, today there are many Israeli Arabs (Muslim & Christian) living quite happily in the borders of Israel.

Do you know that in 1948 and afterwards, over 750,000 Jews in Arab countries were forcibly kicked out of places like Morocco, Egypt, Syria, Yemen, Iraq & Iran where they had lived for hundreds or even thousands off years? Are they in refugee camps 60 years on?

There's a lot wrong with the situation in the Middle East on both sides. The settlements are illegal but so is firing rockets at civilians.
Click to expand...

Right,there's the Zionist propaganda from Prestwich (big surprise!),now here for the sake of balance is some more information.

In 1948,shortly after the embryonic UN gave 56% of Palestine to the largely immigrant Jewish population,the Zionist forces drove out most of the indigenous Palestinians and took 78% of the land!! They razed to the ground over 400 Palestinian villages,so the refugees could not return . In 1967 they occupied the rest of Palestine, including Gaza, and began to settle their citizens in these areas, in contravention of the Fourth Geneva Convention. In 2002 they began the construction of the 400-mile long barrier, largely on Palestinian land, using it to take land and water resources from what is left of the West Bank.

The centres of population in the West Bank have been isolated into ghetto-like enclaves, surrounded by the Israeli army and illegal settlements. Many methods are being used to drive Palestinians out of the their homes in East Jerusalem, which Israel has annexed, in contravention of international law.

Israel is in violation of over 60 UN Resolutions, which call for the return of refugees, withdrawal of the settlers, dismantling of the wall and a lifting of the siege on Gaza.

Prestwich is right when he says that Palestine didn't exist as a country or state as we know it when the Israel was formed,but the people still lived there,it was still their land!! Its just the same as the White invasion of Australia or America!

One last thing. The French resistance of the Second World War are regarded as heroes of a just and noble cause,what the hell is the difference between them and the Palestinian resistance!!
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pinkwheeltrim : Only one word to say to you after that.....Respect.

Gratifying that some can actually see past the rhetoric.
 
Skashion said:
Prestwich_Blue said:
My solution would be a step-by-step approach.

I guess it needs a carrot and stick approach.

A ceasefire for 6 months and the stopping of settlement building which, if successful, would lead to some opening of borders. The situation in the West Bank is supposedly easing somewhat which shows that things, however little, can be achieved.

Then, if that was successful, further relaxation of movement controls and aid for Gaza, particularly, with Israeli bulldozers building things instead of demolishing them.

Then an agremeent on a land-swap.
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I see no reason in there why Israel would make those concessions. You may assume that Israel wants peace, but I certainly don't. I think they're content enough with the status quo. However, for the sake of debate, let's assume worse-case scenario and say that the Israelis (by which I mean the Israeli government), and especially the right-wing government currently in office, don't want to make peace. How can it be forced to make peace? What cards can be played so that Israel can be enticed to make peace? I really think that is the crux of the matter. It is often thought that the US could use its position as a supplier of aid and arms to Israel but I think that's bullshit. There is too much domestic support in the US for Israel to allow a US government to restrain Israel for too long. Again, for the sake of debate, let's assume this is also true (and it's not hard to prove). What else is there which can force Israel's hand?
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It appears as though you've fallen into the trap of thinking that the conflict can be resolved simply by getting Israel to change its approach. It can't.

You also need to ask the question of how you can persuade Hamas to give up their stated aim of wiping Israel off the map.
 
pinkwheeltrim said:
Right,there's the Zionist propaganda from Prestwich (big surprise!),now here for the sake of balance is some more information.

In 1948,shortly after the embryonic UN gave 56% of Palestine to the largely immigrant Jewish population,the Zionist forces drove out most of the indigenous Palestinians and took 78% of the land!! They razed to the ground over 400 Palestinian villages,so the refugees could not return . In 1967 they occupied the rest of Palestine, including Gaza, and began to settle their citizens in these areas, in contravention of the Fourth Geneva Convention. In 2002 they began the construction of the 400-mile long barrier, largely on Palestinian land, using it to take land and water resources from what is left of the West Bank.

The centres of population in the West Bank have been isolated into ghetto-like enclaves, surrounded by the Israeli army and illegal settlements. Many methods are being used to drive Palestinians out of the their homes in East Jerusalem, which Israel has annexed, in contravention of international law.

Israel is in violation of over 60 UN Resolutions, which call for the return of refugees, withdrawal of the settlers, dismantling of the wall and a lifting of the siege on Gaza.

Prestwich is right when he says that Palestine didn't exist as a country or state as we know it when the Israel was formed,but the people still lived there,it was still their land!! Its just the same as the White invasion of Australia or America!

One last thing. The French resistance of the Second World War are regarded as heroes of a just and noble cause,what the hell is the difference between them and the Palestinian resistance!!
Click to expand...
If we're talking about balance then at least give the full picture.

In May 1948, the newly declared state of Israel was attacked by a number of regualr Arab armies. Naturally it defended itself. The partition plan offered the Arabs much more than would ever get now yet they rejected it and decided they could wipe out the newly formed state. They couldn't and in the process lost some of the territory they would have had. Whose fault was that?

Was the driving of refugees out of their villages right and the massacre of Deir Yassin right? No it wasn't.
Was the massacre of Jews by Arab forces right? No it wasn't.
Was the driving out of Jews from Arab countries they'd lived in for hundreds of years right or fair? No it wasn't.
Was the settlement of occupied territories right? No it wasn't.

Why was the barrier constructed? To end the wave of suicide bomb attacks of the Second Intifada. No attacks, no barrier.

There is right and wrong on both sides but some people only see it one way.
 
Only to be expected from the Zionist wankers

hate their genocidal guts

Nazi doctrine from those that suffered so badly from nazism

Dangerous beyond reason ,the only country that dares stand up to the USA
 
Agendas :-(

I find it disturbing & disappointing that so many views on the Middle east are coloured by blatant anti-Islam & anti-Semitic views.
 
Inside job and we are being set up for the mother of all wars. Oh i, Israel, stop yer' bullying please.
 
Cheesy said:
Skashion said:
I see no reason in there why Israel would make those concessions. You may assume that Israel wants peace, but I certainly don't. I think they're content enough with the status quo. However, for the sake of debate, let's assume worse-case scenario and say that the Israelis (by which I mean the Israeli government), and especially the right-wing government currently in office, don't want to make peace. How can it be forced to make peace? What cards can be played so that Israel can be enticed to make peace? I really think that is the crux of the matter. It is often thought that the US could use its position as a supplier of aid and arms to Israel but I think that's bullshit. There is too much domestic support in the US for Israel to allow a US government to restrain Israel for too long. Again, for the sake of debate, let's assume this is also true (and it's not hard to prove). What else is there which can force Israel's hand?
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It appears as though you've fallen into the trap of thinking that the conflict can be resolved simply by getting Israel to change its approach. It can't.

You also need to ask the question of how you can persuade Hamas to give up their stated aim of wiping Israel off the map.
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I've not fallen into any trap at all. OK, we'll make another assumption just to make it absolutely clear there isn't a 'trap'. Imagine there's no Hamas, no Hezbollah, no intifadas. Nada. Now, answer the question. How do you get Israel to make concessions? My answer: You can't right now. The status quo is preferable, and one in which there is no 'terrorism' would be even more so. What's your answer. I'm fairly sure of why you're avoiding this question. Prove me wrong.
 
If there were no Hamas or Hezbollah then the right wing in Israel would have far fewer excuses not to make peace.

Could you force it? Possibly not but you only have to look at Northern Ireland to see that things can change if people genuinely want it to.
 
Cheesy said:
Agendas :-(

I find it disturbing & disappointing that so many views on the Middle east are coloured by blatant anti-Islam & anti-Semitic views.
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I'm openly anti-Islam.
I detest anti-Semitism.

And yet I think it is clear that the onus is on the Israeli Government to stop stealing land and to give stolen land back.

How is my view coloured? Or is my view one of those that is not?

I ask because I do not want to be labelled something, even indirectly, that I am not.
 
ElanJo said:
Cheesy said:
Agendas :-(

I find it disturbing & disappointing that so many views on the Middle east are coloured by blatant anti-Islam & anti-Semitic views.
Click to expand...


I'm openly anti-Islam.
I detest anti-Semitism.

And yet I think it is clear that the onus is on the Israeli Government to stop stealing land and to give stolen land back.
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But what do you mean by stolen land - the settlements? They will be part of a negotiations which will involve giving up equivalent land elsewhere. Or do you mean something else?

And do you not think that an equal onus might be on Hamas to stop firing rockets?
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
If there were no Hamas or Hezbollah then the right wing in Israel would have far fewer excuses not to make peace.

Could you force it? Possibly not but you only have to look at Northern Ireland to see that things can change if people genuinely want it to.
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Make peace? But if there is no 'terrorism' then there would already be peace for the Israelis. So there would be no incentive to give the Palestinians anything at all. Any concessions would have to be motivated by altruism. Game theory makes no such allowances.

True, but tell me how that situation might be achieved. Right now, it's so far from being the case it's untrue. I'd dare say that it's further away from that point than it's ever been.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
If there were no Hamas or Hezbollah then the right wing in Israel would have far fewer excuses not to make peace.

Could you force it? Possibly not but you only have to look at Northern Ireland to see that things can change if people genuinely want it to.
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NI still has dissedant Republicans and staunch loyalists. Hamas claims to be cracking down on the hardliners-the ones firing the rockets.
Obama is not giving Israel the free ride that Bush gave, as he is not on the right wing of US politics and therefore not relying on the US Jewish vote.
Unfortunately the US Right Wing has sponsored Israel for that precious vote.
Nothing to do with right or wrong, peace or war (although war is a great money earner).
What the answer is? Really don't know. Macdonalds all round?
 
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